Make a New Anti Daredevil Villain Team

[The Overlord]

It occurs to me has there never been a really good anti DD villain team, there was the first Emissaries of Evil in the 60s (Electro, Gladiator, Stilt-Man, Leap-Frog and Matador) and let's face it only Gladiator and Electro pose any real threat out of that line up (DD easily beat the lame villains in that group, like tricking Matador into attacking Leap-Frog for him.)

The second major DD villain team occured in the 80s, with Typhoid Mary creating an DD revenge squad including herself, Bushwacker, Bullet and the Wildboys. This one was a bit better, however the Wildboys where nothing more than street punks and it loses points because it didn't have any silver age villains in it.

Anyway if you could crerate a anti DD villain team for today's comics, who would you put on it? I would put the following: Mr. Fear, Mr. Hyde, Purple Man, Typhoid Mary, Bushwacker, Bullseye and perhaps Owl.

 

[The Question]

A group of former theives, hitmen, and gangsters, angry at Daredevil for putting them in jail, come together as a grou to get revenge. They are:



Madador

Stilt Man

Leapfrog

Eel

Mr. Fear


Mr. Fear and Madador are the brains behind the operation, Stilt Man and Leap Frog provide the tech, and all of them serve as fighters.

 

[The Overlord]

A group of former theives, hitmen, and gangsters, angry at Daredevil for putting them in jail, come together as a grou to get revenge. They are:



Madador

Stilt Man

Leapfrog

Eel

Mr. Fear


Mr. Fear and Madador are the brains behind the operation, Stilt Man and Leap Frog provide the tech, and all of them serve as fighters.

Leap-Frog I has been reformed for several years and has a kid, Leap-Frog II is dead, so neither of them would make sense as criminals. Matador was never that bright and I think he has reformed as well, so again he wouldn't amke a great mastermind and I question why woud become a criminal again. We have already argued about Stilt-Man at length eslewhere, so I don't want to get into that again. Eeel isn't really a DD villain. Now thing closest to a real heavy hitter is Mr. Fear, but that character has his own problems Mr. Fear IV (Alan Fagan) has a grudge against Spidey not DD, now Mr. Fear III (Larry Craston) may still be alive and he does have a grudge against DD, but I don't see why he would work with these pathetic other villains. Sriosuly why no heavy hitters on you team no Typhoid Mary or Mr. Hyde or someone else.

 

[The Question]

Leap-Frog I has been reformed for several years and has a kid, Leap-Frog II is dead, so neither of them would make sense as criminals.

Oh? Well, I wasn't well informed.

Matador was never that bright and I think he has reformed as well, so again he wouldn't amke a great mastermind and I question why woud become a criminal again.

He always seemed inteligent to me. And I didn't realized he reformed.

We have already argued about Stilt-Man at length eslewhere, so I don't want to get into that again.

There are two Stilt Men, you know.

Eeel isn't really a DD villain.

He ran with the origional Mr. Fear's gang for a while.

Now thing closest to a real heavy hitter is Mr. Fear, but that character has his own problems Mr. Fear IV (Alan Fagan) has a grudge against Spidey not DD, now Mr. Fear III (Larry Craston) may still be alive and he does have a grudge against DD, but I don't see why he would work with these pathetic other villains. Sriosuly why no heavy hitters on you team no Typhoid Mary or Mr. Hyde or someone else.

Why does it have to be heavy hitters? And why would Fear care if they were heavy hitters? Especially since how popular a character is in the real world has no bearing whatsoever on their status in the comic world. The gang gets together because they want revenge. Fear organizes them. Besides, Typhoid Mary is a mob assasin, and Mr. Hyde's been going that way buisness wise a bit aswell. I'd think that the only reason there would need to be a team to stop Daredevil is if it's a bunch of less than successful criminals banding together for strength in numbers. A heavy hitter could give Daredevil a good fight on their own.

 

[Ben Urich]

Bushwhacker (Physical threat)
Klaw (Hypersenses threat)
Masked Marauder (Tech threat)
Mr Fear (Psychological threat)
Mr Hyde (Physical threat)
The Owl (Intellectual threar)
Turk! (Because it's not anti Daredevil if he isn't involved)
Wilbur Day (Stilt Man, assistant to Leland Owlsley)

Eh? Eh?

 

[The Question]

Klaw (Hypersenses threat)

1) Why would Klaw want to kill Daredevil? I mean, has Klaw even met Daredevil? Does Klaw even know who Daredevil is?

2) I don't think they'd need him. They could just yell very very loudly.

 

[The Overlord]

Oh? Well, I wasn't well informed.

Well he's out then he's been reformed since the 80s and the second one is dead.

He always seemed inteligent to me. And I didn't realized he reformed.

DD once put Matador's cape over Leap-Forg and tricked Matador into beating up Leap-Frog for him. Not a genius plus he is reformed.

There are two Stilt Men, you know.

Yeah, the first one is reformed and the second one hasn't met DD yet, why would either of them want revenge?


He ran with the origional Mr. Fear's gang for a while.

That was the first Eel, he's dead, plus he fought everyone Torch, Captain America, Fantastic Four, the X-Men and the Defenders. He's not a real DD villain.

Why does it have to be heavy hitters? And why would Fear care if they were heavy hitters? Especially since how popular a character is in the real world has no bearing whatsoever on their status in the comic world. The gang gets together because they want revenge. Fear organizes them. Besides, Typhoid Mary is a mob assasin, and Mr. Hyde's been going that way buisness wise a bit aswell. I'd think that the only reason there would need to be a team to stop Daredevil is if it's a bunch of less than successful criminals banding together for strength in numbers. A heavy hitter could give Daredevil a good fight on their own.

The first Sinister Six had a ton of heavy hitters, Sandman, Electro and Dr. Octopus all on the same team, all able to give Spidey a real fight on their own. That's what made it fun, Spider-Man figfhting his most deadly foes, it was lot more thrilling then him fighting a legion of losers made up Spot and Kangeroo.

Seriously a good mastermind villain could find a way to recruit or hire Hyde and/or Typhoid Mary, it is far more dramatic then DD fighting one serious villain and his own personal legion of losers.

 

[The Overlord]

Bushwhacker (Physical threat)
Klaw (Hypersenses threat)
Masked Marauder (Tech threat)
Mr Fear (Psychological threat)
Mr Hyde (Physical threat)
The Owl (Intellectual threar)
Turk! (Because it's not anti Daredevil if he isn't involved)
Wilbur Day (Stilt Man, assistant to Leland Owlsley)

Eh? Eh?

Day is reformed. Besides that, not bad.

 

[The Question]

Well he's out then he's been reformed since the 80s and the second one is dead.

Okay. I didn't know that.

DD once put Matador's cape over Leap-Forg and tricked Matador into beating up Leap-Frog for him. Not a genius plus he is reformed.

Again, didn't know that.

Yeah, the first one is reformed and the second one hasn't met DD yet, why would either of them want revenge?

The new Stilt Man has met Daredevil.

That was the first Eel, he's dead, plus he fought everyone Torch, Captain America, Fantastic Four, the X-Men and the Defenders. He's not a real DD villain.

Fair point.

The first Sinister Six had a ton of heavy hitters, Sandman, Electro and Dr. Octopus all on the same team, all able to give Spidey a real fight on their own. That's what made it fun, Spider-Man figfhting his most deadly foes, it was lot more thrilling then him fighting a legion of losers made up Spot and Kangeroo.

But they all fought him one at a time, which was a stupid move. If they had fought him a s a team, they would have won easily. A team of second stringer villains taking on one hero makes alot more sense, mainly because the bigger villains could deal with the hero on their own.

Seriously a good mastermind villain could find a way to recruit or hire Hyde and/or Typhoid Mary, it is far more dramatic then DD fighting one serious villain and his own personal legion of losers.

It would also make no sense. Hyde and Mary have been able to fight and nearly kill Daredevil on their own. As a team, they should be able to kill him easily. A team of second stringers makes more sense.

 

[The Overlord]

Okay. I didn't know that.
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Again, didn't know that.
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The new Stilt Man has met Daredevil.
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Fair point.
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But they all fought him one at a time, which was a stupid move. If they had fought him a s a team, they would have won easily. A team of second stringer villains taking on one hero makes alot more sense, mainly because the bigger villains could deal with the hero on their own.



It would also make no sense. Hyde and Mary have been able to fight and nearly kill Daredevil on their own. As a team, they should be able to kill him easily. A team of second stringers makes more sense.

In the 90s Sinister Six teams attacked Spidey at once and still had heavy hitters on their team (Ock, Electro and Hobgoblin). Most of the second stringers mentioned are reformed and DD punked them as a group back in DD annual 1. Now that he is way more skilled, he could punk them even worse. The reason why DD would defeat a team of his heavy hitter villains is because those villains are psychotic, so they have no team work skills and DD can use his head to play them off one another.

 

[The Question]

How is daredevil way more skilled?



Anyway, that's not important. I think that a team full of heavy hitters is a bad idea in terms of writing, personally.

 

[KevanG]

Villain team huh? I'd go with people who mess with sound, Angar the Screamer (2 points if you remember him), Songbird, people like that.

 

[The Overlord]

How is daredevil way more skilled?



Anyway, that's not important. I think that a team full of heavy hitters is a bad idea in terms of writing, personally.

DD has more experience now then in the Silver age, more training, etc. Besides if think that a team of heavy hitters is a bad concept, then do you not like the various Sinister Six teams?

 

[The Overlord]

Villain team huh? I'd go with people who mess with sound, Angar the Screamer (2 points if you remember him), Songbird, people like that.

Angar is dead and Songbird is a hero now.

 

[The Question]

DD has more experience now then in the Silver age, more training, etc. Besides if think that a team of heavy hitters is a bad concept, then do you not like the various Sinister Six teams?

I think they were poorly handled for mthe most part. If all of those guys juts got together and planned a full on atack on Spidey, Spidey would be very much dead.

 

[The Overlord]

I think they were poorly handled for mthe most part. If all of those guys juts got together and planned a full on atack on Spidey, Spidey would be very much dead.

But they are all selfish and many of them are insane, Spidey survives because they have piss poor team work skills, just as likely to attack eachother as they are Spidey. Same deal with an anti DD team, most of the heavy hitters are hopeless psychotics, so they be work together for a little while, but soonere or later, the team is going to explode with infighting and backstabbing. None of this changes the fact that most of the villains mentioned are reformed and one isn't really a DD villain.

 

[The Question]

I got that. Let's move on from that. Anywho, the whole "no teamwork skills" thing is a bad excuse. So what if they're crazy? All they need is one person to organize them and they'd work fine. Especially with DD's rogues. Put Hyde, Bullseye, Typhoid Mary, and Bushwhacker on a team together, and have someone like The Owl or Kingpin organize thhem, and Daredevil wouldn't stand much of a chance. Mary sets DD on fire, Bullseye throws some sharp object at him, Bushwhacker shoots him, and Hyde steps on him a few times.

 

[The Overlord]

I got that. Let's move on from that. Anywho, the whole "no teamwork skills" thing is a bad excuse. So what if they're crazy? All they need is one person to organize them and they'd work fine. Especially with DD's rogues. Put Hyde, Bullseye, Typhoid Mary, and Bushwhacker on a team together, and have someone like The Owl or Kingpin organize thhem, and Daredevil wouldn't stand much of a chance. Mary sets DD on fire, Bullseye throws some sharp object at him, Bushwhacker shoots him, and Hyde steps on him a few times.

No it is not a bad excuse, in 1991's Return of Sinister Six, Ock was manipulating the others from the begining and betrayed when he no longer deemed the others useful. With that kind of infghting, clashing personalities and backstabbing, they still pose a threat to Spidey, but they can't beat because they implode everytime. Look at first Sinister Sx, the reason they fought him one on one because they all wanted the "honour" of killing Spidey, so they had to take turns just to prevent them fighting eachother over who gets to be the one to take him out.

Same deal with the DD rogues, Bullseye always believes that he should get the honour of killing DD and would likely prevent other team members from killing DD in order to take the glory for himself. Same deal with Hyde, he has no impulse control and will likely attack other team members to get the glory for himself. Mary is a hopeless psychotic and her scatter shot attacks will likely hurt her teamates as much as DD. At least the villains I picked aren't reformed and are real DD villains. Besdies in DD annual 1, DD fought Leap-Frog, Stilt-Man and Matador at the same time and he punked them, why would it be different this time?

 

[The Question]

No it is not a bad excuse, in 1991's Return of Sinister Six, Ock was manipulating the others from the begining and betrayed when he no longer deemed the others useful. With that kind of infghting, clashing personalities and backstabbing, they still pose a threat to Spidey, but they can't beat because they implode everytime. Look at first Sinister Sx, the reason they fought him one on one because they all wanted the "honour" of killing Spidey, so they had to take turns just to prevent them fighting eachother over who gets to be the one to take him out.

But not every criminal has the same personality.

Same deal with the DD rogues, Bullseye always believes that he should get the honour of killing DD and would likely prevent other team members from killing DD in order to take the glory for himself.

Actually, Bullseye, in the past, has shown that he's fully willing to let someone else actually kill Daredevil as long as he comes up with the plan.

Same deal with Hyde, he has no impulse control and will likely attack other team members to get the glory for himself.

Then, I'd think whoever's organizing the team would think twice about letting him on it. Besides, Hyde has worked with others in the past, and usually worked well with them.

Mary is a hopeless psychotic and her scatter shot attacks will likely hurt her teamates as much as DD.

Mary has worked with others befoee, and while she's crazy, her aim is better than that.

At least the villains I picked aren't reformed and are real DD villains.

Fine. Let's move on from that, shall we?

 

[3dman27]

dd's sinister six
mr hyde
the cobra
mr fear
thyphoid mary
the owl
man-bull

 

[The Overlord]

But not every criminal has the same personality.



Actually, Bullseye, in the past, has shown that he's fully willing to let someone else actually kill Daredevil as long as he comes up with the plan.



Then, I'd think whoever's organizing the team would think twice about letting him on it. Besides, Hyde has worked with others in the past, and usually worked well with them.



Mary has worked with others befoee, and while she's crazy, her aim is better than that.



Fine. Let's move on from that, shall we?

Your forgetting that DD is very clever and could psyche them out. The fact is Spidey has fought the Sinister Six before and survived. Also Batman faced off against his most powerful enemies in Dark Victory and Hush and he survived. Team ups like these should feature the hero most dangerous enemies, not some losers that hero can take out easily, where's dramatic tension in that?

 

[The Overlord]

dd's sinister six
mr hyde
the cobra
mr fear
thyphoid mary
the owl
man-bull

I kinda like your team.

 

[The Question]

Your forgetting that DD is very clever and could psyche them out. The fact is Spidey has fought the Sinister Six before and survived. Also Batman faced off against his most powerful enemies in Dark Victory and Hush and he survived. Team ups like these should feature the hero most dangerous enemies, not some losers that hero can take out easily, where's dramatic tension in that?

If it's got his most dangerous enemies all working together, it makes no sense that he'd survive. I mean, really, it would be ever so easy for the team you suggested to kill Matt. They wait until he's on patrol, Mary snipes him with pyrokenisis. He catches ablaze, and falls to the ground. Hyde holds him down, and Bullseye stabs him to death. Lesser villains who wouldn't stand a chance against Daredevil working together makes alot more sense story wise than people who can hold their own against him by themselves.

 

[Roughneck]

Bullseye
Mr Hyde
Cobra
Electro
Lady Deathstrike
Razor Fist
Taskmaster
Purple Man
Mr. Fear


Bullseye put the team together......Some came willingly others had to be paid (Taskmaster) I dunno if it's ever stated or not, but I figure Bullseye has a lot of money laying around....he is a killer for hire.

 

[KevanG]

Angar is dead and Songbird is a hero now.

Just because he's dead doesn't mean he's "dead", you should know that, and villians who turn into heros usually turn back one way or another :P
But like I said before I'd just put together a team that messes with the way that DD recieves his input. Of course he'd win somehow, being a hero and all but still it would be interesting.