Justice League: News and Speculation - Part 10

Discussion in 'Justice League' started by Thread Manager, Apr 24, 2013.

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  1. shauner111 Registered

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    Chunks of Long Halloween were used in TDK and even Begins. I don't want to see a similar story with Harvey and the falcone's, etc. Been there done that. That would be fine DECADES from now when there's nothing left to do but adaptations. Then by all means, give the people a Dark Knight Returns straight from the comics or Year One, Long Halloween, Court Of Owls. But multiple decades have to pass, TDK was only 5 years ago.
     
  2. Great Mind(s) Broken

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    Why do a "Begins" esq origin for Superman just to throw a fully developed Batman fighting superfreaks all of a sudden out of nowhere? That would feel so unnatural and forced. Just because you didn't like TDKR doesn't mean the movie that hasn't even been out for a year should be rebooted. It's not gonna happen any time soon mark my words. NOBODY but a few fans who want a page-for-page adaptation of something like TLH (like yourself), want to see Harvey Dent argue with Maroni and become Two-Face again, less than 5 years from the last movie where that happened!

    You said before it's not the realism that matters anymore it's the story. Because you feel like Bruce's story is over at the end of TDKR. But you didn't like TDKR anyway from what you've said. So why not make TDKR BETTER by NOT making it the final story for that Bruce?

    Bruce never said at the end "I'm living with Selina in Italy for the rest of my life". He's learned to enjoy life but does that also mean leaving a rookie cop with absolutely no training or experience as a vigilante the reigns of Batman? He would HAVE to come back to train him even if they don't continue after TDKR you must retcon that into your head. It's the only way to justify Bruce's decision at the end as anything other than "F**k Gotham, let's see that kid make a fool out of himself on the news from our comfortable suite"
     
  3. Shikamaru Registered

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    He is at least coming to an earth with a Metropolis that does not look like any city in real life (as opposed to Gotham looking exactly like Chicago and Pittsburgh).

    -sigh-

    The difference between the realism in MOS and the realism in TDKT is that one....oh, forget it. Why should I even bother at this point repeating the same thing again? :sleepy:

    :lmao:

    Would you like me to list every single thing in First Class that screws up the continuity and doesn't match up with the other movies? Heck, it would be faster for me to list the things that don't mess with the rest of the universe's continuity since it would be a lot shorter.
     
    #128 Shikamaru, Apr 25, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2013
  4. Great Mind(s) Broken

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    Yeah you can't even name the difference in realism between TDK and MOS. Just give up dude. One is about a human one is about an alien. Ermergerd, that couldn't be... JUST LIKE IT IS IN THE COMICS?!
     
  5. FeedOnATreeFrog (A Metal Gear reference)

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    Saying that "WB should just use TDKT and Bale!" is moot when they might not have a choice. No one needs to argue that Bale coming back would be huge.

    I guess a better question is what they should do if Nolan closes off TDKT.


    Not being TDKT does not mean that it has to be 'comicy'. It's not a black and white choice. It can still be serious (sticking with what works), just different: a fresh directorial style (Fincher/Johnson vs Nolan), a even more badass suit, a new cast with a Batman who doesn't have an easily-ridiculed voice, awesome fight scenes, a new theme, new villains, and most importantly a new story.

    The problem with Amazing Spider-Man wasn't that it was too similar in tone (actually the tones are rather different), it's that it was too similar to Spider-Man 1 in story, with the origin, and that it went back to the beginning despite the last continuity not having a definitive ending (which TDKR did). I'm surprised TAS did as well as it did given these hurdles.
     
    #130 FeedOnATreeFrog, Apr 25, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2013
  6. Great Mind(s) Broken

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    Sigh. What is realistic about TDKR? Seriously? I wanna know one thing besides that Bruce grows a realistic beard.
     
  7. shauner111 Registered

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    I haven't seen a single thing about Metropolis that looks like it's not a city that could exist in real life. Yet there's moments in batman begins where it actually doesn't look that real. Metropolis was filmed in Chicago and so was TDK. We'll have to see wont we?

    Sigh all you want, I actually feel the same way you do after reading one of ur posts. Why should I bother explaining..
     
  8. Rodrigo90 Wink wink ;)

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    TDKR was exaggerated realism. Fantasy was twisted to fit realism. Which comes down to it being branded
    As "plausible. ..but not realistic"

    But to take that movie and insert Clayface would be a big leap wouldn't it?
     
  9. Great Mind(s) Broken

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    The Earth Superman is coming to isn't one with Poison Ivy, Killer Croc, Clayface, Lazarus Pits, a ******ed zombie...it just isn't. That is the POINT. Nearly every interview with Goyer, Snyder or Nolan they have to mention how REALISTIC their MOS is. Do you think they're just playing with that word for fun? It's not going to be Captain America, Iron Man or Thor "realistic"...it's going to be "TDK realistic". Meaning, Superman isn't going to walk down the street and see a giant crocodile monster coming out of the sewer. It's NOT going to happen! As much as you want AA, it's not going to happen.
     
  10. Shikamaru Registered

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    Perma-white Joker would still be realistic by MOS standards. The only "fantasy" elements about the Joker is his perma-white body and the fact that the laughing gas doesn't affect him. There are people in real life that are born with a lot more messed up disorders and abnormalities than that.

    I admit that it has the potential to be a rehash of the Nolan films but if WB is smart, plays their cards right, and gets someone that can tell a unique and good story, it will not be a problem at all IMO.

    And no, you can't just continue Nolan's damn continuity by doing that because many key elements of the Batman mythos would be gone.

    "Way too quick" isn't a problem for Batman at this point since multiple takes on him with new actors playing him within a short gap of time is nothing new for him at this point, while it was something new for Spider-Man.

    Very similar in tone to the last franchise? Dude, what the hell were you watching? They're the exact opposite of each other. Raimi was very lighthearted and cheesy with an almost 1960's setting while TASM was modern and more serious in tone.

    Speaking of TASM, that is another example of a movie that shares the same realism as MOS. It has realistic character reactions but that it literally the only realistic thing about it. Can TASM and TDKT exist in the same universe by that logic?

    They do have many elements from THL but they are still their own movies. But THL is its own unique story and still has many different elements from the Nolan films. The way the mob is portrayed is also very different. We haven't seen Godfather-esque mobsters in a popular for a long time (at least in a popular movie).

    THL having similar elements is exactly why it would be the perfect choice for the reboot IMO. You would have a reboot that is kinda like the Nolan films but at the same time is also very different from the Nolan films and has those "fantasy" elements in there that were missing in TDKT.

    I see you brought up Court of Owls. With a few adjustments, that story could also work as the first film in the reboot.
     
  11. Great Mind(s) Broken

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    Yeah 15-20 years from now.
     
  12. Frodo Registered

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    I think the whole "TDKT is realistic" arguement is kinda a fanboy myth. The films are more grounded , most things had a logical explanation to them, and the material was treated seriously and with respect, but realistic is a bit of a strecth. TDKR was the most comic booky of the three films .
     
  13. Great Mind(s) Broken

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    Exactly, TDKR WAS the most comic-booky. Right before Man Of Steel too, hmm. Wonder why.

    ASM realistic?!? WHAT?? You really think Man Of Steel is going to be like Amazing Spider-Man's realism?? Riiight. So the producers and writers have said MOS is going to be TDK style realistic, you choose to interpret that as ASM realistic. O-Kay
     
  14. Rodrigo90 Wink wink ;)

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    TDKR is more realistic than what we get from the comics though, isn't it?

    While not 100% realistic, obviously, it tried to appear that way.

    MOS is doing the same...Trying to appear realistic
    Even with aliens from another galaxy dropping in.
     
  15. FeedOnATreeFrog (A Metal Gear reference)

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    Trying to appear realistic to the point where they have aliens come to Earth.

    Just like a future Batman movie can try to appear realistic to the point where a guy turns into clay. It can still be a 'more-realistic' version than the comics version of clay-face.
     
    #140 FeedOnATreeFrog, Apr 25, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2013
  16. Rodrigo90 Wink wink ;)

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    It's not the same thing.

    Aliens from another planet isn't the same as somebody on Earth falling into a bath and being able to shapeshift.

    The context of unrealism being applied to the situation of aliens arriving doesn't need to be applied to somebody on Earth with current scientific means being able to create giant mutant plants.
     
  17. shauner111 Registered

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    :lmao: Dying!

    A massive leapski.

    Not if they don't connect it. Outer space is infinite and the possibilities are endless, there may be planets that we cant see with life just like Krypton. Nobody knows. Aliens are unlimited, so if they were to exist theyre entering a planet earth that is pretty realistic. At least, movie-verse realistic. There is no such thing as people who can become monsters on earth. It would have to come from explanations via outer space. Who wants to see every monster linked that way? I don't think anybody does. I certainly don't.
     
  18. shauner111 Registered

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    Perfect. What don't people get about this? it's not hard people, earth is grounded, space isn't.

    Oh and Shikamaru if u think raimis spidey movies had a 60s setting, we weren't watching the same movies. They were both modern, but the odd thing was changed. It mainly had to do with story direction. Anything that happened in Webb's universe could have happened in Raimi's.
     
  19. dnno1 Registered

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    In truth, it the world depended on it again, you know good and well, Bruce Wayne would come back out of retirement (even if he was only a week into it) to be Batman again, so rushing is a moot point. A lot of people have to keep in mind that Bruce Wayne is just a guise. He's always Batman upstairs.
     
  20. FeedOnATreeFrog (A Metal Gear reference)

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    but there are things that can be undiscovered on Earth as well.

    Like Themyscira. Or are you in the camp who wants MOS in its own world?
     
  21. shauner111 Registered

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    I do agree with this. But for the purpose of the story, I would give Bruce years of freedom and happiness in a different continent. Post-surgeries, hell maybe he has a kid with Selina, maybe he doesn't..but I would give him that time. After 8 years where Gotham seemed clean but HE was depressed. The least thing the writers can give him is a few years of personal peacetime.
     
  22. Rodrigo90 Wink wink ;)

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    Sure...but I expect something a little more deeper :)
     
  23. IamtheBatman Registered

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    What if your wrong and those build-up solo films flop!
     
    #148 IamtheBatman, Apr 25, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2013
  24. Shikamaru Registered

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    The lack of origin is not what it would make it feel forced. It will only feel forced if the introduction to the new Batman is done poorly and/or there is a lack of introduction to begin with. When starting a franchise, introducing the character in a unique way that establishes who they are is what is important but that does not automatically equate to doing the origin.

    Just because you didn't like TDKR doesn't mean the movie that hasn't even been out for a year should be rebooted.[/QUOTE]

    Me not liking TDKR is only a slice of the pie. There are so many other reasons why continuing Nolan's Batman after that is a bad idea.

    Even if the reboot doesn't happen any time soon, the chances of Nolan's Batman being continued are still very very low (Bale coming back to play a different Batman for JL doesn't count). As someone else pointed out, WB would not risk hurting their relationship with Nolan by going against his vision.

    What is wrong with a page-for-age adaptation of a comic? Literally the only difference between the story in a Batman movie and the story in a Batman comic is the medium in which it is being told. TDK could've been a comic that was adapted in live-action and you as part of the general audience wouldn't have even known this. This statement doesn't make sense whatsoever.

    It is the story and the fact that Batman himself is pretty watered down compared to his comic book counterpart. Those are the main factors that matter.

    If they discarded TDKR from continuity (which they won't do), then I can kinda see your point. However, the entire message of TDKR is that Bruce's journey is over. He is at peace with Batman and Batman is a symbol anyone can take as opposed to something part of Bruce. The movie makes this statement and treats itself as if it is "THE END" - the last chapter. Doing a movie that fixes that would feel far more contrived just to get Nolan's Batman for JL than any reboot would IMO.

    I hope you do realize why Nolan ended TDKR in the way he did to begin with. BB and TDK were never meant to be part of a three-act trilogy. They were considered to be just the first 2 films in the current Batman franchise, and everything in those movies pointed to Bruce being Batman for a LONG time. It wasn't until they started writing the story for TDKR that Nolan decided to cap it off at a trilogy and end it the way he did, and he did this to stop WB from touching his Batman after he left (TDKR was going to be his last Batman film). The 8 year gap is also there so that WB can't make movies set in between those 8 years since Bruce wasn't Batman during that time. Basically, TDKR's ending is in a lot of ways somewhat of a sacrifice for Nolan (and for the fans that didn't want his franchise continued after he left). Continuing the story after TDKR would make that sacrifice completely pointless.

    The way of thinking that I see in this post is "There is no way Nolan is dumb enough to make Batman quit like that and pass his mantle to a rookie cap with no training so this just HAS to be all part of his plan for an upcoming story in a JL movie!"

    The sad reality is that Nolan really believes that Bruce at the end said off-screen "I'm done with Batman for the rest of my life." and "F**k Gotham, that kid is on his own."
     
  25. FeedOnATreeFrog (A Metal Gear reference)

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