Falcon and Winter Soldier Season 1, Episode 1: New World Order (SPOILERS)

[KevTravels]

I forgot to mention Adepero Oduye! I love her and was so happy to see her in this.

She head me tearing up in When They See Us.

 

[KevTravels]

I understand Cap is an icon. But Falcon is so much cooler. He can fly, and has all sorts of cool weapons. The super serum didn't make Steve that much physically superior to many soldiers. And as for his tactical and leadership abilities, no serum can grant that.

Did I mention Falcon can fly?

You had me at "he can fly".

 

[KevTravels]

It was nice seeing Sam working on repairs himself. After so many years, he should def be somewhat of an expert.

 

[sueb1863]

They never showed the guy in the suit.

Thanks! That's what I was wondering, if we'd seen him somewhere else before. I haven't seen all of the movies so I thought maybe he'd been shown in one of the movies and I'd missed him.

 

[Dark Raven]

Thanks! That's what I was wondering, if we'd seen him somewhere else before. I haven't seen all of the movies so I thought maybe he'd been shown in one of the movies and I'd missed him.

They showed him in Iron Man 2 and in the Avengers on Tony Stark's drinks cabinet:

 

[The Caped Knight]

I understand Cap is an icon. But Falcon is so much cooler. He can fly, and has all sorts of cool weapons. The super serum didn't make Steve that much physically superior to many soldiers. And as for his tactical and leadership abilities, no serum can grant that.

Did I mention Falcon can fly?

The symbol of Captain America is patriotism, strength, morality and a sense of uncompromising nobility. I don't care who you are it's hard to live up to a man who defines perfection at least from an idealistic perspective.

To the world and public, Captain America is a hero, he's an embodiment of what The American spirit is supposed to be. I don't blame Sam being hesitant to take up and wield the shield. It's alot to live up too, Steve fought in War World 2 and sacrifices his life to save others without giving it a second thought, no hesitant about being selfless. He sleeped in cryogenic for 70 years wakes up in the future and right away is back in a fight to once again save the world. I love his ending in Endgame because he finally gets to have a life a reward for him to be happy after all he's done.

 

[Web-Head]

Falcon should get a real bird instead of a robotic one.

why?

 

[Dark Raven]

why?

He would have an actual animal sidekick and it would make him stand out even more as someone who has an intelligent bird companion who can help him in battle. The bird could even become a character of its own much like how Groot is a character even though he doesn't say much. Mackie and Stan compared this show to Turner and Hooch, but they could make it even more like that if Falcon has a pet falcon that he talks to as well.

And plus it is accurate to the comics anyway.

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

The Cap trilogy seemed to be about the definition of patriotism especially liberty vs security.

FAWS seems to focus on a few things: Cap's legacy, Bucky's recovery, nationalism vs globalization (Flag Smasher), and the dangers of exploiting patriotism (US Agent).

Alot of cool stuff to chew on. Honestly it seems like Winter Soldier spread out 9 or 10 episodes which I'm totally down with.

 

[WonderTwin]

If you've keep up with stuff then you'll know he's John Walker but it hasn't been stated in the show yet.

Not everybody has the time to "keep up with stuff" or the vast knowledge of the Marvel universe that others do. That was kind of a rude reply. Why not just answer the question without the condescension?

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

He would have an actual animal sidekick and it would make him stand out even more as someone who has an intelligent bird companion who can help him in battle. The bird could even become a character of its own much like how Groot is a character even though he doesn't say much. Mackie and Stan compared this show to Turner and Hooch, but they could make it even more like that if Falcon has a pet falcon that he talks to as well.

And plus it is accurate to the comics anyway.

The bird is cool visually but it's kind of outdated. Like I said before I wouldn't mind a callback episode or two where Falcon needs to rely on a bird but he kind of needs a hitech option when dealing with military level threats and terrorists.

Everyone uses drones these days: the police, the military, terrorist and criminals. A bird would leave Falcon severely handicapped.

 

[javonstokess]

FWIW, I remember Feige saying somewhere that Steve in the MCU was, power-level wise, was more on par with Ultimate Cap who was damn near super-strong. Cap in the regular MCU is "as strong as a human being at their peak level could be"

Also, I don't think Steve is dead. I don't think you give Steve Rodgers an off-film death.

 

[Dark Raven]

The bird is cool visually but it's kind of outdated. Like I said before I wouldn't mind a callback episode or two where Falcon needs to rely on a bird but he kind of needs a hitech option when dealing with military level threats and terrorists.

Everyone uses drones these days: the police, the military, terrorist and criminals. A bird would leave Falcon severely handicapped.

If it is a cybernetically enhanced animal like Rocket Raccoon then it would have special capabilities. If it wears body armour and has a drone attached to its backpack then it could be used for military operations. And because it's a bird, it won't look as conspicuous as a drone because it would just look like a bird is flying by or has landed near the target and won't arouse suspicion or alarm.

 

[JtheDreamer]

Bravo Marvel, bravo!

Episode 1 is a great step in the direction of restoring my hopes for Marvel streaming. The writing and cinematography team are significantly better than what we got for WV. I loved every second of Bucky with his shrink - the long shot across the room with the forest picture in the background, side angles of Bucky, and the steps - that's the kind of attention to detail I crave. The character arcs here are also infinitely more compelling and I really loved how they structured the opening episode into new Cap's reveal. This show feels adult, whereas WV was aimed a lot more at children. Can't forget an action-packed opening for Falcon!

Only things I didn't like were Torres and the intro for the Flag Smashers. I get that we're going deeper into the rogues here and guys like Winter Solider need equals to fight. It's only going to get better as we learn about Walker and we get the return of Zemo! This is a bit ticky tacky, but the overly square white dude at the bank stereotype is getting kind of tired, albeit the struggle for Wilson's sister is a real one. I've never known celebs to have problems getting loans - as they typically have access to a lot of other non-standard channels.

9/10. This episode felt straight out of the MCU films (especially TWS and Civil War), but we got to let these characters live and breathe without being a gimmick.

 

[WatchProtect]

Not everybody has the time to "keep up with stuff" or the vast knowledge of the Marvel universe that others do. That was kind of a rude reply. Why not just answer the question without the condescension?

Wasn't intending on being rude at all Friend, I apologize if it came across that way. I was mainly just saying if you saw Wyatt Russell was cast as IS Agent then you'd know that's who it is, again my apologies.

 

[Marvolo]

Sam giving the shield to a museum or anyone was stupid and contrived. If Steve wanted it in a museum he would have given it to a museum. Now the show has to waste time getting Sam back to were he already was at the end of Endgame.

Im already tired of Sam's sister's financial woes. That also feels contrived. Sam works contracts for the military, he helped save the universe, helped kill Thanos and his entire army, and he's the only soldier in the world with mechanical wings and the expertise to use them. But in spite of that he somehow has no regular or comfortable income? BS.

I dont like her guilt tripping Sam either. She acts like he just dipped out on her for ****s and giggles. "I raised two kids while you were gone." Yeah, a titan erased me from existence, and then a Hulk snapped me back into existence, and then I immediately had to fight for my life and the lives of an entire universe, and there was an army of monsters from space trying their damndest to rip me apart and eat me. But, sure, Im the *******, because you raised two kids, lived in a nice house, and had your own business.

 

[RockSP]

FWIW, I remember Feige saying somewhere that Steve in the MCU was, power-level wise, was more on par with Ultimate Cap who was damn near super-strong. Cap in the regular MCU is "as strong as a human being at their peak level could be"

Not damn near, he was straight up super strong. He threw punches that the Hulk felt, and kicked a Giant-Man sized Pym's ass like it was nothing.

 

[RockSP]

Sam giving the shield to a museum or anyone was stupid and contrived. If Steve wanted it in a museum he would have given it to a museum. Now the show has to waste time getting Sam back to were he already was at the end of Endgame.

Just because Steve wanted something doesn't mean Sam has to follow his wishes. I have zero issue with Sam who has been a supporting character until now getting fleshed out. And part of that fleshing out is him having doubts about living up to Cap's legacy.

I'm already tired of Sam's sister's financial woes. That also feels contrived. Sam works contracts for the military, he helped save the universe, helped kill Thanos and his entire army, and he's the only soldier in the world with mechanical wings and the expertise to use them. But in spite of that he somehow has no regular or comfortable income? BS.

I don't think it was ever stated he had no regular income, currently. His contract work has only been for the last 6 months. You're not the first person I've seen make reference to him helping to save the universe. Just curious: how does that play into getting a loan approved in your eyes?

 

[Dark Raven]

Bravo Marvel, bravo!

Episode 1 is a great step in the direction of restoring my hopes for Marvel streaming. The writing and cinematography team are significantly better than what we got for WV. I loved every second of Bucky with his shrink - the long shot across the room with the forest picture in the background, side angles of Bucky, and the steps - that's the kind of attention to detail I crave. The character arcs here are also infinitely more compelling and I really loved how they structured the opening episode into new Cap's reveal. This show feels adult, whereas WV was aimed a lot more at children. Can't forget an action-packed opening for Falcon!

Only things I didn't like were Torres and the intro for the Flag Smashers. I get that we're going deeper into the rogues here and guys like Winter Solider need equals to fight. It's only going to get better as we learn about Walker and we get the return of Zemo! This is a bit ticky tacky, but the overly square white dude at the bank stereotype is getting kind of tired, albeit the struggle for Wilson's sister is a real one. I've never known celebs to have problems getting loans - as they typically have access to a lot of other non-standard channels.

9/10. This episode felt straight out of the MCU films (especially TWS and Civil War), but we got to let these characters live and breathe without being a gimmick.

Well you can't really make a comparison with WandaVision. They were never shooting a military thriller. The cinematography for WV was excellent and completely faithful to each period of each sitcom and deliberately looking like a TV show. If someone set out to create a 70s disco song and then you heard a grunge song from the 90s you couldn't say that the 90s song has better musicianship unless that 70s disco song did not faithfully recreate the genre it was intended to be or there are technical deficiencies. They would be two different things completely.

You could compare something like Iron Man or Captain America: The Winter Soldier's cinematography with this show, but comparing WV with TFATWS is like apples and oranges.

 

[javonstokess]

Not damn near, he was straight up super strong. He threw punches that the Hulk felt, and kicked a Giant-Man sized Pym's ass like it was nothing.

You're right. Dude was super strong. I prefer super-strong Cap anyway. Never made sense for him to be called a "super soldier" if he was just really, really strong. Just my opinion, of course...

 

[javonstokess]

Sam giving the shield to a museum or anyone was stupid and contrived. If Steve wanted it in a museum he would have given it to a museum. Now the show has to waste time getting Sam back to were he already was at the end of Endgame.

I get him not wanting to immediately become the next Captain America. That's a big burden to take on and he saw Steve endure it firsthand. I'm not sure most people would go running towards that opportunity in his position. Self-doubt is a hallmark of most Marvel characters.

Im already tired of Sam's sister's financial woes. That also feels contrived. Sam works contracts for the military, he helped save the universe, helped kill Thanos and his entire army, and he's the only soldier in the world with mechanical wings and the expertise to use them. But in spite of that he somehow has no regular or comfortable income? BS.

He clearly has income, but not "fund a small business" income which would be par for course for someone working in the military.

I dont like her guilt tripping Sam either. She acts like he just dipped out on her for ****s and giggles. "I raised two kids while you were gone." Yeah, a titan erased me from existence, and then a Hulk snapped me back into existence, and then I immediately had to fight for my life and the lives of an entire universe, and there was an army of monsters from space trying their damndest to rip me apart and eat me. But, sure, Im the *******, because you raised two kids, lived in a nice house, and had your own business.

It seemed like him "dipping out" took place a lot further before the Blip. Remember, dude was running Ops with Steve after "CA:WS" and then Avengers missions and then he was a fugitive from the law.

 

[Brian Braddock]

I used to read silver age Captain America comics, and still watch Marvel animation on Disney+, so I slipped for a moment.

You're right, the contemporary MCU Cap is superhuman. Probably, his most exceptional feat of strength was temporarily resisting Thanos' fist in Infinity War.

For a comparison you may or may not find amusing, here's how Cap's strength used to be described.
"Captain America represents the pinnacle of human physical perfection. While not superhuman, he is as strong as a human being can be. He can lift (press) a maximum of 800 pounds with supreme effort." Captain America

This subject has been debated alot on here over the years - common consensus seems to be that MCU Cap is essentially 616 Cap with [near] Ultimate Cap power levels.

As for that description, I learned a long time ago not to take the official handbook of the Marvel universe as gospel after they took years to update Captain Britains height, weight and powers - still had him at 5'11", 180lbs and powerless without his suit (!) even though Alan Moore, Chris Claremont and Alan Davis had depicted him otherwise for ages.

 

[Brian Braddock]

FWIW, I remember Feige saying somewhere that Steve in the MCU was, power-level wise, was more on par with Ultimate Cap who was damn near super-strong. Cap in the regular MCU is "as strong as a human being at their peak level could be".

Ah, well there it is then.

 

[djsunyc]

hector from heroes reforged and nerdist said...

Spoiler: Something to look forward to in Episode 2

he interviewed the head writer and he said (i am paraphrasing) that if you are a marvel fan, then episode #2 is gonna make you say "oh wow - marvel's actually going to go there..."

i can't wait.

 

[Schlosser85]

Sam giving the shield to a museum or anyone was stupid and contrived. If Steve wanted it in a museum he would have given it to a museum. Now the show has to waste time getting Sam back to were he already was at the end of Endgame.

Im already tired of Sam's sister's financial woes. That also feels contrived. Sam works contracts for the military, he helped save the universe, helped kill Thanos and his entire army, and he's the only soldier in the world with mechanical wings and the expertise to use them. But in spite of that he somehow has no regular or comfortable income? BS.

I dont like her guilt tripping Sam either. She acts like he just dipped out on her for ****s and giggles. "I raised two kids while you were gone." Yeah, a titan erased me from existence, and then a Hulk snapped me back into existence, and then I immediately had to fight for my life and the lives of an entire universe, and there was an army of monsters from space trying their damndest to rip me apart and eat me. But, sure, Im the *******, because you raised two kids, lived in a nice house, and had your own business.

- I don't see why Sam not wanting it right off the bat is stupid and contrived. Just because Steve gives it to him doesn't mean he wants it. Also think about what a legend and icon Steve is. To the whole world, including and in some ways maybe even especially Sam, Steve Rogers is Captain America, period, the end. It's huge shoes to fill and try to be worthy of, and Sam has always been more of a soldier/follower/faithful sidekick. I don't think Sam not wanting it was contrived at all.

- I admit I did find all the stuff with the sister's financial woes boring and her passive-aggressively acting like Sam's absence was something he had any control over was kind of annoying.