"Romeo & Juliet Return?": The Official Jean Grey/Cyclops Debate

Discussion in 'X-Men: Days of Future Past' started by Lightning Strykez!, Feb 17, 2013.

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  1. GuestStar2004

    GuestStar2004 Well-Known Member

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    anyone read this James Marsden interview from over a year or something ago about if he would ever return to Xmen (my apologies if its already been posted before) XD

    http://screenrant.com/james-marsden-x-men-4-5-cyclops-death-benm-108642/

     
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  2. DarknessOfDeath

    DarknessOfDeath Rebel Scoundrel

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    In X2, Jean tells Logan that she loves Scott and Logan questions her with "Do you?" I wanted to slap him.
     
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  3. GuestStar2004

    GuestStar2004 Well-Known Member

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    then in X3 she kills scott the love of her life and then tries to seduce logan, then is killed by logan at the end and has her tomb stone next to scotts

    i... i... dunno
     
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    Last edited: Feb 21, 2013
  4. DarknessOfDeath

    DarknessOfDeath Rebel Scoundrel

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    Mind you, she wasn't herself when she seduced Logan, it was the Phoenix who was...horny (am I allowed to say that?) lol... then again, it was still Jean - its just that the Phoenix had the upper hand when Jean came to making out with Logan.
     
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  5. venus_ice

    venus_ice Well-Known Member

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    #130
  6. DarknessOfDeath

    DarknessOfDeath Rebel Scoundrel

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    Good for him...though...what does that mean for DOFP? :(
     
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  7. X-Maniac

    X-Maniac High Evolutionary

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    It means he isn't a major part of it, obviously. Which we all knew anyway. Why act sad and disappointed when

    a) Cyclops is dead in the post-X3 dystopia

    b) Cyclops isn't born yet in the 60s and is just a kid in the 70s

    c) Marsden's name hasn't been among those announced on Twitter.
     
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  8. DarknessOfDeath

    DarknessOfDeath Rebel Scoundrel

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    I guess...its all the above. lol
     
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  9. SterlingDee

    SterlingDee Well-Known Member

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    I'm going to have to rewatch X2. It's my favourite X-men movie but in terms of the ensemble, I remember Rogue, Prof X, Storm, Cyclops (as usual) being shortchanged. But Iceman, Pyro, and Jean did get more.

    And I disagree about Famke - she probably got her best material of all in X3 (playing what is essentially a schizophrenic character and taking out Prof X). She does so many "turns" in the med lab scene with Logan that I'm sure Famke must have been satisfied with it. The problem is that her character turned catatonic in the second act after setting Phoenix up as a significant character.

    Yes, Kitty doesn't have a storyline, but she still has more to do than the previous incarnations of Kitty in X1 & X2. Storm's role is of absolutely no substance in X3, but we at least get a bit more of her personality.

    Definitely not arguing that I like X3 though, but I do feel it was more of an ensemble movie.
     
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  10. SterlingDee

    SterlingDee Well-Known Member

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    I don't think anyone was expecting him to be a major part of the film (maybe delusional fans), but he would still be able to shoot a cameo if needed. I'm sure he would jump at the chance.

    Famke still hasn't announced a project...so my hopes rest there (not expecting her to be in it though!)
     
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  11. X-Maniac

    X-Maniac High Evolutionary

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    Of course. A cameo would still be no problem. And I'm sure the fans would love it, especially if Scott and Jean were somehow alive at the end of the movie as a teaser for the next film.

    The disappointment will be in not seeing Scott and Jean/Phoenix unleash their mighty powers against Sentinels (on the assumption they are not going to be around to do just that) so the filmmakers would have to give the pair of them plenty to unleash their powers on in the next movie!
     
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  12. GuestStar2004

    GuestStar2004 Well-Known Member

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    but how could you make cyclops and jeans comeback matter in terms of the ending? if they just appeared at the end and is just like we pressed the reset button and now these 2 are back... why would it have an impact? they ain't wolverine

    maybe if say storm is killed on or off screen and a scene with Xavier where he says about how hard it is for him after the deaths of jean,scott,storm and maybe beast and how he can't stand to lose anymore Xmen then at the end they fix the timeline and all the Xmen are alive again so it wouldn't seem odd to bring back cyclops and jean
     
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  13. The Batman

    The Batman The Dark Knight

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    I disagree with this. Like I said, the Avengers movie treats their characters with a level of respect not seen in the X-Films. For example, When I watch The Avengers, Captain America actually feels like the leader of the team, while in comparison, I don't feel that with Cyclops. The comic book characterizations for Cyclops may indeed be in the first three X Films, but they're done in a way that leaves many underwhelmed.



    http://www.aintitcool.com/node/4048

    If that's to be believed, Caviezel passed on the role because Fox, as we all know, seem hell bent on revolving things around Wolverine. Around the time of X3, Zak Penn and Simon Kinberg would answer questions for fans on a fansite. As the release date of Last Stand came closer and it was blatantly obvious that Cyclops was gonna get screwed, Penn admitted that Fox has been Wolverine-centered since day one.

    Chris Reeve wasn't a "film leading man" either. Just because you aren't a name dosen't mean you can't posess leading man qualities.



    At best, I could say his role in X1 was decent. X2 he was barely there, given a five second fight (that Marsden had to ask for, by the way) that was mostly off screen, a five second battle with Jean, before being given a good dramatic scene with JEan's death...before they decided to focus more on Logan's reaction.



    I'm pretty sure when Cyclops left the team it usually has something to do with Jean being dead. In fact, when Logan and Jean have a "romance", its usually right under Scotts nose.

    Still, it dosent't change the fact that the Comics successfully convey that her heart belongs with Cyclops.

    The difference is that Marvel dosent crap on Cyclops when he's being replaced. And the difference is that Cyclops always comes back.

    Logical progression or not, its done under such crappy circumstances that you can't help but think they just "gave them Cyclops' role".



    The X Franchise is an ensemble the same way Star Wars was....yeah, there's a lot of characters, but there's obviously a centerpiece. For Star Wars, its Luke. For X-Men, its Wolverine. The difference is that Star Wars actually tried to make much of their characters awesome.



    I disagree. He was undermined from the start, really. It's just that his X1 portrayal was still decent in spite of that.



    Like I said, even if the aspects are there, its done in such a mediocre manner that it feels nonexistent.



    The fact that people still see it that was is a mark of the filmmakers inability to give Cyclops better material.

    That's because Xavier and Storm aren't entirely defined by their relationship with Wolverine in the films. Thats what happens when you get little screentime for 2 out of 3 movies.

    I never got the impression that film Jean DID love Scott. I admit this is my opinion on the matter and not absolute fact, but I personally feel that film Jean was with Scott because he was dependable.
     
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  14. psylockolussus

    psylockolussus Well-Known Mutant

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    Yeah just save them for X4 or X5. That way they could get a proper comeback w/o the First Class cast sharing the screentime with them.
     
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  15. wobbly

    wobbly Occasional Scribbler

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    What annoyed me more was Logan telling Scott at the end "she made her choice...and she chose you"

    Nice one Logan...Guy is in mourning for the love of his life and you basically go telling him she was considering other options!!
     
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  16. DarknessOfDeath

    DarknessOfDeath Rebel Scoundrel

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    ... maybe I should change my sig :p lol Whats a good Jean/Scott quote?
     
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  17. psylockolussus

    psylockolussus Well-Known Mutant

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    Cyke: How?
    Jean: I dunno
     
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  18. DarknessOfDeath

    DarknessOfDeath Rebel Scoundrel

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    I think what they should have said was this:

    Scott: Jean? I...can't believe it. You're alive. How?
    Jean: I should still be dead...I don't know how to explain it.
    Scott: You don't have to...I mean...All this time you’ve haunted me in my dreams, calling out to me for help. I couldn’t stand myself not being able to see you again...I had to see you and yet, you’re here...I've missed you.
    Jean: Oh Scott...*hugs him*
     
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  19. The Guard

    The Guard Well-Known Member

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    I feel like some of you are stuck in the late 70’s or something when you whine about things like “Wolverine standing in a position of leadership”. Wolverine has been one of the X-Men’s leaders since the late eighties. He’s an immensely popular character.

    And there are plenty of ways to bring Scott and Jean back, or to make up for what happened in X3.

    I honestly can’t take people who say things like “X3 was awful, all of it” seriously. I just can’t anymore. There's too much to like about it.

    No it wasn't. If anything it was more of an ensemble film than X2. I'm not sure why anyone would argue this point.

    In X3, more characters were spotlighted, for more general screentime, and we also found out more about those characters than we did in X2, and saw them change more than we had previously as characters. We also saw them interacting AS an ensemble more than we did in the two previous films, when character interactions were largely one on one, two on one, etc, save for a few key sequences. In X3, we saw groups of characters interacting together much more than we previously had.

    X3, despite its flaws, still had some of the best character work and "spotlight moments" of the trilogy.

    Arguable. X3 really took it to another level, one that X-MEN and X2 only flirted with writingwise.

    The same can be said of X3. Every character has a purpose and an opportunity to shine. In fact, I'd say writingwise, the characters have more of a defined and significant arc to their characters in X3 than in any previous film.

    I dunno, that power display against Jean at the end is pretty darned impressive.

    Earlier scripts had bits where an imprisoned Cyclops would have encountered an imprisoned Angel in Stryker's base.

    Kitty absolutely had a story. She was the youngest, most unproven X-Man, and she had the romantic angle with Bobby as well.

    "Died on its arse"? Whatever that means.

    I don't even know what "thrown under the bus" means in this context.

    Iceman wasn't any more cardboard than he has generally been portrayed. If anything, he was given a bit more depth, related to his struggle/dedication as an X-Man.

    Colossus may well have been mostly cardboard, but he still had a larger, more integral, and far more pivotal role than he did in X2.

    Again, whatever that means.

    Ok. That's nine characters. And in X3:

    Cyclops. Jean. Xavier. Magneto. Mystique. Storm. Wolverine. Kitty. Beast. Iceman. Rogue. Angel. Pyro.

    All thirteen of those characters were shown evolving, or were developed and/or had changed somehow as characters by the end of X3.

    Ive been reading 60's coming these past months, and Cyclops is a more likeable character than what Singer showed on X1 and X2.

    The trilogy hasn't done any of them justice. Just as THE AVENGERS hasn't done the characters in its universe justice, and Nolan's Batfilms haven't really done the characters in its films justice.

    That's not really a solid argument against the overall treatment of that character. It's a tall order to really flesh out a comic book character in an ensemble franchise.

    Absolutely. And even that "catatonic" Phoenix had some layers to it.

    Not true. It's got a lot more substance than her role in either previous film had. She was developed as a teacher, a leader, a warrior, and a "spokesperson" for mutant rights.

    Then I guess you didn't pay attention. The movies made it pretty clear that Scott was their field leader.

    And when he left the team...its because he thought she was dead.

    And when they had a romance...it was under Scott's nose.

    The movies pretty clearly did so as well.

    So none of the characters in the X-Men franchise were "awesome"?

    How was he undermined from the start?

    "It feels nonexistent"? That’s absolute nonsense.

    No, it's a mark of people's inability to properly interpret a film and remember the specifics of a film.

    Scott isn’t defined with his relationship with Wolverine, either...what's your point?

    Then again...you weren't paying attention. At all.

    And if she was with Scott in part because he was dependable? So what?
     
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  20. summers1055

    summers1055 Well-Known Member

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    If Hugh Jackman could do it, why can't James Marsden?

    the filming of both their movies is off by a couple weeks. Who knows when Bryan Singer is shooting the future timeline, apparently Hugh Jackman still has a huge role in days of future past despite shooting this movie which production began yesterday.
    Hugh Jackman, Jake Gyllenhaal begin shooting 'Prisoners'

    Published Thursday, Feb 21 2013, 10:21am EST | By Emma Dibdin | Add







    Hugh Jackman and Jake Gyllenhaal star in Prisoners, which began production this week in Georgia.

    The new thriller from Incendies director Denis Villeneuve stars Jackman as a man whose 6-year-old daughter has gone missing.




    [​IMG]
     
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    Last edited: Feb 22, 2013
  21. summers1055

    summers1055 Well-Known Member

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    #146
  22. summers1055

    summers1055 Well-Known Member

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    Also, Jennifer Lawrence is starring in a movie which begins production this coming month. Don't give up faith on James Marsden, that's two of the leading stars in days of future past in the same predicament as James Marsden.

    http://screenrant.com/jennifer-lawrence-david-russell-abscam-ends-earth-movie/ (link to article)

    [​IMG]

    Meanwhile, THR has learned Lawrence is committing to The Ends of the Earth, with Russell planning to direct, possibly once the pair completes shooting their ABSCAM project (which begins production in New York and Boston next month). Todd Black, Jason Blumenthal and Steve Tisch (The Pursuit of Happyness) are producing, with a script from Chris Terrio – the Argo screenwriter who is “competing” for the same Best Adapted Screenplay Oscar as Russell is for Silver Linings Playbook.


    Jennifer Lawrence Appearing in David O. Russell’s Next Two Movies

    1 day ago by Sandy Schaefer
     
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  23. Octoberist

    Octoberist point blank

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    Also, with comedies, they tend to be quick shoots anyway. Especially with Anchorman which has a short post-production schedule since it's being released later this year.
     
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  24. psylockolussus

    psylockolussus Well-Known Mutant

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    The question is why would Jean and Cyclops get resurrected if the X-Men prevented the Sentinels-event that is going to happen in the future. Especially they didn't die because of a Sentinel.

    Unless they go back to the past, and confront/stop young Jean Grey for being a bad Jean grey in the future, then you could prevent their death that happened in X3.
     
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  25. The Infernal

    The Infernal Mky Mk

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    Isn't the event they're trying to stop in the past? If it is then preventing that could have an effect on those events. You really wouldn't need to explain them being alive since the entire timeline would have changed.
     
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