Question about Wolverine, The Hulk and other regenerators . .

[primemover]

Has it ever been explained in the comic, handbook or anywhere else 'where' the matter comes from when these guys regenerate their destroyed and oftentimes departed flesh?

Is it reconstituted matter from somewhere else in the universe, is it the same matter that was blown off re-added, or are they adding matter to the universe?

Watching Heroes a few weeks ago when Claire cut off her little toe only to have it grow back, it struck me that there were now two toes . .

Disclaimer: I know it's a comic book, but I am just wondering if anybody has attempted in explaining this, and I apologize if it was discussed earlier, searching for anything Wolverine related returns way too many threads.

 

[Doc Destruction]

Well, Gekos do the same thing in reality without pulling matter from anywhere special.

 

[primemover]

Well, Gekos do the same thing in reality without pulling matter from anywhere special.

No, geckos get it from eating, which takes a good deal of time, they basically grow like any other organism.

Wolverine and Hulk on the hand, regrow in real time without any obvious intake of energy or matter.

 

[Ockham]

Has it ever been explained in the comic, handbook or anywhere else 'where' the matter comes from when these guys regenerate their destroyed and oftentimes departed flesh?

Is it reconstituted matter from somewhere else in the universe, is it the same matter that was blown off re-added, or are they adding matter to the universe?

Watching Heroes a few weeks ago when Claire cut off her little toe only to have it grow back, it struck me that there were now two toes . .

Disclaimer: I know it's a comic book, but I am just wondering if anybody has attempted in explaining this, and I apologize if it was discussed earlier, searching for anything Wolverine related returns way too many threads.

Yeah, Logan and Hulk seem to be able to generate tissue and organs out of nothing. When asked about how these characters are able to create matter and mass like that, the writers usually explain it by some vague mechanism of drawing matter from some alternative dimension.

 

[primemover]

Yeah, Logan and Hulk seem to be able to generate tissue and organs out of nothing. When asked about how these characters are able to create matter and mass like that, the writers usually explain it by some vague mechanism of drawing matter from some alternative dimension.

Yeah, another idea that bounded in my head, but that kind of opens up another can of worms, considering the universe being a closed system, or at least it should be

 

[The Question]

Well, the implication with The Hulk has been for a very long time that he absorbs matter from somewhere else when he transforms. Same might apply to his regenerations. With Logan, he may simply metabolise whatever food is in his system for the process.

 

[Ahura Mazda]

Lets not forget alread the Hulk obtains over 800 pounds in mass during the transformation and therefore his healing factor needs little explanation given people buy the transformation themselves.

Wolverine has no logical explanation either or he would not regenerate from a skeleton.

 

[ImrtlLimpWrist]

Wouldn't Logan regenerate the same way any human does -- except a bit more off the scale? How do humans regenerate new skin after a wound?

 

[wolvie2020]

Lets not forget alread the Hulk obtains over 800 pounds in mass during the transformation and therefore his healing factor needs little explanation given people buy the transformation themselves.

Wolverine has no logical explanation either or he would not regenerate from a skeleton.

Marc Guggenheim, (Wolvie writer,) himself has approached this problem.

Lots of people complained about his way of surviving a nuclear explosion, (written by Guggenheim,) and pointed out that Days of Future past storyline. MG then went on to point out when he was young and reading some Claremont issues, that Wolvie regenerated from one drop of blood, (b4 Days...)

He then went on to say that Wolvie has been written inconsistently over the years, (in terms of his healing factor)

He's trying to do his own spin on it now, turning it into more of a supernatural thing, and giving Wolvie a bit of a problem in terms of how far he can actually push his healing factor from now on.

While the move to make it more supernatural is a strange one, I'm liking the story so far, and it very much clears up the messy continuity of when he's pushed his factor insanley too far in the past

 

[ImrtlLimpWrist]

If it was supernatural, wouldn't that then discount it being a mutant gift? That seems like it would complicate the already convoluted explanations. Seems to me both Hulk and Wolverine, particularly Wolverine, storylines could get alot of plot out of needing time to recover from major wounds.

Question: if you stab Logan in the heart and leave the blade in, can he heal? Seems to me logically (I know, I know) he could not begin to regenerate around the blade. He'd need someone to come along and pull the blade out before he could start healing.

As I get older, I am realizing advanced healing factor is THE super-power to have!

 

[ang_hulk]

didnt somthing like that happen with him and he just grew another one?

 

[Ockham]

Wouldn't Logan regenerate the same way any human does -- except a bit more off the scale? How do humans regenerate new skin after a wound?

Nope, mass is a conserved quantity -- it cannot be created out of nothing. To grow, say, skin humans need to consume (at least) an equivalent amount of proteins and other nutrients, which the body then transforms into new tissue. But Wolverine can regenerate from a skeleton: first there is no flesh at all, then *poof* some muscles and tissue magically blink into existence.

 

[wolvie2020]

If it was supernatural, wouldn't that then discount it being a mutant gift? That seems like it would complicate the already convoluted explanations. Seems to me both Hulk and Wolverine, particularly Wolverine, storylines could get alot of plot out of needing time to recover from major wounds.

Okay: *spoilers!*

I won't go too much into it, but here goes...

Wolvie right now is stuck in 'purgatory,' (his version is a bar.) Doc Strange is trying to help him get out...

Strange tells him, (whether he likes to believe it or not,) during WW1 Wolvie was doing his thing and killing bad guys. He had his healing factor, and he always won.

Here's the short version of the weird part; the angel of death comes along, and comes to kill Wolvie, as he seems like a worthy adversary. (I can't remember how many other people had to do this in the story, if any.) He really looked to taking Wolvie on, as it looked like fun to him.

Low and behold, Wolvie beats him, seriously pissing death off. From then on, whenever Wolvie went past his healing factor and died, he fought death and won. Pissing death off, yet death felt a bit shaken up, from having lost again and again in future encounters.

As a twist though, Wolvie had always REALLY WANTED to come back, and his spirit was strong. Turns out, every time he 'dies,' his spirit gets weaker and weaker... This time Wolvie's spirit is really not that up to it, and loses!

So now he's stuck.... It's pretty obvious he'll come back, but here's the message from now on. He's pushed it too far, and there's only so much his spirit, (soul,) can take before it truly keels over, and his body goes with him.

This attempts to explain how his healing factor at times has gone past science, and how he's managed to come back. (E.g. When Claremont made him come back from a drop of blood.)

It also give a new danger for him... From now on, he may not come back as he's put himself through such a beating, mentally AND physically over x no. of years.

There's only so long he can cheat (the angel of,) death, and technicaly right now, it's not looking so good for him as he subconciously can't be arsed at the mo.

While it may sound crazy, and I'm not too fond of mixing this kind of stuff with science, it's always in the delivery. I never thought I'd like the idea of Bucky coming back, but it was done so well, it changed my mind.

I've really enjoyed the 1st 2 parts so far, and if Guggenheim delivers the whole way, this is something I'd really like, and it'll tidy up the amount of confusing times where Wolvie shouldn't have come back.

When Guggenheim wrote Wolvie coming back from a skeleton in his 'Civil War,' arc, he had this planned all along in the future. Which I think is cool too.

 

[HandOfFate]

Lots of people complained about his way of surviving a nuclear explosion, (written by Guggenheim,) and pointed out that Days of Future past storyline. MG then went on to point out when he was young and reading some Claremont issues, that Wolvie regenerated from one drop of blood, (b4 Days...)

IIRC, Wolverine was able to regenerate from a drop of blood because of the energy within the crystal.

http://www.uncannyxmen.net/db/issues/showquestion.asp?fldAuto=2423

Normally, he really shouldn't be able to regenerate from a drop of blood.

 

[primemover]

As I get older, I am realizing advanced healing factor is THE super-power to have!

Not really sure, because most of these regenerators feel the pain they incur, which would completely and utterly suck

 

[ImrtlLimpWrist]

I am reading the current Wolverine story arc. Not really digging it though. I am all for the healing factor being a mutant gift, not supernatural. I'd like to see it take Logan time to recover from serious wounds (like he needed to do in the Ultimate X-Men arc when he hid out in Peter Parker's basement for weeks). I don't like the "ejecting" of bullets that they showed in X2 and the previously-mentioned Ult storyline. I think his system should break them down somehow. That said, I think if someone lodges an arrow or sword or knife in his heart, it ought to put him on "hold" until it is removed. His recovery from the nuclear hit post-Civil War was a bit troubling to me as well. I think the 'Highlander' series would be a good role model for the healing factor of Wolverine.

 

[kane9321]

Okay: *spoilers!*

I won't go too much into it, but here goes...

Wolvie right now is stuck in 'purgatory,' (his version is a bar.) Doc Strange is trying to help him get out...

Strange tells him, (whether he likes to believe it or not,) during WW1 Wolvie was doing his thing and killing bad guys. He had his healing factor, and he always won.

Here's the short version of the weird part; the angel of death comes along, and comes to kill Wolvie, as he seems like a worthy adversary. (I can't remember how many other people had to do this in the story, if any.) He really looked to taking Wolvie on, as it looked like fun to him.

Low and behold, Wolvie beats him, seriously pissing death off. From then on, whenever Wolvie went past his healing factor and died, he fought death and won. Pissing death off, yet death felt a bit shaken up, from having lost again and again in future encounters.

As a twist though, Wolvie had always REALLY WANTED to come back, and his spirit was strong. Turns out, every time he 'dies,' his spirit gets weaker and weaker... This time Wolvie's spirit is really not that up to it, and loses!

So now he's stuck.... It's pretty obvious he'll come back, but here's the message from now on. He's pushed it too far, and there's only so much his spirit, (soul,) can take before it truly keels over, and his body goes with him.

This attempts to explain how his healing factor at times has gone past science, and how he's managed to come back. (E.g. When Claremont made him come back from a drop of blood.)

It also give a new danger for him... From now on, he may not come back as he's put himself through such a beating, mentally AND physically over x no. of years.

There's only so long he can cheat (the angel of,) death, and technicaly right now, it's not looking so good for him as he subconciously can't be arsed at the mo.

While it may sound crazy, and I'm not too fond of mixing this kind of stuff with science, it's always in the delivery. I never thought I'd like the idea of Bucky coming back, but it was done so well, it changed my mind.

I've really enjoyed the 1st 2 parts so far, and if Guggenheim delivers the whole way, this is something I'd really like, and it'll tidy up the amount of confusing times where Wolvie shouldn't have come back.

When Guggenheim wrote Wolvie coming back from a skeleton in his 'Civil War,' arc, he had this planned all along in the future. Which I think is cool too.

I was like.."huh" angel of death..wha

 

[Doc Destruction]

That sounds awful.

 

[shapeshifter]

they regenerate from the pounds of bull**** the writers spew out from time to time

 

[ImrtlLimpWrist]

That sounds awful.

Pretty much it is.

 

[fifthfiend]

MG then went on to point out when he was young and reading some Claremont issues, that Wolvie regenerated from one drop of blood

As has been pointed out that's a dumb example to use, there was a specific explanation for that which isn't repeated anywhere else.

Wolverine has just been arbitrarily upgraded from "body that just happens to be more efficient at healing and resisting disease than normal people" to "infinite capability to regrow himself out of thin air, or alternately the void of space" for no particular discernable reason (other than he's one of like two comics characters that the modern comics industry can figure out how to sell). Eventually he'll get upgraded to being stronger than the Hulk, and probably shooting lasers out of his eyes or some such horse****.

 

[dabig2]

With Hulk it's "easy" sorta. Just say gamma radiation. The same gamma radiation that has him gaining 1000 lbs of muscle in seconds. Infinite supply of gamma radiation he can produce means infinite amount of energy at his disposal to do what he does.

With wolverine it's a little more tricky. It's his mutant ability along with some supernatural bull****.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

That sounds awful.

Yeah. I'm pretty sure Wolverine just shot himself in the head to get there, too. Kind of throws Guggenheim's ideas about the healing factor in the crapper, really, since even at his weakest portrayals, Logan could recover from bullet wounds and headshots without too much trouble.

 

[Varient]

Has it ever been explained in the comic, handbook or anywhere else 'where' the matter comes from when these guys regenerate their destroyed and oftentimes departed flesh?

Is it reconstituted matter from somewhere else in the universe, is it the same matter that was blown off re-added, or are they adding matter to the universe?

Watching Heroes a few weeks ago when Claire cut off her little toe only to have it grow back, it struck me that there were now two toes . .

Disclaimer: I know it's a comic book, but I am just wondering if anybody has attempted in explaining this, and I apologize if it was discussed earlier, searching for anything Wolverine related returns way too many threads.

Back in an "Old" Story of the "new" X-men,.... It was explained that given sufficient energy,.. Wolverine could regenerate from a drop of blood.

Using that as a baseline it might be safe to say that the best way to kill wolverine is to give him a fatal wound in a place where there is not enough energy to support his regen,....
(Goodluck - "im pretty sure that this doesn't occur naturaly anytime between the big bang and the big crush.)

V.

 

[Varient]

Oh.

Nevermind.

EVERYTHING I would've brought to this convo has already been consumed,.. masticated, and on it's way to being digested.

I'll hjust read along to see if you guys come to a concensus.


V.