Pittsburgh Comicon: Spider-girl Panel

Or maybe they meant under th' same company banner, which'd be Marvel. As pointed out, they started in Atlas and then made th' changeover with th' company. I mean, sometimes they do treat th' two as seperate companies. Remember in 1986 they celebrated Marvel's 25th anniversary even though they've been around since th' 30s? It all depends on perception I guess.

Me, I'd go with th' longest superheroine title distinction myself.
 
TheCorpulent1 said:
They probably meant Spider-Girl was the longest-running superhero comic with a female lead, I guess. Those comics you mentioned weren't superhero comics, as far as I know. Patsy Walker didn't become Hellcat until much later, did she?

Correct. I want to say Avengers #144 off the top of my head, but don't quote me.
 
This is the first I've even seen people talk about Patsy Walker in about a year, so I doubt it'll be a problem. ;)
 
Heh ironically, a few days ago I read th' Thunderbolts Annual where Hellstrom tricks Hawkeye into rescuing Hellcat's soul from Hell.
 
If it's true that SG is Marvel's longest running Super-Heroine book, it's a shame to re-launch it.

Is a new #1 really all that more attention-grabbing than a #100th issue in this day and (Marvel) age?

I know the books sales are in the crapper, but Marvel is apparently making good money with the trades (X-Men numbers, according to Joe). If so, then technically, the book is still bringing money into the company, right? The sales numbers probably cover DeFalco and Frenz' salaries, and the trade profits go right into Marvel's bank account.

I see no problem in just letting the book continue to build on it's already excellent reputation, and established tradition.
 
Th' problem is Marvel doesn't wanna put their PR machine behind it 'cause they're too busy using it on books that have guaranteed sales (which is an ass-backwards policy if you ask me). So, they feel a new #1 would attract new readers and get them on board whereas a #101 would be too intimidating and turn them off.

Basically, if it's a good, quality book, Marvel lets it hang to hopefully die. If it's a mediocre or barely passable book, then Joe Q says full steam ahead and throws as much money as needed at them.
 
FrogMan said:
What is the point of cancelling the book then? 12 or 13 issues in the numbering will just switch back to 113, anyway.

Because fans always buy #1 in greater numbers. It may be stupid, but look at sales numbers, fans always do it. By strictly a numbers standpoint, I wonder how they resist the temptation to re-launch every title on a yearly basis.
 
WOLVERINE25TH said:
Th' problem is Marvel doesn't wanna put their PR machine behind it 'cause they're too busy using it on books that have guaranteed sales (which is an ass-backwards policy if you ask me). So, they feel a new #1 would attract new readers and get them on board whereas a #101 would be too intimidating and turn them off.

Basically, if it's a good, quality book, Marvel lets it hang to hopefully die. If it's a mediocre or barely passable book, then Joe Q says full steam ahead and throws as much money as needed at them.

Once again, Marvel allows a title that woefully underperforms, to live. And what's the fan reaction? Happiness, Celebration, Gratitude? Nope, just another opportunity to bash Marvel.

I put this out there before, and I'll say it again. Name me the comic and publisher that bumped sales through marketing alone. No creative team change, no "shocking development", no new #1. Because you guys seem to think that advertising is some kind of a magic bullet to revive any project. It isn't. So I'll put it out here again: Name me the comic that was revived solely due to advertising. Good Luck.
 
iloveclones said:
Once again, Marvel allows a title that woefully underperforms, to live. And what's the fan reaction? Happiness, Celebration, Gratitude? Nope, just another opportunity to bash Marvel.
Come on, that's a skewed observation. Wolverine25th is the minority here. I'll be the first to admit that I ***** a lot about a lot of things, but even I was just happy that Spider-Girl might be continuing in some form rather than coming to a complete stop. Most of the other posters in here were the same.
 
Let's see, they cancel a book several times as an answer to its low sales, and when they finally decide to give it some attention we're sposed to get on our knees an' **** them even if they coulda done somethin' long ago? Not how this world works, bunky. To quote an article I just read:

"Joe Quesada has, in the past, defended the prioritisation of the top-selling titles on the basis that money spent advertising the big sellers generates more of a return for Marvel than money spent advertising smaller books. This is probably quite true. But it doesn't quite answer the complaint. For one thing, if it's not considered worthwhile to promote these smaller comics, the logical conclusion is that it's not worth publishing them at all. Just run with a slimmer, focused line instead.

Looked at the other way, if you're going to bother publishing marginal titles that clearly need the advertising support, then you need to commit that support even if the financial benefits are not immediately obvious. The objective of creating new titles or reinventing existing characters as potential lead characters is, one imagines, to create moneyspinners for the future. The promotional budget needs to be seen as a long-term investment. Readers need to be re-trained to believe that these new titles are worth checking out. Some form of vehicle for new stories needs to be created. If you're going to publish an anthology title then you need to pair the exciting new story with something that's actually going to draw a crowd. At the very least, the logical approach is to cut down to, say, one new book a month and promote it properly."

You want a book to sell, you need to tell people why they should buy it. Advertising isn't a magical bullet, but it's CRUCIAL in business.
 
iloveclones said:
Once again, Marvel allows a title that woefully underperforms, to live. And what's the fan reaction? Happiness, Celebration, Gratitude? Nope, just another opportunity to bash Marvel.

I can't speak for everyone but i do get slightly annoyed by the favoritism Marvel shows Spider-Girl, while they were much less leanent with better books out there like Captain Marvel.

But anyway, if they do relaunch I hope the book takes place at a slightly different period further on in her life so it can wash away all the needless muck and regain some semblance of focus. Hopefully the book gets a new artist and a new writter. Defalco was the one who ran Spider-Girl from the very beginign, and for the first couple tens of issues is was very well done, but he's been doing nothign but runing it into the ground these past few years. Character threads that had potential have been ruined, character dynamics from earlier on in the series have been destroyed, and the series perpetually goes further and further into campyness where it isn't needed. Characters who had actual personalities earlier on in the run have been delegated to stereotypes and Ron, for being such a dynamic artist, has gone with a very poor art style for the book.
 
Actually, given a choice, I'd have taken Captain Marvel's ongoing over Spider-Girl's, too.
 
Me too. If it would save Thing or MTU I'd dump Spider-Girl in heart beat as well.
 
This from the guy whose not digging Birds of Prey OYL. :rolleyes: :)
 
WOLVERINE25TH said:
Let's see, they cancel a book several times as an answer to its low sales, and when they finally decide to give it some attention we're sposed to get on our knees an' **** them even if they coulda done somethin' long ago? Not how this world works, bunky. To quote an article I just read:

"Joe Quesada has, in the past, defended the prioritisation of the top-selling titles on the basis that money spent advertising the big sellers generates more of a return for Marvel than money spent advertising smaller books. This is probably quite true. But it doesn't quite answer the complaint. For one thing, if it's not considered worthwhile to promote these smaller comics, the logical conclusion is that it's not worth publishing them at all. Just run with a slimmer, focused line instead.

Looked at the other way, if you're going to bother publishing marginal titles that clearly need the advertising support, then you need to commit that support even if the financial benefits are not immediately obvious. The objective of creating new titles or reinventing existing characters as potential lead characters is, one imagines, to create moneyspinners for the future. The promotional budget needs to be seen as a long-term investment. Readers need to be re-trained to believe that these new titles are worth checking out. Some form of vehicle for new stories needs to be created. If you're going to publish an anthology title then you need to pair the exciting new story with something that's actually going to draw a crowd. At the very least, the logical approach is to cut down to, say, one new book a month and promote it properly."

You want a book to sell, you need to tell people why they should buy it. Advertising isn't a magical bullet, but it's CRUCIAL in business.

First off, it was never cancelled. I don't remember there ever being a delay in shipping, or re-numbering due to the past "notices" of cancellation. I've threatened eviction of a tenant many times in the past, but never actually had to do it.

Second, I have no idea if who you're quoting is an industry insider or just one of us clueless Joes offering up their opinion. I'd give it a lot more credence if you told me what the source is. Otherwise, it's just opinion.

Third, all that is fine and good, but the proof is in the pudding, and my challenge still stands.
 
TheCorpulent1 said:
Come on, that's a skewed observation. Wolverine25th is the minority here. I'll be the first to admit that I ***** a lot about a lot of things, but even I was just happy that Spider-Girl might be continuing in some form rather than coming to a complete stop. Most of the other posters in here were the same.

It's not a skewed observation at all. He said it, and I commented on it. Maybe I shouldn't be lumping "fans" into one category, but I've heard this advertising complaint enough times, and seen negative reaction to positive happenings, enough times to know that Wolvie25th won't be the last.
 
Sweet spider-girl lives might pick this comic book up know.
 
http://www.ninthart.com/display.php?article=1187

Some Paul O'Brien guy...no clue who he is, but he said what I would've ****ed up sayin'.

And th' damn book was cancelled several times! That only shows you are CLUELESS. Two issues you can CLEARLY see were final issues before th' run was extended and Defalco hadda slap together more scripts to pick up where it woulda left off.

And no, I don't know a book saved by advertisin' 'cause I didn't follow this **** constantly like I do now. But what I do know is marketing, and if you don't market somethin' you can't expect it to sell. THAT'S basic economics. You look at any other company, they make an effort to push new things, or things sellin' badly to try an' boost sales. Advertisin' is an INVESTMENT to get yer product to sell. If you don't put it out there and give people a reason to buy it, PEOPLE WON'T BUY IT!

You need to tell people why they should get Brand X over Brand Y. Why their money should go towards this thing instead of that. Joe Q's admitted marketin' strategy is to push only books that already sell. That's bass-ackwards thinkin'. If you've got guaranteed sales on titles, they don't need th' extra boost.

So let me ask you this, Mr. Smart Guy, if a garbage man takes yer regular trash but constantly leaves behind yer gardening refuse week after week, and eventually only gets around to takin' it, you gonna thank him or reem him a new *******? Or if someone comes up to you and slaps you in th' face hard every day, you gonna thank them when they finally stop?

Marvel management these days haven't given me much reason to appreciate them, so excuse me if I'm not gonna give them head everytime they do somethin' right. I hold them to achieve th' same standards of quality that got me into comics, no more no less.
 

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