Justice League Rumor: Bale may be back as Batman in JL - Part 1

[Rodrigo90]

I'm confident in MOS becoming a BO success, so I'm looking forward to a rebooted Batman.

However. ..I look at my TDKT Blu Rays...and think what a waste

 

[shauner111]

I wouldn't call it a waste it's still a completed trilogy in my eyes and a great interpretation. We just have to look at it forever, as a closed off "realistic" (whatever that means) universe that payed homage to crime films & writers like Frank Miller/Jeph Loeb/Alan Moore of the 80s-90s graphic novels.

But yeah, the sad part is never getting more from it. What I would like to see happen in the future are comics released by others who feel like adding in some stories or expanding on a post-TDKR world. Or filling in gaps between the movies.

But after MOS im REALLY looking forward to new Batman. As much as Bale/Cavill would blow my mind, Cavill would decimate a 40 something year old Bruce like it's nobodys business. Arkham-Batman in his prime would give this Kal-El one hell of a challenge. We just need the right actor.

 

[Rodrigo90]

It's like the comics I guess.
Their spin on things has been told.

I noticed Goyer praised Superman Earth One, and MOS has a lot of similarities with it.

I wonder if he would write Batman in JL and base that on that respective Earth One?

 

[DChero]

I'm confident in MOS becoming a BO success, so I'm looking forward to a rebooted Batman.

However. ..I look at my TDKT Blu Rays...and think what a waste

Same here. It almost seems like a slap in the face since that was a character that was this generation's Batman. Now they feel meaningless since they've been labelled 'out of date' a year after they ended. Sure they're great movies, but the feeling of them being retconned sucks. Hopefully the next one(s) is better?

 

[Shikamaru]

It's like the comics I guess.
Their spin on things has been told.

I noticed Goyer praised Superman Earth One, and MOS has a lot of similarities with it.

I wonder if he would write Batman in JL and base that on that respective Earth One?

I hope to God they don't. Earth One Batman is a spoiled brat who never left Gotham and whose abilities are even weaker than Nolan's Batman (at least least tied in the best case scenario).

Same here. It almost seems like a slap in the face since that was a character that was this generation's Batman. Now they feel meaningless since they've been labelled 'out of date' a year after they ended. Sure they're great movies, but the feeling of them being retconned sucks. Hopefully the next one(s) is better?

Don't blame WB for it. It is entirely Nolan's fault. WB has tried over and over again for the past 8 years to try to get Nolan's Batman in a shared universe but Nolan was always there to shut down any chances of that happening. He went as far as to try to stop the last JL movie from being made because was a pseudo-sequel to his Batman (no, not even the direct version but a pseudo version). Also, probably part of the reason why he ended TDKR the way he did was so that no one else touches his franchise.

 

[shauner111]

Over and over for the last 8 years? there's no evidence of that.

 

[Shikamaru]

Over and over for the last 8 years? there's no evidence of that.

We know it occurred at least 3 times in the past 8 years:

1) Back in 2005/2006 when WB wanted to do a WF film with Bale and Brandon Routh. Nolan intervened and said he is not fine with it.

2) Back in 2007/2008. Nolan did not want JL Mortal to happen because they were going to use the same Batman from his universe, even though he was going to be played by a different actor (Armie Hammer).

3) 2012/2013. The whole "Let us bring Bale back for JL" situation we've been talking about for months.


These are the only ones we know for sure. I am going to assume that it happened at least a few times behind closed doors. He has also stated over and over again that his Batman is stand-alone for the past 8 years.

 

[kvz5]

Nolan doesn't like to share.

 

[Great Mind(s)]

It just seems so stupid. I don't want to see another Batman origin, especially one that is due to Superman's influence! Wtf is that? TDKR had one more chance to be redeemed but Nolan would rather be remembered as the pretentious director who feels his films are some kind of special work of art that can't be touched. Nolan, the guy that brought us "such a realistic Batman" who the GA could identify with, then royally screws the story and ends it on the most unrealistic note of the saga.

Why ? For shock value? Because he was tired of it? Goyer had writers block and came up with MOS. Should have just scrapped TDKR, made MOS followed by WF.

I hate unnecessary reboots. It's like Nolan is the strict father and Goyer and Snyder are his two submissive kids who aren't allowed to touch daddy's convertible.

And this isn't just disappointment for not seeing Bale with Cavill (which half of it is) but it's also just the fact that TDKT is hollow thanks to TDKR. If it was just the beginning I'd love it. Now it sits on my shelf feeling like an obsolete first attempt at being this generation's Batman series. Why would anyone want to end their saga having half the fans disappointed by such a radical betrayal of the previous two movies? Anyone can be Batman that's the point? Since when? It seems like Nolan grabbed a piece of dialogue from BB and twisted it around to fit as a McGuffin to end his saga.

So is the plan to reboot these movies every couple years? In what, two years we'll have a brand new Bat-franchise to compare to the one that just ended? It made sense to reboot a series after it's been dead for years, it makes things seem fresh again. But rebooting immediately as if Batman is a drug and we're all junkies in need of a fix no matter where the **** came from?

This is why movies are starting to feel dead to me and TV is on the rise to being the more respectable form of storytelling. You spend hours and hours with characters, seeing them evolve with every episode. No need to retell an origin over again because a lazy writer writes himself into a corner. Because that's not how things work in real life. You don't fold your arms and nod your head and you're in a new universe looking young and hip.
I want to be attached to these characters and feel they're real. So when I see a rebooted Batman so soon, it's not something I'm interested in because it takes me out of the element. I'm reminded how it's all just fiction like a play.


How many "cool modern" takes of characters have to be constantly pumped out of Hollywood? Can we expect another cool hip badass version of Superman in a few years too?
It's been less than a year since the last DC universe ended and we're already in the next one with a NEW (old) Wayne Enterprises. Should we start planning the rebooted rebooted DCU?? Gotta keep up with the times!

 

[shauner111]

Sorry bud, but im gonna have to disagree with you on that post.

Nolan told his story, that ending (at least the image of a happy Bruce finally letting go of his past) was in their minds since 2005ish. It's their story, Nolan's the filmmaker and that's the way it should be. Whether people like the end or not, he wasn't a slave to the studio. He didn't try to keep it going even if others could see more use for Bale, so he can make more money. It would have been easy to countless more films with his Batman, and he stood his ground. That's the way it should be. I RESPECT Nolan more than ever now, even though im still sad to see my dream of Bale/Cavill fighting & teaming up never coming to fruition.

With MOS, they may not have written the script with a shared universe in mind butit's still the first origin film and during post-production/filming they came up with the decision to expand. They got it early.

Nolan has always stood his ground and fought the studio to keep TDKT a closed thing. How can you not respect him for that? A real director should be pretentious in his/her work and be as self indulgent as they want.

I don't know if you've seen MOS Great Mind(s) but I see a rebooted Arkham Batman with Superman and the rest of the League more than Bale's Batman. Even if I still see Bale's Batman working with ONLY Cavill's Superman + Lex. I would stretch it to maybe another like Wonder Woman, but then if you have Themyscira why not stretch it to Atlantis? If you have that much depth in Krypton, why not stretch that to doing the same with Oa? If Kryptonians get get away from their enemies with that kind of take off speed, why not enhance that into the super-speed we see in Flash?? If they're giving us Zod, Brainiac....why not take it to a JL villain like Darkseid?

That's the thing here man. What if God forbid one of these future solo films is a complete disaster in both box-office and critically speaking? It wouldn't just be 2 giant superheroes...it's several. 1 piece of garbage and it effects Nolan's trilogy which to him and a lot of people were brilliant from start to finish.

Im gonna be honest. When I was representing Bale for this...I couldn't see anymore Batman movies, just using him in the team-ups. And I couldn't see Cyborg or Aquaman or this universe continuing past the early 2020's or even another GL movie being realistically made. But now it's changed. The first 20 minutes of MOS showed me that there's some great potential with the Amazons, Atlanteans, Lanterns, Martians. Cyborg has a TON of potential. Most importantly this badass strong as a mother****er Superman would destroy Bale's Batman unless he had a crazy new suit like TDKReturns, and that you can't bank on happening.

And how you see TDKR is fine, but I love it to death. I will defend that movie and ending until the day I die. It's his version of "what if there was an actual ending to the story of Bruce Wayne being Batman?". I think we were blind. Because Nolan told us this before the damn movie came out. He was never going to be Batman forever. In that story he was always looking to pass the mantle and the marketing in Rises told us it was the end. The question was only "Would Bruce die as Batman or retire?" the answer was BOTH.

It's my favorite trilogy of all time whether Bale returned or not.

There will not be another origin story Great Mind(s) you don't have to keep bringing that up. And no it's not going to be rebooted every 2 years. There was a 8 year hiatus without Bat movies then Nolan was in charge. TDKT lasted for 8 years from the moment they started filming.

Chris ALWAYS wanted it to be a closed off universe where Batman is the first and only superhero in that world. Comics don't even exist as reading material in that universe. There were no Gods, Meta-Humans, Alien Invasions, Monsters, Magic, Boy/Girl Side-Kicks (because he wanted to focus entirely on Batman especially coming off Batman & Robin). Jonah even said the point wasn't to go through every single rogue. It was a trilogy that had a beginning and I guess an end.

Now we have to move on. We're Batman fans first and foremost are we not??? Dude, you KNOW I love this trilogy more than anything in the world of comic book movies. If Bale was announced tonight! to return I would be happy but I would now want him to be playing a different Batman who's in his late 30s unless they were scrapping JL and going with a World's Finest then Id say SCREW IT! EXTEND THE TRILOGY! But...

Ive been a Batman fan since I was 3. I grew up with Burton/Keaton and even though I grew up finding many problems with those movies (mainly Returns) I dig them. I grew up with the Bruce Timm/Kevin Conroy Animated Series and that was my Batman for many years until Batman Begins.

Grant Morrison and Scott Snyder do amazing things with the character that are very different from Nolan's and the Arkham games are wicked. Sorry dude but I just want more of the Bat.

By the time we see batman on film again, it's going to be 4 to 6 years after Rises. That's half to 3/4 of the time we had to wait after Shumacher destroyed the franchise. It's perfect. When they wanted a 2015/2016 release I hated it too. Now it's looking like 2018 the earliest for JL. 1 Bat movie this decade, another early in the next...as a batman fan, if they do it right and don't bite Nolan's style, how is that a BAD thing???

BTW the Wayne Enterprises logo in MOS is so quick and on a bad angle that if I wasn't told, I wouldn't see it. And they showed in 2 separate shots. All my friends missed it. Even the W was hard to make out. It could have worked for Nolans or a new Bruce.

 

[FeedOnATreeFrog]

I despair

 

[Great Mind(s)]

But the point you make that there won't be another Batman origin film (at least for awhile) is still the reason why it doesn't make sense to reboot it. Because it would be too soon. Because it would be too much like Batman Begins or too much like Year One which is like Batman Begins. Because nobody wants to see the origin again, everyone knows it. But then it would stick out like a sore thumb when viewing the DCU. "Oh here's Superman's origin film, Wonder Woman's, The Flash's, but there's no Batman origin film because of the movies that just came out prior which would be really hard to top and could have actually worked..."

Or what they're going to make a reboot that is everything the opposite of what Batman Begins did? I don't want to see Dent, Joker, Ras, Scarecrow, etc for a while and I doubt they would start with any of those. Falcone and Maroni too. So what are they going to use as the source material? Who wants to see Mr. Freeze or Clayface be Batman's first villain?

I dunno about you but I would want every character in the DCU to have their origins established and it's too late to have a Batman origin within this new MOSverse without some kind of Superman influence.

 

[FeedOnATreeFrog]

But the point you make that there won't be another Batman origin film (at least for awhile) is still the reason why it doesn't make sense to reboot it. Because it would be too soon. Because it would be too much like Batman Begins or too much like Year One which is like Batman Begins. Because nobody wants to see the origin again, everyone knows it. But then it would stick out like a sore thumb when viewing the DCU. "Oh here's Superman's origin film, Wonder Woman's, The Flash's, but there's no Batman origin film because of the movies that just came out prior which would have actually worked, so there isn't one because it would be redundant..."

I dunno about you but I would want every character in the DCU to have their origins established and it's too late to have a Batman origin within this new MOSverse without some kind of Superman influence.

Hal Jordan might not have another origin film.

Also, no one seems to mind that The Incredible Hulk wasn't an origin story.

 

[Great Mind(s)]

Well The Incredible Hulk wasn't following the arguably biggest comic book movie series of this generation. It was following Hulk. And TIH wasn't anything special and Norton was recast and that movie feels obsolete as well. I don't include TIH in my Avenger's MCU head and I doubt anyone considers it when writing future MCU films...

And I don't hate TDKR, I hate the Blake ending. I wouldn't hate it if they did something further with it to make it seem less ridiculous, but they're ending it on a ridiculous note. Blake wouldn't last out there, it makes no sense. Blake accidentally shoots people and is just a rookie cop. We saw what happens to people pretending to be Batman in TDK. Bruce is a trained ninja and he struggled. Anyway, there is no making sense of it. I think they could change their minds when they realize they don't know what they're doing.

 

[shauner111]

But the point you make that there won't be another Batman origin film (at least for awhile) is still the reason why it doesn't make sense to reboot it. Because it would be too soon. Because it would be too much like Batman Begins or too much like Year One which is like Batman Begins. Because nobody wants to see the origin again, everyone knows it. But then it would stick out like a sore thumb when viewing the DCU. "Oh here's Superman's origin film, Wonder Woman's, The Flash's, but there's no Batman origin film because of the movies that just came out prior which would be really hard to top and could have actually worked..."

Or what they're going to make a reboot that is everything the opposite of what Batman Begins did? I don't want to see Dent, Joker, Ras, Scarecrow, etc for a while and I doubt they would start with any of those. Falcone and Maroni too. So what are they going to use as the source material? Who wants to see Mr. Freeze or Clayface be Batman's first villain?

I dunno about you but I would want every character in the DCU to have their origins established and it's too late to have a Batman origin within this new MOSverse without some kind of Superman influence.

Im pretty confident in saying that Hal wont get another origin film. Flash is also not a guarantee. His film may not come out until after JLA, which wont be an origin. Cyborg/Martian Manhunter are exclusive to team-ups and I cant see Aquamans origin happening until after a Justice League movie. So that only gives you 2 to 3 origins.

A first batman villain? They cant use Freeze for starters I agree. But Black Mask, Riddler, Penguin, Strange are all fantastic villains to start with. You also can't do Grayson yet.

 

[Shikamaru]

Well The Incredible Hulk wasn't following the arguably biggest comic book movie series of this generation. It was following Hulk. And TIH wasn't anything special and Norton was recast and that movie feels obsolete as well. I don't include TIH in my Avenger's MCU head and I doubt anyone considers it when writing future MCU films...

Even though they referenced events from TIH in multiple films already?

 

[Shikamaru]

Honestly, even IF we are going to see Batman's origin again, it will probably start with Bruce coming back to Gotham after years of being away similar to Year One. I doubt we'll see Bruce travel the world again and how he trained, or even how he made his suit past the "the bat is a symbol of fear" concept.

 

[Great Mind(s)]

Well I mean future films... as in from this point on I think they're using The Avengers as their Hulk reference.

 

[Great Mind(s)]

Honestly, even IF we are going to see Batman's origin again, it will probably start with Bruce coming back to Gotham after years of being away similar to Year One. I doubt we'll see Bruce travel the world again and how he trained, or even how he made his suit past the "the bat is a symbol of fear" concept.

But isn't that kind of disappointing after the drawn out origin for Superman? And there are so many Year One things in BB, ugh it just feels so pointless to me. How is the movie still in the New Releases section already obsolete in film continuity less than a year since its release?

Better move it to the $5 bin and make way for The Darker Knight Rises Way Cooler and More Badass This Time Around

 

[shauner111]

Blake wouldn't last out there, it makes no sense.

I think the point is that will comes before training. It's a first step. We don't see or know that Blake will even need to be a vigilante because we don't know what the city will be like. Will it need a vigilante type in a few months? In a few years? And the point is that Blake can train.

I always said that it's not about him wearing the cowl, he could be a Nightwing type while Batman is perceived as dead to the public. Carrying the symbol but in his own way. So he would train, he has time. But there's not really bigger threats than the League of Shadows or Joker (who in this version is not like the comics, he's probably in a padded cell forever). So he doesn't need that level of training. Intense martial arts training is fine and can be done...but who's to say Blake even goes out there? He's there incase.

 

[shauner111]

But isn't that kind of disappointing after the drawn out origin for Superman? And there are so many Year One things in BB, ugh it just feels so pointless to me. How is the movie still in the New Releases section already obsolete in film continuity less than a year since its release?

Better move it to the $5 bin and make way for The Darker Knight Rises Way Cooler and More Badass This Time Around

Because it had a conclusion. Doesn't matter if one likes that conclusion, it is one. Unlike Spider-Man 3 which wasn't an actual end to Spider-Man, then they go and do another origin. That was the problem there (and im saying that as a person who liked TASM).

 

[Great Mind(s)]

Alright I guess I can get that. It still seems pointless to me to reboot the series. It still feels like a conclusion to one arc and the beginning of another to me. I won't be convinced it's the right idea until I see the reboot and its amazing. And I'm not 100% convinced they're convinced they know what they're doing. They have ideas and when they try to really write it who knows what will happen.

 

[FeedOnATreeFrog]

Pointless?

The point is to make more movies since they no longer have Bale/Nolan's story.

 

[Great Mind(s)]

I know that but that's what bugs me because like I said they're like dealers feeding us our addiction as if we're desperate for Batman like a fix of heroin. I don't want a bad batch, I'm not that desperate for constant Batman films being pumped out like an assembly line. That's the perfect way to overexpose a character.

 

[FeedOnATreeFrog]

so you'd rather not have any more Batman films?