Discussion in 'Marvel Films' started by Detective Conan, Aug 22, 2019.
Release the Snyder cut!
I never really thought about Spider Man taking the lead role in The Avengers. I always figured it would be BP or CM. Maybe 5 or 6 years from now.
I guess as long as Sony can't/doesn't mess the MCU, I don't really care one way or the other 3-5 years down the line, I'd like to see Spidey back in MCU because, as of now, they are by FAR doing the best job of making interesting, fun, or otherwise entertaining movies as well as bringing in other characters as needed.
The main place I'd miss Spidey would be FF, but by then, Spidey could be back in MCU. Who knows at this point.
Spider-Man was meant to be the main guy in the MCU. When he eventually was taking over the Avengers he wouldn't have been lookitfor help from Iron Man. Iron Man is dead and each movie going forward he'd be mentioned less and less.
Pretty much every hero in the MCU so far except Strange & The Guaedians was getting tech from Iron Man but for some reason people only complaining about Spider-Man. At this point I'm glad he's gone. More room for the X-MEN.[/QUOTE]
I don’t care one bit about Spider-Man being “the main guy” in the MCU. I’m more annoyed that everything that makes Peter Parker who he is has been cleared away in this universe so that he could play as a son replacement for Stark in order to work out his daddy issues. Being Spider-Man is a curse, but the MCU treats it as a minor annoyance. His motivation to even be Spider-Man as given in Civil War is so weak that it’s barely a consideration. Imagine Batman without the dead parents and he’s just fighting crime “just cuz”. Aunt May immediately embraces him being Spider-Man, he has unlimited wealth at his disposal, Uncle Ben pretty much doesn’t exist, his high school “bully” Flash is some dweeb who’s about as popular as Peter himself, all of his villains so far have been repurposed to actually be Iron Man villains who are just moderately annoyed by Spider-Man...this kid has no real problems.
This version of the character is practically unrecognizable and yes, I’m ready for it to end already. I could care less about “random teen with spider powers” being the new face of the MCU.
The way I see it, Tom is the best Spider-Man perfomance surrounded by a world that isn't recognizable. I was willing to let this pass in Homecoming because I enjoyed Tom in that movie quite a bit. I was okay with the Iron Man arc because I assumed that him saying no to the Avengers would close that chapter in his story. So when IW/Endgame rolls around and they essentially walk back on that amazing arc by undoing Peter's solidarity from the Avengers, it made Homecoming weaker to boot for me.
Now Far From Home was built around Iron Man which the movie seems to be confused with itself. It's telling us that he's NOT the next Iron Man but yet 10 seconds later in that same scene, he's playing AC/DC and building a suit meant to evoke the first Iron Man film. I feel like this symbolizes the problem with this interpretation of the character -- Marvel wants to have their cake and eat it too. They want to thematically *tell us that Spider-Man is not defined by Tony Stark but every action he takes and the story tells us otherwise.
Now Spider-Man's identity being revealed at the end of Far From Home essentially sealed the deal for me. I feel like Marvel has gone overboard with the "wanting to be different from what came before) and now that misguided fundamental is seeping into the core philosophy of the character itself - which is the duality of Peter Parker/Spider-Man. That will no longer exist in future MCU Spider-Man movies
I want to see what happens first. It's still early .
I have barely given this a second thought since I saw the news to honest. I have next to no doubt at all that a deal will be reached within the year.
I actually think a deal won't be done.
You forgot a big one, Black Panther and Wakanda. All technology made by themselves. He didn’t get tech from Iron Man. Neither has Captain Marvel and Scarlet Witch, who doesn’t use any tech.
Scarlet Witch uses tech to get around the globe (just like all the other earthbound avengers). It looks like decommissioned SHIELD tech, though, rather than Stark tech. Of course, shield hasn't officially existed for years and Stark absorbed a lot of their personnel, so do we really know it wasn't owned by Stark, after all?
I have no interest in Spider-Man outside of the MCU. No, I will not be supporting this.
In Far From home it's all about him becoming Tony's successor and he inherits a satellite and security system capable of doing almost anything.
Of course, what do you consider the odds that it will meet all three criterion ( or even just one of them )? *cough*
*takes out calculator*
I'd estimate about 17% likelihood.
I am all right with it, to be honest
I am one of perhaps the minority fans who does not like MCU take on Spidey.
I loved every MCU has ever put on screen, but that does not mean that they are immune to critics, especially after they handling Thor in EG also. Lets hope Feige does not drop the ball with their take on F4 and X-Men.
The reason is what most already said... MCU Spidey is too dependant on other heroes, especially Tony Stark.
MCU spidey cannot be comparable especially to the PS4 Spidey game.
Lets hope that with the MCU has been put off of him, Spidey can be great as a solo hero again as we know and love him...(but as long as Avi does not involve in any creative decision ever again)
I second all your complaints. On the other hand, I do like Holland and I like the idea of finally seeing Spidey grow up on screen so if they can give him a Ragnarok style reboot I'd like him to stay in the MCU. Not sure how they're going to get his secret identity back in the bottle without convoluted writing though.
I really don't understand what is so hard to comprehend about this: Spider-Man isn't meant to start out as a sidekick.
Almost every other version of Spidey use his wits, tech he builds himself and his amazing powers to fight his own battles. He's meant to go through major losses like his Uncle and first love but still make wisecracks and fight the good fight. He's meant to struggle to balance his heroism with being a normal guy struggling with real world problems like class, jobs, rent and relationships. So far the MCU Spidey has failed to tick any of those boxes and pales in comparison to the best versions of the character (Ultimate comics, Spectacular animated series, Spidey PS4).
Having him start out as a rookie hero that constantly screws up and needs rescuing by older heroes isn't what Spider-Man's meant to be. Giving him a billion dollar Stark suit/Tony Stark as a mentor, villains driven by things Stark did and calling him the next Iron Man has made him feel like a sidekick. And now, after a few films of being blase with his secret identity, everyone in the MCU knows Peter Parker is Spider-Man which completely screws the 'balancing heroism with being a normal person' side of the character.
Not even close. Thor, Hulk, Black Panther, Bucky, Scarlet Witch, Vision, Quicksilver, Ant-Man and Wasp also don't use tech from Stark.
Cap, Falcon, Widow, Hawkeye etc got a few tech upgrades from Tony but compared to the multiple custom made Iron Man suits Tony gave Peter that's nothing. Plus they were never mentored by him, they were never called 'the next Iron Man' and they never went round saying 'I'm nothing without this tech Tony gave me'. Hell, even Rhodey's never actually said it.
I dont understand why people are complaining about the Iron Man Jr aspect of MCU Spidey. It makes complete sense within the context of the MCU that Tony would be a mentor to Peter. From the tiny details we have It sounded like they were finally going to move past that in Spider-Man 3. Feige described Spider-Man 3 as a Peter Parker story.
But Peter being so connected to Tony is what I think made audiences really like Spidey. it made it feel like he was part of a bigger universe which is why we all wanted Spidey in the MCU in the 1st place so he could interact with the Avengers. It seems like folks have a short memory and don't remember how badly damaged the franchise was after Amazing Spider-Man 2.
If they reboot it again because of some legal / drama stuff preventing them from continuing with Holland I doubt many people will care. And well be back to square 1 with Sony ruining the franchise again. sigh.
I understand complaints about mcu Spider-Man but I refuse to support the idiots behind sm3 and the asm franchise. I refuse to believe Avi arad and the Sony team can produce a solid franchise or movie after delivery horrible choices such as dub step blue electro and ninja turtle lizard. I refuse to believe those idiots can come up with good content. I don’t care how good into the spiderverse was I don’t believe Sony can make a good live action movie without putting in there stupid ideas and ruin the movie
Right? It amazes me that people forgot the damage the brand was in under Sony. Freaking gotg was more popular than Spider-Man. That’s a no no I’m my book. Now Spider-Man is back on top and people think Sony can do better? K
Completely agree. I didn't support Venom. And won't be supporting a FFH sequel without Marvel Studios involvement. Hes a marvel character through and through. And deserves to take his rightful place in the MCU. The fact that he cant because of legal contracts is stupid.
It would be like if DC didn't own Batman or Superman. Its unthinkable. Tbh I would have rather seen Marvel Studios go bankrupt than having to deal with all this back and forth rights ****. Wish Marvel never sold the license. Even if it did keep them a float. The MCU will never feel whole as long as Spidey isn't part of it. They can try all they want to fill the gap with other characters but it will never fill the hole left behind. Even with the rights sharing deal you could tell they were held back by what they wanted to do.
This is one of those situations where I almost wish Disney would use the full extent of its monopolistic power and just put its foot down and take Sony to court or something. I'm sure Disney's lawyers could come up with some sort of argument of who really owns the IP. Or at least the specific ownership of Tom Holland's Spider-Man since hes so tied with the MCU creatively. Couldn't Disney argue since he appeared in Avengers movies that this specific version of Spidey is their IP or something? I just don't see how Sony are gonna make Holland's Spidey work outside of the MCU without zero references. You can bet Disney's lawyers are going to pay close attention to Spider-Man 3 and sniff out anything that might even be close to being interpreted as a MCU reference.
I don't see the argument that they will "do better." Merely that a film should be judged on its own merit, so we will see how the final films Sony is making will turn out. Of they're good, then Sony deserves credit for that. Much life they do the existing good Spider-Man films they already made. Yes, they should also be accountable for bad films too, but I am not judging a different movie cause another unconnected film they made prior sucked. That I do feel is backward thinking
In my particular case, I expect Sony to fail based on their track record. But that's nowhere close to wanting them to fail. I would be very happy for them to prove me wrong.
Exactly, and this outlook is fair. I have much this same attitude.
But I do want to point out, Sony hired the writers of Far From Home and reports state they want Watts back. Aka, same creative team behind these last film(s) everyone here mostly loved. Just no Feige. It's not just Rothman making a movie here. Much of how the next movie will turn out will involve who Sony hires for the movies. Rothman may bring in guys like Watts who he already knows and may give more freedom to. Who knows at this point? We just have to see how it all goes.
Yea ok but the last good live action Spider-Man film was in 2004for Sony . Everything else has been poor or decent. So it’s not backwards thinking it’s careful thinking. It’s not trusting a studio with your fav character when you already have dozens of times before and seen it fall flat on its face. So no I’m not going to be optimistic about this whole thing at all when I’ve seen with my own eyes what they can do.
Like going back to an ex after countless chances and they do one good thing and u trust them again. Sorry but no. Unless this Sony movie is really really good I’m absolutely convinced it will be another soulless cash grab like the asm franchise was. And I was hyped for those films.
Got nothing to do with mcu either. I wasn’t even a huge fan of it til spidey joined. But like someone else said before. It feels absolutely broken without him in it
I’m 90 percent sure they will be studio meddling and bad decisions. Yes we don’t know for sure but just look at the track record like I keep saying. It would benefit everyone to use careful thinking. If the film blows me away then like venom I’ll be wrong and I’ll have a bit of faith in Sony