New Avengers: Illuminati

[The_Mystery]

www.newsarama.com


Check the Illuminati link.

Anyone gonna feel sorry for the Skrulls when Black Bolt looks that pissed.

 

[torkibe]

"Blackbolt, what do you have to say?"

 

[Dread]

Bendis' one shot issue was good, but Bendis seems to be a writer whose quality decreases with every additional issue to an arc. Therefore, 1 issue = Godly, and more than 6 usually equals Crapitude, with some stuff in between. I also am wary of his attempt to add a secret cabal to Marvel's backhistory since he has, well, committed some continuity blunders before. But the art looks pretty and we'll see how it works. However, Cheung likely will be late after the second issue, if history repeats itself as it did with YOUNG AVENGERS.

 

[Crosis]

I read it today at work and, surprisingly, enjoyed it quite a bit. Lots of action, good characterization (Really!), and all in all much better than I was expecting.
I may actually pick this one up.

 

[hippy fascist]

the story looks good but I can't stand the art. Strange looks RIDICULOUS and namor looks far too cartoonish. I'll get the first issue but we'll see...

 

[CaptainCanada]

Bendis' one shot issue was good, but Bendis seems to be a writer whose quality decreases with every additional issue to an arc. Therefore, 1 issue = Godly, and more than 6 usually equals Crapitude, with some stuff in between.

From what we've been told about this miniseries, it's structured more as a series of single issues (similar to X-Men: First Class), with each issue set around a different event or incident in the history of the group, so there's hope.

I'm getting this for Cheung's art, and because it's a cool cast of characters.

 

[The_Mystery]

For all the "Bendis Hate," he really does excel with "done-in-one" stories.

 

[deemar325]

I give him that.

 

[Dread]

I agree. His shorter stories are almost always better than his longer ones. That is why CIVIL WAR has helped NEW AVENGERS greatly. Still, he is going to have his work cut out for him trying to shove his personal team into the backhistory of the MU without making it seem like what it is, a retcon.

 

[supermarvelman]

the story looks good but I can't stand the art. Strange looks RIDICULOUS and namor looks far too cartoonish. I'll get the first issue but we'll see...

You got to be Frickin Kidding Me.

 

[hippy fascist]

You got to be Frickin Kidding Me.

no

it's good, I just don't like the style he's using

 

[supermarvelman]

I agree. His shorter stories are almost always better than his longer ones. That is why CIVIL WAR has helped NEW AVENGERS greatly. Still, he is going to have his work cut out for him trying to shove his personal team into the backhistory of the MU without making it seem like what it is, a retcon.

Well if it the rest of initiative is as good as this preview, then its gonna be beyond awesome. Art-wise and story-wise.

 

[The_Mystery]

I agree. His shorter stories are almost always better than his longer ones. That is why CIVIL WAR has helped NEW AVENGERS greatly. Still, he is going to have his work cut out for him trying to shove his personal team into the backhistory of the MU without making it seem like what it is, a retcon.

As much as I kinda agree with you, I'm curious to see how he can "retcon" it in. It's not a bad idea though. It fits into each person's character and if done right will not betray continuity.

 

[Dread]

As much as I kinda agree with you, I'm curious to see how he can "retcon" it in. It's not a bad idea though. It fits into each person's character and if done right will not betray continuity.

It's not a bad idea in theory, the problem I see it is that Marvel spent a lot of time, especially in the 90's, pigeonholing their franchises off into almost seperate universes except for an obligatory team-up or crossover "event". This was naturally done back in the day so every franchise could develop, but the downside is that Marvel didn't get that sense of "community" that many feel is amung the DC universe's strengths. Therefore the Illuminati is a way to retroactively increase this by going, "no, this secret team of characters who almost never met in character back during the 70's and 80's and in fact barely knew each other's first names all secretly formed this cabal that screwed with stuff for some nefarious purpose, because NO cabal ever has a good motive these days, especially cabals named after mythical secret conspiricies. And they kept this information and alliance secret from even their dearest and closest teammates and families on their seperate organizations despite that making zero tactical sense NOT because you can't erase 30 years of non-existance...but because they're mysterious. TERRIBLY mysterious". ANY writer would have a tough time selling this concept well, even Slott. The fact that it is a lightening rod like Bendis adds to that pressure. Ultimate Clone Saga is the ultimate example of Bendis planning some ambitious, sweeping thing and it completely backfiring on every single level (unless you count HOM, but Scarlet Witch's manipulations tend to make me forget that boring mess happened).

Still, even if the exercise on the whole may be ropey, if Bendis is taking an approach simular to X-MEN: FIRST CLASS and his own CW NEW AVENGERS issues, we at least will get a series of good tales out of it.

 

[The_Mystery]

Well, I never got that the Illuminati had nefarious purposes. They united to exchange info to better help save the world. It seems that they have over time evolved to become sort of the ambassadors for the "superhuman race" on Earth. But when you have those big personalities in one "team" it will never go exactly the way any of the participants intended.

 

[Dread]

Well, I never got that the Illuminati had nefarious purposes. They united to exchange info to better help save the world. It seems that they have over time evolved to become sort of the ambassadors for the "superhuman race" on Earth. But when you have those big personalities in one "team" it will never go exactly the way any of the participants intended.

Of course they meant well, but what I got from Bendis' last special, they were basically a group of figures who held secret meetings together and boom, without any sort of imput from the dozens, hundreds, or millions of people it might effect, went about to change stuff. True, a superhero team does that in a sense, but that is more typical, smashing threats and whatnot. The Illuminati are basically planning how to effect American policy and whatnot, at least from where Iron Man stood.

Like I said, they're a secret cabal. You're never supposed to root for secret cabals. They're never good. I mean look at Roxxon Inc or the Secret Empire or the Hellfire Club or whatnot. They all want to "fix" the world too.

To be fair in regards to my last comment, Marvel is trying to claim these guys have been together since Kree-Skrull in the 60's and 70's. To some extent, Mr. Fantastic, Black Bolt and Namor were already familiar with each other, although were rarely allies. Iron Man would have been familiar with Mr. Fantastic and Dr. Strange and Professor X would have probably been the mysterious oddballs (hell, back then a lot of heroes got wigged out by the X-Men too). It just seems so hard to swallow and accept when you read ESSENTIALS or whatnot that these bunch of guys were some team secretly manipulating everything behind the scenes, least to me.

It's something Marvel seems to enjoy doing; rather than risk forming something NEW in the NOW that needs LONG TERM DEVELOPMENT, a retcon seeks to INJECT that development and importance retroactively, like Vulcan in DEADLY GENESIS or SINS PAST (which stank, least IMO). One day Marvel is going to have to stop strip mining the 60's for stuff. At least CW, flawed as it does, accomplishes that for the most part, as do some of their newer characters.

 

[Tropico]

Yup, what Dread said. Especially considering when those teams/people finally teamed up one side gave info on some of the bad guys and the other would give info on the remaining baddies. Which leads me to say: Sooooo, why the "exchange of info" angle if it never materialized? Sure, you could argue that the leaders never passed on the info to their "subordinates" but that seems.....convenient for the Illuminati angle, extremely boneheaded for the teams/people involved in the crossover. I have to admit that the Illuminati are somewhat interesting but it always leaves a bad taste in my mouth because it follows a trend where there no longer are noble heroes and not even people from older generations had pure motive, they always had an angle and a secret agenda.

 

[The_Mystery]

I just looked at the Illuminati's "not sharing info" as simple human hubris. They made a mistake in judgment and their mistake spiralled out of control.

 

[CaptainCanada]

The secrecy angle would in part be because, I imagine, the various factions they represent don't always get along with each other, and might not like the idea of their leaders working so closely with the leaders of other foreign groups (the Atlanteans and the Inhumans, for example).

 

[Dread]

I just looked at the Illuminati's "not sharing info" as simple human hubris. They made a mistake in judgment and their mistake spiralled out of control.

It also is "inhuman" hubris, literally, as Namor and Black Bolt seem to go along with it, too.

I mean if the Illuminati were always there, how to explain how fractured Earth's heroes are? Why they always punch each other silly for the flimsiest of reasons (besides "because it looks cool")? If they wanted to form this team more recently, like around when DISASSEMBLED happened or whatnot, then I could understand it and it would probably work out better. But they're trying to say that this cabal has met in secret for most of the MU's existance. It's not impossible to swallow depending on how well it is done, but it is a bit to swallow.

But if the stories themselves are decent then it's worth it I guess. DEADLY GENESIS and SINS PAST were both retcons and RETCHES in terms of stories. Isn't it funny how that tends to go hand in hand?

And like Tropico said, it just adds to the increasing cynicism and darkness of modern comics. No one is noble or altruistic, and those that seem to be are the most evil of all. Good and evil are just illusions of the times, where at any moment Carnage could be a superhero and whatever. Lord knows I'm bitter and pessimistic, but that doesn't mean I believe everyone is, or want everything I read to be. Comics started as a way to reinforce simple morality and with that blurring sometimes they can be a drain.

But we'll see how it works. And I like Cheung's art.

 

[The_Mystery]

Don't get me wrong, I agree with you, but I'm just tryin' to put myself in Marvel's "shoes".

 

[Dread]

Don't get me wrong, I agree with you, but I'm just tryin' to put myself in Marvel's "shoes".

That's cool, someone has to.

Admittedly, I'm giving it a lot of heat considering I did actually like the last one-shot. Just the concept is, erm, a BIG FISH to swallow. Again, if they wanted something like this, maybe they should have planned it maybe 2-3 years ago and then went from there. Retcons usually feel lazy and cheap. I hate them on general principle.

 

[The_Mystery]

I feel like all of Marvel's big events are great "ideas", but they needed alittle more planning before executing.

 

[Artistsean]

I like the artist, I am not hapy about some of the characters though: Reed Richards, Tony Stark. And I guess thats all.
But I will probably buy the comic for the art, like I always do.

 

[Brainiac 8]

I guess Prof. X is no longer welcome in the Illuminati....since he is no longer a mutant.