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Discussion in 'Batman Begins' started by LexCorp, Feb 25, 2006.
Ya know, the cape isn't attached to his neck.
Well, he wouldn't be glyding for long distances. More like slowling his decent when he jumps from smaller buildings and fire escapes. As for the clasps, yes, it would make it easyer to get de-attached. But you could make one that would hold sturdy enough and then de-attach when you pressed it correctly.
We never actually see him detach it either. As far as we know, it's like that so he doesn't break his neck.
Yes it is - for the intents and purposes of people arguing why it wouldn't work as a glider, it is. You could get picky and say it's attached at the collarbone area, you can say it's not tied *around* his neck, but really it's attached at his neck.
And more importantly, it's not attached anywhere else. There's just no way such a set-up would allow you to glide. The balance would be all wrong and more importantly the cape is just WAY too small to be of use as a glider OR parachute, It won't slow you down significantly or allow you to glide. It's a very small fraction of the size of a parachute or hang-glide - even the smallest size of hang-glider (which is onlyuseful for a very light person anyway, not a 200+ pound man in armour).
No, the cape-glider in Begins is 100% fantasy, pure and simple. It's not realistic *at all*, anyone who thinks it could be is deluded. Yes, in future you may be able to get a memory fabric that could stiffen - but it'll NEVER, EVER work as a glider as seen in the film. It's way too small, and the wrong configuration.
You ever see old silent footage of guys trying to fly or glide by strapping various contraptions (wings etc) to their backs? None of them flew or glided, and I'm sure a few of them died. That's what would happen with Batman the first time he tried it. At the very least he'd break some bones, assuming he didn't fall too far.
But, it's not attached to his neck. It isn't wrapped around it or at all stuck on his neck. It's more, for all intensive purproses, more around his shoulders than his neck.
Btw, it is worth mentioning that the technolgy he uses in the film.....it's still being developed. It's not like it's something you can buy in the market store or anything......atleast not yet.
The cape is pretty long too. I mean, dragging on the floor long.
Depends on how it's drawn or shown. In Begins, it isn't wrapped around the neck.
Who said anything about long distance glyding or parachuting from a plane? I'm talking about slowing your decend when you jump down from fire escapes or shorter buildings in cities.
In the movie, it streatched out. And like I said, I'm not tal;king about long distance glyiding. Just slowing you down enough to jump from heights that Batman would be jumping from in a city, and giving you enough lift to make large jumps.
I'm sure if it were properly made, it would slow them down enough to do what I'm talking about.
I think the cape i the right size, look at the photo some of you posted! Thats bigger than the picture of the hand glider so why not? And he only uses to jump of buildings and slow him down
I'snt there a shot of him practising with finger clasps in begins? Idon't know coz I just lent my dvd to a mate but I'm sure hes extending and folding them up, If he has this atached inside the cape at the point where his hands would be then he could just slip them through.
When I was filming beyond legend I put metal rods at the end of the cape and thre was a loop to hold it up at the right point, the cape it's self was made out of a double sheet attached to another single sheet so it was bloody massive, obviosly this was only for a visual shot but I' can see how a proper billionaire could make this cape idea work as a glider as a protype.
It even says in the film that they were too expensive for the military to buy so of cause with the right funding it could be feesable.
But you would have to have an atachment at the feet!
I didn't say it was wrapped around, I said it wasn't. But it's attached more or less at the neck all the same, or the collarbone which is near enough. It's attached securely to the body armour but that's not the point - the point is that this is *completely* the wrong place for it to be attached at all for it to work as a glider.
Fair enough. I was just thinking about it as its presented in Begins. Slowing the fall as a parachute only (no gliding) would have been far more believeable if that's what Begins had shown. Still, the cape's still got too small a sureface area and also the wrong shape to actually catch a decent abount of air.
I really don't think it's going to significantly slow anyone down to the point that it would make a difference whether you could land safely or not from a great height. As big as it appears in the movie, it's a fraction the size of a parachute or glider. No matter how much you might want Batman to be possible, you can't argue with physics.
Check out the calculator at the bottom of this page to see how huge a parachute would have to be to successfully slow a 100 kilogram man. Or, plug in various final speds and see how fast you'd hit the ground if you were wearing a cape the size of Batman's (and I'd be very generous if I said 6 square metres was as big as you could have the cape.
EVen if the cape was big enough, attaching it at the upper body would provide no stability. The entire weight of the human body needs to be suspended at some point below the canopy/wings and balanced precisely to remain stable.
Wish all you want, but it's just not possible. It's pure whimsy.
What about the pockets underneath the cape? Don't they help create the stabilty needed?
Plus, dropping wouldn't really be a problem if you know when and where...he has to release the cape is all.
Either way though......the cape-glider is waaayyy more believable than having him toss a batarang attached to a cable and swinging around......lol.
lately,i ve been wishing we lived in a world with masked superheroes and mutants. maybe thats the next level of human development.
Only whimsy when we talk about just the cape. I mentioned only the sense of presence when I first posted that pic of the bat "wings" that started this little chat. He could still have a cape which very probably may cause more problems that it solves but keep it purely for presence. I still think given the right time, money etc it would be possible if only for a short period of time.
Maybe, but I think that due to Batman being attached to the cape at the front of it (rather than in the middle) he'd just cause the whole thing to tilt the wrong way and go into a nosedive. The whole configuration of a man atatched to some wings in that way is just the complete wrong shape. And like I said, I just don't think those pockets are catching nearly enough air to significantly slow you down anyway.
There was an episode of Mythbusters where they tried stuff like this - seeing how much you could slow your fall. They were trying to make parachutes out of plywood, but the fact is everything they cape up with had far too small a surface area and nowhere near enough stability. They just ended up going into death-spirals, with the poor crash-dummy ending up worse for it - the same would have happened with ultra-light memory fabric too.
Parachutes and hang-gliders are the size and shapes they are because that's what works. I found out that 70-something people have dies trying to use more wing-like configurations.
Try dropping an umbrella from a great height. Does it float down perfectly level? No, because the weight of the handle is distributed the wrong way, it's too high up. But if you converted it in to a parachute of some kind, with the handle hanging much lower from some cords, it will stay stable because the weight is distrubuted much lower, changing the centre of gravity.
Running and driving are the only truly believeable modes of transport for Batman, period. Those are the only things that would work in real life. If he wanted to fall a distance safely he'd need a real parachute, if he wanted to glide he'd need a hang-glider and if he wanted to get to the top of a building with a rope he'd have to climb it himself, not be reeled up by a tiny gun.
But there's nothing wrong with having the cloak to maintain a certain visual presence (and to help stay hidden) - it's just that it'd be 100% useless for any kind of travel - even a slowed fall.
Probably the best actual practical use for a cape like Batman's is as a long-range whipping weapon. Just weight the tips (maybe even put small blades there).
I dont think he could have a real bat mobile either. Not one that stands out. It would be way to easy to track by the authorities and it would also be all over the news in seconds. He would need a normal looking car but have it full of gadgets like Bonds cars.
Yeah. And who said anything about falling from a great hight? I'm talking about jumping down from fire escapes and shorter buildings.
Grappling guns to exist. They are larger than the one shown in the comics, and there's no way he could just hold onto it without dislocating his shoulder. But, if he atatched the reel to his belt, he could probably reel himself in and not simply clime up. The military has models that work on a similar principal right now.
But they'll never be small enough for one guy to easily hold and run around with. Computers can always be made smaller as technology advances, but something mechanical that has to have a certain amount of power can only ever be so big.
In no case is bigger than the hang glider. Why do you say that?
the desert eagle magnum is more powerfull than most rifles and its a hangun so I beleive you can have a grapple gun but you have (unfortunatly) convinced me about the cape
Well, what if......and I believe BEGINS had this.....there is a certain more amount of weight (from the exo-skeleton) at the bottom side of the cape...so that, when made rigid....it would create a more balanced distribution throughout the cape. From his shoulders, down to the bottom of the cape.
Also, I think it's worth mentioning.......really, the only time I thought the cape-glider seemed to go beyond the realm of possibilty (and in no way did I hate it, I loved it) was at the end.....when he is really high up there in the air. Every other time throughout the film, I felt the cape was pretty believable.
I get what your saying about the landing......and I think we KINDA saw an example of that with how abrupt, violent and pretty crazy the glider was turned off when Batman met up with Ra's and his ninjas in the Narrows.
Btw, he does wear an armored suit.....and, in the realm of the Begins movie, it would protect him from a pretty good fall. Bruising would occur, for sure though.....
Probably not.....but, it's not impossible.
That's because believable is not realistic necessarily.
That's why BB works. It's believable. The "realistic" thing is just a *********ory word.
lol........who the hell mas.......uhhh....forget it, never mind
Yeah, realistic is a pretty crazy word to try and use for films. Biographies are probably the only film to probably use that fairly.
Believable is the goal.
Well, I do agree that the cape would be more or less useless for great hights. Thing is, I was never talking about great heights. I was talking about jumping from short buildings in cities or a point in a fire escape that's somewhat low to the ground. In that situation, the cape plus whatever body armor the guy's probably wearing would offer suficient protection.