Gotham Gotham Season 2, Episode 7 "Mommy's Little Monster"

[Kathemy]

In the episode "Selina Kyle," season 1, when she is arguing with the officer about being sent upstate, the officer tells her that aside from having outstanding warrants, she is 13 years old with no legal guardian.

Silver has already said she is looking for friends her own age, and I believe Galavan said the same.

Thank you! I had completely forgotten that line. Then we have something to go on.

Bruce then is 12 in the pilot, and Selina is 13 in season 1 episode 2. This means the absolute age difference can be either nothing, if we assume Bruce turned 13 directly after the pilot, or as much as two years if we assume Bruce was exactly 12 years old and Selina about to turn 14. Then the average difference is 1 year thus we can approximate a one year age difference.

Silver said she was looking for friends "her own age" but one year more or less certainly qualifies as "her own age", no?

Then we have Bruce attending preparatory school together with Silver. Now either we have to assume that they both skipped classes and thus they are both thirteen when there is no information of this, or that preparatory school doesn't mean what it means in the United States, or Bruce and Silver are both at least 14 years old or Silver is one year older.

I think the likely explanation here on-screen is that we can't go with the actors' age and claim a "two-year age difference" between Bruce and Selina but it's also canon that Selina is older.

I concede that I was wrong since it is evident there was information about Selina's age in years in the second episode.

 

[ThePhantasm]

Again, prep school doesn't necessarily mean high schooler. The term includes U.S. "day schools" which can be for children or high schoolers.

Bruce is likely still 12 (I doubt they'd skip his first birthday apart from his parents), and Selina is 13. Silver is probably 12-13 as well.

 

[Kathemy]

We will get this information if they ever decide to acknowledge any of his birthdays, or if they actually state his age. Until that point there is no way we can reasonably know where we are at right now.

 

[ThePhantasm]

Bruce is 12 in season 1, and season 2 takes place a month later. That seems pretty "reasonable" to me.

 

[Kathemy]

Bruce is 12 in season 1, and season 2 takes place a month later. That seems pretty "reasonable" to me.

Again, stop being dishonest. I acknowledge my mistakes. You don't.

Season two takes place one month after Bruce finds the Batcave. It doesn't take place one month after the pilot and there is no way to determine how much time has gone by between each episode, except that Bruce tells Selina he hasn't seen her in a month in episode seven of season two, which means one month has passed over the episodes 4 through 6.

 

[ThePhantasm]

How is anything I said dishonest? There's no indication that whole months are occurring between episodes... many of them end on cliffhangers or teasers that segue into the next one. All we can go off of is what we know... Bruce is 12 in season 1, and season 2 is one month later. Unless the show tells us otherwise, our default position should be that Bruce is still 12, and Selina is still 13.

You're being unnecessarily obtuse about this.

 

[Kathemy]

No, Bruce is twelve years old in the pilot, and Selina is thirteen years old in the second episode.

What you said was that he was "twelve years in the pilot and season two takes place one month later" which makes it sound as if he's one month older in season two than in the pilot which clearly has to be wrong.

The show actually did give us an indication that one month had passed between the end of episode 3 and where Bruce meets Selina in episode 7. At this point we actually do not know their exact age. I actually just tweeted to the Gotham writers in hopes we might get clarification but I don't hold my breath I'll get an answer.

EDIT: I found this post in the Bruce age thread that helps (thanks ALittlePush) and it seems we're just really mirroring the conversation here so I guess I am being silly:

That's a good point about Penguin being an umbrella boy "a year ago" which in turn would actually shift Bruce's age to a more stable 13 rather than 12 but I don't think he's quite 14 yet.

We know Thomas wrote the letter when Bruce was 12.

Penguin was an umbrella boy "a year ago" in season 2

There is a one month gap between the end of season 1 and the beginning of season 2.

So if season 1 more or less covers a year then Bruce would be at least 13 currently approaching 14 but not 14 yet.

My reasons for thinking this are:

1. The letter would be more poignant if it was one of the last things Thomas wrote instead of being written a year before his death.

2. Bruce's first birthday after his parents' murder would be a meaningful one and it would be foolish not to show that onscreen (though it was foolish to kill off Jerome but the show went there).

3. Penguin's "a year ago" could refer to a general timeframe rather than a specific "12 months ago to the day I was Fish's umbrella boy" eg if you were in March 2016 and something happened in September 2015, you'd say whatever occurred happened "last year". If something happened 11 months ago, it would still be classed as "a year ago"

The question is how far into being 12 was Bruce when his parents were murdered? He's definitely 13 given Penguin's "a year ago" but had he just turned 13 at the time of the murder hence why there is no reference of Bruce's birthday in which case he would very well be approaching 14, or was he, for example, 12 years 9 months at the time of the murders so he's still in the 13 bracket because that would add up to "a year ago".

I'm taking this to the "age" thread because it's not so relevant to this episode discussion.

 

[Silly Cat]

Why is everyone so up in arms about Bruce's age...because they had him kissing Silver?

He's what 12-13 years old? Sounds believable to me....that's the age when you start experimenting with flirting and kissing! Your body starts changing and your hormones start changing with it...have you forgotten what it's like to be a preteen?

Well I haven't, and I remember (as a girl) boys were all most of my friends talked about at that age. Sure you are still naive about a lot of things at that age, but those feelings and desires are starting to develop.

 

[Kathemy]

Why is everyone so up in arms about Bruce's age...because they had him kissing Silver?

He's what 12-13 years old? Sounds believable to me....that's the age when you start experimenting with flirting and kissing! Your body starts changing and your hormones start changing with it...have you forgotten what it's like to be a preteen?

Well I haven't, and I remember (as a girl) boys were all most of my friends talked about at that age. Sure you are still naive about a lot of things at that age, but those feelings and desires are starting to develop.

Yeah, that's sort of exactly my point, but people seem to go out of their way to downgrade his age as far as they can just so they can feel horrified about it. Not that it would be unbelievable anyway. I had my first kiss at age 9.

 

[Micromind]

Bruce doesn't look like a 12 year old to me, he looks like a 14 year old, similarly, I cannot believe that some think that Selina and Silver are supposed to be 13 year old in the episode, they look at least 15 to me. (notwithstanding what the story tellers are saying about their ages.)

 

[Taarna]

Gordon needs to learn to play things close to the vest. I dont know if it was wise telling Galavan "I'm coming after you" now that he's in control of Gotham. He shouldve played it cool.

I think both men knew they were at odds after Butch relieved that Galavan was up to and the Penguin also corroborated the story.

Galavan used Gordon's endorsement to win an election. TOO LATE!

It's just Gordon's style to say I'm coming after you! And he might need to as his strike team is quickly thinning out.

In terms of Bruce age, he looks about 14 to me.

I love the Riddler, and think he might even help out Gordon or force his hand the future.

 

[Taarna]

So we're basically just going to ignore the only concrete information we have, which is the exact age of the actors, just so we can pretend to be more horrified about them dating?

Camren Bicondova was born May 22nd, 1999. Natalie Alyn Lind was born June 21st, 2000. David Mazouz was born Feb 19th, 2001. That makes them sixteen, fifteen and fourteen years old respectively.

YES!

But keep in mind what we see is likely 6-12 months before their actual age because that is when it was filmed.

I do think they should mention Bruce's age. If he's 14 now, he might very well grow 4-8 " by 2017!

I entered high school at age 14 at 5'4" tall, and graduated at 18 at 6'1" tall.

 

[Kathemy]

Several people have been asking whether the producers are aware of how tall David is supposed to grow. I know you can test for this, somehow.

 

[LostSon88]

Stuff like that is exactly why fanboys are commonly frowned upon...

I seriously doubt the producers will go as far as testing him to determine how tall he will grow up to be for the sake of continuity. To call that obsessive is an understatement.

 

[FeedOnATreeFrog]

Just catching up on this show recently, and this episode was legit awesome.

Also, all these comments about 12/13 year olds kissing are hilarious.

 

[Iceman]

Penguin should have had Zsasz with him when going to rescue his mother.

Also loving the transition of Nygma.