General Rogue One News/Speculation/SPOILER Thread - Part 3

Discussion in 'Rogue One: A Star Wars Story' started by Thread Manager, Aug 12, 2016.

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  1. KRYPTON INC. Incorporated Kryptonian

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    I know it's EU stuff but I remember that it was said in a post Thrawn trilogy novel that the Empire had built a "beta" version of the DS, essentially a prototype that was a shell with the planet destroyer laser cannon but not much else. It always bothered me that they showed the Empire already creating the DS in ROTS. It is a huge creation but it took from ROTS to ANH to complete it and in all that time it was kept secret? This is one time I prefer the EU explanation. They had to test and build beta prototypes on a slightly smaller scale and then actually stated construction of the finished version much later, getting closer to ANH.
     
  2. KRYPTON INC. Incorporated Kryptonian

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    My two fave lines are that one and Cassian's about few fighting like many. Chills.
     
  3. DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    Maybe they simply failed the first attempt, which is why they needed Papa Jyn?
     
  4. Solidus Knights of Ren

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    Well I've been out the whole day, but I do have thoughts on the trailer and what some of the reactions are.

    This trailer is the first one where I really felt like this was a different type of Star Wars movie. I mean this actually felt way darker then the other two. Which even though it's sad that Hollywood Reporter is going with fan flamed rumors of massive tonal change to get some clicks, I just don't think they understand character development. It's about those that rise up from the terrible life of the Empire and start to really rebel, and are the first to have a massive success (as said in the IV opening crawl).

    But after a friend and I talked for a bit it was interesting with some of the comments about this lacking the magic of TFA. It's not "nostalgia" since this has a lot of familiar imaginary as well. But the main franchise is really about the spiritual conflict between dark and light. The Force is a main character in those films. This is the first SW film that it's clear it's not the main focus, it's about every day people standing up. So I agree it is missing the magic but in a literal sense. The magic in Star Wars is something unique and beyond just the aesthetics, and that is what TFA tapped into and successfully so. But yeah this one seems to be doing something different but not in a bad way.

    But I did enjoy this trailer much more than the second trailer. This one really felt different, now if it will be good or not is another thing. But honestly the only thing I'm seeing out of these reshoots is some more character moments. Really THR kind of dropped the ball due to the fact that Mads was her father and we knew that way before the reshoots. But to me this trailer really seemed to have much better acting.

    But yeah my thoughts are this really is showing that the Anthology films are experimenting reaching out into new genres. Exciting. I still think at worst this film will be a pretty good film, but I'm still hoping it will be great.
     
  5. KRYPTON INC. Incorporated Kryptonian

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    That makes sense and I would be on board with a scene intimating that or outright showing it. Say Mads is shown on a Star Destroyer being brought to the construction space. There's a huge debris field they pas by. He asks what that is and he's told that was the first or second version that exploded when they tested out the main laser.
     
  6. DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    Considering Galen and Krennic know each other, I wonder what are the chances Galen has worked on the Death Star before he is taken. Perhaps his leaving could be why it has stalled and taken so long?
     
  7. MaceB Registered

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    No, they already were revealed. The Geonotians originally designed the Death Star. That was made clear in the canon of Episode II. If you're saying that Rogue 1 will change that origin, and no one will care... that might be true. But if it has the dad as the master designer who made it from scratch, then that's a change in the continuity of DS1's origin, regardless of how much the audience cares.

    Sure, all of those sources are canon; agreed. But if you are making a multi million dollar movie, would you really be content to change the continuity (as a large portion of viewers would have to see it, since they didn't read that literature) and hope that the audience just goes with it? There's no reason to ignore Geonosis... they can very easily add to it with one line. Ignoring Episode II in favor of a "better" origin seems lazy to me. I'll live with it, but I'd be scratching my head as to why they felt they needed to go that way.

    Because as of now, they didn't have a little to do with it. They designed the whole thing, as far as we know. It's not like I'm rooting for Genosis to make a come back or I'm a fan of that particular planet or species... I'm just saying that having the Dad as the master creator is a breach in continuity as we know it. It ought to be explained because of that. All I'm arguing for is a line of fill in dialogue instead of ignoring what we all saw in Episode II. It's a simple question: If the Geonosis plans were made in Episode II and brought to construction in Episode III, then how does this character fit in? It's a totally reasonable question.

    That's my point exactly. Obviously I know that building is different than designing. So is this character a contractor? Is he a master builder of sorts? Is he a master mind scientist who added on the Death Beam? I dunno. I'm bringing it up, because it's a question posed by the films now, and it's something we don't know. It's worth discussion and speculation on a discussion and speculation forum is all I'm saying. They have a choice: either make a better origin for DS1, or use the origin as it was told in Episode II, and build off it.

    Yeah, but why would they want to? Wouldn't it be easier to lean on the canon at this point rather than to refute it? We saw that the Geonotians designed the master plans. We saw that it began construction at the end of Episode III. So just add some dialogue that says, "it's nearly complete, but the Geonotians never could figure out _______, that's why we need you." That's much cleaner and more consistent than asserting he's the master designer... which is sort of what the trailer pushes us to think, but who knows how it turns up. They can bring up Geonosis or they can ignore Geonosis. I hope they do bring them up though, for no other reason than to maintain the saga's consistency whenever it's easy to do so.
     
  8. Roose Bolton Son of Katas

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    The Geonosians created the design of a battle station the size of a small moon, but it was Galen who discovered the use of Kyber crystals as a power source. According to Pablo Hidalgo the Death Star itself was working for a while, but not the actual main weapon. That only came about because Space!Robert Oppenheimer discovered the GFFA equvilant to nuclear power.
     
  9. KRYPTON INC. Incorporated Kryptonian

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    I actually am wondering if Galen discovered the exhaust port weakness or did he deliberately put that in the design?
     
  10. Marvolo Registered

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    The only thing Episode 2 showed was that the geonosians had plans for the death star and handed them to Dooku. The film says absolutely nothing about whether the plans were entirely theirs. Whether it was a concept or an actual detailed plan. Or whether they even knew that the concept would work. Just because the Geonosians had some plans doesnt mean all the design, te st ing, trial and error and implementation is also done.

    Also based on Rebels the Empire or something did something to all the Geonosians so its entirely possible that the Empire didn't have or want the Geonosians to build it. If thats the case the Empire would have needed its own work force and engineers to turn the plans into a working functioning death star. And that is entirely in line with the established xenophobic nature of Palpatine's Empire.

    And last I heard Jyn's father designed and made the weapon apparatus possible. That is his role in its construction. Without the weapon its just a giant mobile base. That is why Jyns father is so crucial to the Empire and the Death Star.
     
  11. Solidus Knights of Ren

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    Yeah I remember Pablo talking about that.
     
  12. Roose Bolton Son of Katas

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    There's a line in the novel Bloodline set a few years before TFA where people speculate that the Death Star's destruction was the work of an inside man. Could be that Galen had a hand in it.
     
  13. Solidus Knights of Ren

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    Yeah didn't they think the exhaust port was designed in there by someone on the inside to give it a weakness.
     
  14. MaceB Registered

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    So you'd be happy if Rogue 1 posited that this guy was the master designer and just ignored mentioning the Geonoisan plans altogether? Wouldn't that be making it harder on themselves for no reason?
    I mean, I agree with everything you just said. Lots of logical explanations for not using the plans in Episode II. I just think that a simple explanation would be nice instead of making us as audience viewers assume one of those explanations for ourselves.
     
  15. Solidus Knights of Ren

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    I'm also thinking that Rogue One: Catalyst will go heavy into all of this.
     
  16. Roose Bolton Son of Katas

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    Yeah, they didn't think that the likes of Tarkin and co would knowingly allow such a flaw to exist.
     
  17. MaceB Registered

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    That's perfect! Just make him the one who weaponizes DS1. That's a great way to go in my opinion. I'm assuming they'll explain it that way, and they don't need to mention Geonosis at all. Win Win.
     
  18. DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    It is impossible to change the origin of something that was never set in stone. You say it like 23 years didn't pass from Aotc and Star Wars, where they clearly didn't finish the space station. Who said he made it from scratch? He is responsible for the construction of it somehow. Why that is, we do not know.

    Also why bring up the audience caring if it doesn't matter if they care?

    They aren't changing continuity, they are creating it for something that ha no canon answer yet. Who was responsible for the construction of the Death Star.

    And yes there are obvious reasons to avoid the prequels. They are divisive, with AotC being the lowest grossing Star Wars movie by a lot. It is why they separated the ST from the prequels, but not the OT.

    No we know they had the plans in AotC. Then we know it took them 23 years to make it. If anything they could have been crap that someone else had to fix.

    Whether they mention Geonosis or not, I have no idea. But there is no actual reason they have to. Nothing is breached in continuity if they say they need Galen to help build the Death Star because they can't figure it out. Are the Emperor and Vader not Sith because it is never mentioned in the OT? Of course not. They weren't mentioned in Star Wars by Tarkin, is that a continuity error? Of course not.

    Actually you are kind of complaining about the Geonosis not getting some due you think they are owned. Which is odd imo.

    Why is any of this necessary? Explain why you have to hear that word or continuity is messed with? You are mixing up your person preference with continuity.
     
  19. Solidus Knights of Ren

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    Yeah I remember that. I could see Galen act as if its a necessary component for the weapon, but in reality is there for a reason.
     
  20. Broseph44 Witness Me

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    MaceB you're way too concerned over nothing haha
     
  21. DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    Oh I love this a lot.

    Who are all these audience viewers who will thinking about this?
     
  22. DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    This makes sense. At first I thought they might have just hide it, but they have the trench, which is heavily protected. So he probably has to get them to put the weakness in for some reason.
     
  23. Broseph44 Witness Me

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    I started Bloodline recently. 4 chapters in.
     
  24. Roose Bolton Son of Katas

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    It's very good, both in terms of Leia's character arc and the way they set up political state of the ST and the New Republic.
     
  25. DarthSkywalker May the Force Be With You

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    Not enough Luke for me to read it. I will wait for someone to buy me the audio book for Christmas. It always happens. :funny:
     
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