How was your reaction to how the Jean/Dark Phoenix was done?

[jimjam-06]

What do you call it if you're a world scale threat the first half of the movie and the other half do practically NOTHING?

And you call buildings, machines and loads of people exploding not world scale?

True, she held back for a little while but not for long

There was no firebird effect. I didn't buy her as Magneto's underling at all. I refuse to believe he was able to control and manipulate her.

Plus Wolverine and Jean Grey = bull****.

He never really controlled her, she just followed him because he recognised her as a goddess whose power should not be controlled

He manipulated her kind of, but did not control her

And Wolverine and Jean Grey worked from a movie scale
Jean Grey's emotions at what happened to Scott speak volumes of her love for Scott anyway

 

[AVP82]

I was a little disappointed.

Though the water effects during the entrances scene were kewl, Jean was nowhere to be seen until she stood in front of Cyclops. I wanted to see her coming out from the water or at least hover above the lake so we can see where she is coming from.

I also wanted the firebird!!!! How hard is it to put some flames around her?

However, Famke did a magnificent job portraying her, but I also wished she talked more. Every time she said something as Phoenix, I was in awe.

I could be wrong, but it seems like Xavier is referring to Phoenix as the dark side of Jean, and not "Dark Phoenix." I'm not sure it makes a difference, but just a thought that came to me.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

The concept of schizophrenia was great, the execution was beyond poor.

 

[Nathan]

And you call buildings, machine and loadsa people exploding not world scale?

You don't seem to get what I'm trying to say. First the Movie is all about Phoenix, how dangerous she is, that she must be controlled, stopped. But then she does nothing, she only stands around looking in the air. What is with her personality that's just pure joy, desire and rage? We see the desire at the infirmary, later all we see is rage. And after Xavier is dead it's zombie state.


Then, half a movie later, she freaks, destroys stuff and people, and just gets killed.

 

[jimjam-06]

The concept of schizophrenia was great, the execution was beyond poor.

i disagree

 

[Isildur´s Heir]

Crap

There wasn´t any drama in her, she was just bad, killed a lot of people, and died at the end.
She killed Xavier in the most pointless scene in the movie (cool, but pointless).
She didn´t felt any remorse for what she did, and the all "don´t let it control you" line that Xavier let out just before he died was stupid, because, when a line like is delivered, it´s mean for the character, either being strucked by it or have a inner strugle for control..you get neither, so, it was totally inconsequent.

So, you ask how was the Dark Phoenix saga handle?
What Phoenix Saga

 

[phantom47]

You don't seem to get what I'm trying to say. First the Movie is all about Phoenix, how dangerous she is, that she must be controlled, stopped. But then she does nothing, she only stands around looking in the air. What is with her personality that's just pure joy, desire and rage? We see the desire at the infirmary, later all we see is rage. And after Xavier is dead it's zombie state.


Then, half a movie later, she freaks, destroys stuff and people, and just gets killed.

the only time she had to unleash her rage was in five scenes

1. Cyclops at the Lake
2. Infirmary with Logan
3. Her House
4. Forest with the cure gun
5. Alcatraz

I think that was plenty; it showed how all these thing built up inside her mind and she just let it go at the end

 

[jimjam-06]

You don't seem to get what I'm trying to say. First the Movie is all about Phoenix, how dangerous she is, that she must be controlled, stopped. But then she does nothing, she only stands around looking in the air. What is with her personality that's just pure joy, desire and rage? We see the desire at the infirmary, later all we see is rage. And after Xavier is dead it's zombie state.


Then, half a movie later, she freaks, destroys stuff and people, and just gets killed.

I guess, but I just didn't really see it as a problem

 

[X-Maniac]

Crap

There wasn´t any drama in her, she was just bad, killed a lot of people, and died at the end.
She killed Xavier in the most pointless scene in the movie (cool, but pointless).
She didn´t felt any remorse for what she did, and the all "don´t let it control you" line that Xavier let out just before he died was stupid, because, when a line like is delivered, it´s mean for the character, either being strucked by it or have a inner strugle for control..you get neither, so, it was totally inconsequent.

So, you ask how was the Dark Phoenix saga handle?
What Phoenix Saga

Nonsense. We saw her inner struggle all the time. And, finally, she didn't let it control her - Jean reasserted control and let Wolverine kill her. She did exactly what Xavier said.

 

[liamoversion2]

She was wonderful for the scenes she was in and up until she killed Xavier, after that it was an absolute disgrace.

She just stood around for 45 minutes doing nothing! She had one single line after she killed Xavier. That's because nobody involved in the production, including the screenwriters, had the talent to express, understand or come up with any actual motivation that Jean may have had in this story. So what was their solution? Just make her mute for the rest of the movie, that's the easy way out! If she doesn't speak, then nobody knows what the heck she's supposed to be doing tagging along with Magneto and people can make up their own minds! That frees them of the responsibility of having to actually write a decent fecking screenplay!

In order to have a real relationship, characters need to have something called 'unity of opposites'. It's very basic screenwriting. Magneto and Jean have nothing of the sort holding them together.

That is not how to make a movie.

 

[Nathan]

I give up.

 

[phantom47]

I give up.

edit..misi nterpreted

 

[Nathan]

Oh shut it.

 

[AVP82]

Nonsense. We saw her inner struggle all the time. And, finally, she didn't let it control her - Jean reasserted control and let Wolverine kill her. She did exactly what Xavier said.

Jean will come back though!

That little stab by Wolverine didn't kill Mystique in X1, so Jean will be back...Anyone agree?

Though I admit that would be repetitive

 

[phantom47]

She was wonderful for the scenes she was in and up until she killed Xavier, after that it was an absolute disgrace.

She just stood around for 45 minutes doing nothing! She had one single line after she killed Xavier. That's because nobody involved in the production, including the screenwriters, had the talent to express, understand or come up with any actual motivation that Jean may have had in this story. So what was their solution? Just make her mute for the rest of the movie, that's the easy way out! If she doesn't speak, then nobody knows what the heck she's supposed to be doing tagging along with Magneto and people can make up their own minds! That frees them of the responsibility of having to actually write a decent fecking screenplay!

In order to have a real relationship, characters need to have something called 'unity of opposites'. It's very basic screenwriting. Magneto and Jean have nothing of the sort holding them together.

That is not how to make a movie.

Even though she was standing there, thats all she needed to do, everyone in the audience was captivated to her, her presence kept everyone wondering what she would do next, and the at alctraz it was unleahsed...it was a build up process

 

[ShadowBoxing]

the only time she had to unleash her rage was in five scenes

1. Cyclops at the Lake
2. Infirmary with Logan
3. Her House
4. Forest with the cure gun
5. Alcatraz

I think that was plenty; it showed how all these thing built up inside her mind and she just let it go at the end

But no buildup. She was far more wraithful at the house than she was in the woods. She just had hissy fits. We did not see scenes of her childhood (just a thought) where she was experiencing the Phoenix for the first time. If you read the Phoenix Saga, even disregarding the star and space stuff. There is a gradual build up. We see Scott lose his grip on a woman he loved. We see her mind slowly slip into madness. First she is controlling it, she is going out for little strolls and destroying things to ease the tension (in the comics case star systems--but okay). Then her phantasies (through the help of Wynguard) slowly become her reality until that line becomes fully blurred and she snaps. In this she just snaps and says okay Magneto "I'll go with you then". Magneto did not even have to carefully manipulate her, play with her emotions, it was just "and now she is crazy". So just displaying the power is not enough, you have to give it REASON. And replacing drama brought on by dialogue with character death is not ample reason. Also killing those characters and making that the reason took away her reason her stop, and therefore made for the deus Ex machina ending with Wolverine.

 

[phantom47]

Oh shut it.

Man I didnt mean it in a bad way...sorry about that

 

[WTFimVENOM]

I think that her Fx was ok since she was dark pheonix in the movie, but if they ever bring her back they should make her good and give her more phoenix-like powers

 

[Isildur´s Heir]

Nonsense. We saw her inner struggle all the time. And, finally, she didn't let it control her - Jean reasserted control and let Wolverine kill her. She did exactly what Xavier said.

No, we didn´t.
Tell one scene where the all inner struggle appears, and don´t tell me the one with Woilverine and Jean, because that´s the moment she lost it, and before the killing of Xavier.

For all i remember, right before Logan killed her, she asks him "Would you die for them?", which he replys, "Not, not for them, for you, i love you" and then he kills her.
She never reasserted control, but, if you are right and i´m wrong, it´s even more dumb that i thought, because, if she reasserted control because Logan said he loved her, it clearly shows that she didn´t loved Scott, because she killed him and never reasserted control because of it.

 

[X-Maniac]

She was wonderful for the scenes she was in and up until she killed Xavier, after that it was an absolute disgrace.

She just stood around for 45 minutes doing nothing! She had one single line after she killed Xavier. That's because nobody involved in the production, including the screenwriters, had the talent to express, understand or come up with any actual motivation that Jean may have had in this story. So what was their solution? Just make her mute for the rest of the movie, that's the easy way out! If she doesn't speak, then nobody knows what the heck she's supposed to be doing tagging along with Magneto and people can make up their own minds! That frees them of the responsibility of having to actually write a decent fecking screenplay!

In order to have a real relationship, characters need to have something called 'unity of opposites'. It's very basic screenwriting. Magneto and Jean have nothing of the sort holding them together.

That is not how to make a movie.

Nonsense. She killed the two people she loved most. She couldn't stay at the mansion. She had nowhere else to go, Magneto offered her some comfort after she killed Xavier. She was a confused, vulnerable woman and Magneto knew he couldn't provoke her (she showed with the cure gun that she could easily take him out). He only provoked her into action at the end. He obviously wanted much more of a war, the Alcatraz battle was just the start - but he was stopped. You can't expect to see any more within that movie, as Magneto's plan was halted and Jean's unstable power was also stopped.

We couldn't have had her flying around nuking cities and having stars as light snacks. Get out of fanboy mode and join the real world! You seem to want it all spelled out to you in big simple words; you just need to absorb it and think about it a little more. All the adults i saw it with knew exactly what was going on.

There's only one question you must answer: Are you an intelligent adult or not?

 

[phantom47]

But no buildup. She was far more wraithful at the house than she was in the woods. She just had hissy fits. We did not see scenes of her childhood (just a thought) where she was experiencing the Phoenix for the first time. If you read the Phoenix Saga, even disregarding the star and space stuff. There is a gradual build up. We see Scott lose his grip on a woman he loved. We see her mind slowly slip into madness. First she is controlling it, she is going out for little strolls and destroying things to ease the tension (in the comics case star systems--but okay). Then her phantasies (through the help of Wynguard) slowly become her reality until that line becomes fully blurred and she snaps. In this she just snaps and says okay Magneto "I'll go with you then". Magneto did not even have to carefully manipulate her, play with her emotions, it was just "and now she is crazy". So just displaying the power is not enough, you have to give it REASON. And replacing drama brought on by dialogue with character death is not ample reason.

I got that idea in the movie...and first we see cyclops losing the one he loves, he meets her at the lake and says she can control her powers now, and then loses it....because of what Xavier did to her, and Logan as well. Magneto manipulates her at her house and takes her, while she is still senseless to think on her own

 

[Tony Stark]

The concept of schizophrenia was great, the execution was beyond poor.

I agree 100%. They had all the elements there, but in the end Phoenix ended up being totally botched.

 

[co2]

Too many things about her character were disapointing. Her look (which for some reason was different than her look from the last film), her powers, her relegation to being just a sideplot. Where was she during Magento's attack? And how about the explanation of where the Phoenix persona came from. Xavier just says she previously had a suppressed evil personality? huh? We never heard anythign about that before and then...that's all the explanation we get. Getting rid of Scott, which would have added a lot of emotional depth was a major mistake in my opinion.

When I left the theater I felt disapointed. Now the more I think about this film, I am becoming irritated.

 

[Nathan]

She never reasserted control, but, if you are right and i´m wrong, it´s even more dumb that i thought, because, if she reasserted control because Logan said he loved her, it clearly shows that she didn´t loved Scott, because she killed him and never reasserted control because of it.

She did get back in control after he said "No, for you". Then she started to tear up and uttered "Save me".

 

[AVP82]

In order to have a real relationship, characters need to have something called 'unity of opposites'. It's very basic screenwriting. Magneto and Jean have nothing of the sort holding them together.

That is not how to make a movie.

But what about the forest scene in which Jean and Magneto interacted? That was really great. Magneto didn't see the "problem" that Xavier tried to warn him, (even with the cure darts aiming right at him) and in the end, Magneto regretted ever taking Phoenix along with him.

Magneto wanted powerful mutants to join him, but never realized that without that sense of control, that power would be lethal no matter what side you're on.