Falcon and Winter Soldier Season 1, Episode 6: "One World, One People" (Series Finale)

[Fosterson]

I think he did pretty decent against Iron Man, all things considered, considering he's just a super-strong guy versus a man in a superpowered armored suit with an array of gadgets and weapons at his fingertips.

True, although that was largely a consequence of Tony being nerfed in order to make that fight remotely plausible. The Mark 6 was able to go toe to toe with Thor but we're supposed to believe that Cap and Bucky are a match for the Mark 46? Really? And even so, the fight ended with Bucky unconscious on the floor and his arm totally incinerated.

CW is my second favourite MCU movie but there's no doubt that the Russo's had to mess with the pre-established power levels of these characters to make their big 3rd act set-piece work.

I still say he should have done better against The Flagsmashers though. Unlike Iron Man or Spider-Man, The Flagsmashers were just....strong people, without any other superpowers, and thus more comparable to Bucky himself. And Bucky previously went toe-to-toe pretty evenly against Steve Rogers, who is a super-soldier with combat training and fighting skills which The Flagsmashers don't have.

I agree that he should have done better against Karli and her motley crew, although he's not the only one about whom this can be said. Karli shouldn't have been a match for Walker either, given his extensive military training and yet she was beating him in H2H. They could have solved this problem by having Batroc work with the Flag-Smashers from the beginning and they could have explained that he had trained them.

But alas, unfortunately they didn't and as a result the origins of Karli's expertise in CQC must remain a mystery.

Maybe Mama Donya was a secret black-belt?

 

[Bren]

I'd say the Flagsmashers, having worked with The Power Broker, did get extensive training.. And that was possibly even before they took the SSS...

Absolutely still wanted Bucky to be more effective (or clearly shown to be holding back every time, maybe in fear of losing himself as the WS again?)...

 

[Schlosser85]

True, although that was largely a consequence of Tony being nerfed in order to make that fight remotely plausible. The Mark 6 was able to go toe to toe with Thor but we're supposed to believe that Cap and Bucky are a match for the Mark 46? Really? And even so, the fight ended with Bucky unconscious on the floor and his arm totally incinerated.



I agree that he should have done better against Karli and her motley crew, although he's not the only one about whom this can be said. Karli shouldn't have been a match for Walker either, given his extensive military training and yet she was beating him in H2H. They could have solved this problem by having Batroc work with the Flag-Smashers from the beginning and they could have explained that he had trained them.

But alas, unfortunately they didn't and as a result the origins of Karli's expertise in CQC must remain a mystery.

Maybe Mama Donya was a secret black-belt?

You're probably right about Tony going toe-to-toe with a literal god and then getting beaten up by two strong bros, although I think you can at least kinda sorta headcanon the Civil War into being plausible by saying

A) Tony is half-crazed with blind rage and not at his best.

B) he's against two coordinated opponents working together and tag-teaming him

C) He's not out in the open, he's in a constricted indoor environment where he's having to fight them at close quarters a lot of the time, which probably gives an advantage to their fighting skills over all his weaponry.

I'm probably stretching at least a little though.

And yea, pretty much everyone should be a better fighter than Karli. Bucky, Walker, even Sam.

Mama Donya was a secret Spartan den mother who ran Sokovian Fight Club.

 

[Web-Head]

That's something I still have issues with here too. There's no reason Karli should have stood a chance against Bucky or Walker. Sam even seemed to do a fine job at the end when he wasn't even fighting back.

 

[Batmannerism]

You're probably right about Tony going toe-to-toe with a literal god and then getting beaten up by two strong bros, although I think you can at least kinda sorta headcanon the Civil War into being plausible by saying

A) Tony is half-crazed with blind rage and not at his best.

B) he's against two coordinated opponents working together and tag-teaming him

C) He's not out in the open, he's in a constricted indoor environment where he's having to fight them at close quarters a lot of the time, which probably gives an advantage to their fighting skills over all his weaponry.

I'm probably stretching at least a little though.

And yea, pretty much everyone should be a better fighter than Karli. Bucky, Walker, even Sam.

Mama Donya was a secret Spartan den mother who ran Sokovian Fight Club.

Going in to Civil War, one of my gripes was " Cap is going to beat up Iron Man ? Now that's Bull shirt !"

However, the Russos and the writers let that whole sequence play out in a way that makes sense. All of what you mentioned plays a role, and there are probably a bunch of other factors as well.

Without going into too much detail, we can say that it worked within the context of the film.

Now because diversity of voices is very important I feel an obligation to share this review.

 

[samsnee]

Going in to Civil War, one of my gripes was " Cap is going to beat up Iron Man ? Now that's Bull **** !"

However, the Russos and the writers let that whole sequence play out in a way that makes sense. All of what you mentioned plays a role, and there are probably a bunch of other factors as well.

Without going into too much detail, we can say that it worked within the context of the film.

Now because diversity of voices is very important I feel an obligation to share this review.

Not gonna lie. I like Sam’s costume from the first episode better

 

[djsunyc]

'Falcon and the Winter Soldier' Finale's Moment of Revolution

 

[herolee10]

Overall, the series was great as a whole. It definitely tackled a lot of relevant and important issues while giving new depth to its titular characters.

That being said, this show as definitely not without its faults.

• Like others have said before me, Bucky was definitely nerfed in this show. There's no way that someone with his experience and training should have had so much difficulty in dealing with the unorganized Flag Smashers. If they had gone out of their way to explain that Bucky was intentionally holding himself back then it would have made some sense.

• If the goal was to make Karli come off as the most annoying, condescending, and unsympathetic villain within the MCU then they definitely succeeded. I just couldn't find myself emphasizing with her at all. Maybe it would have helped if we had gotten a flashback or two of her past hardships/suffering. Plus, it would have been a better character arc if we had seen her start off as someone not wanting to hurt people and just find a better home for her refuges. It was even more irritating to see Sam still portray them as a sympathetic group, especially after they tried to murder the GVC senators in cold blood.

• So is Marvel afraid or reluctant in using Baron Zemo as the big bad for any program? Given the show's promotional material, you'd think that he was going to be portrayed as the big bad for this show. Instead, he came off as an ally and anti-hero. Also, what was the point of the mask? It was the most forced piece of fan service that I've ever seen. It would have made more sense if Zemo had gotten out on his own without anyone knowing and that he's been operating with his mask to keep a low profile.

• Yeah, I can't really buy Sharon as the Power Broker. Nothing personal against EVC but she just doesn't have the presence of an evil BTS mastermind. It would have been better to see her be the anti-hero instead of Zemo.

• I still can't tell on whether this show was trying to say that Steve was ultimately a product of the system (e.g. blonde hair, super serum, etc.), thus tainting his legacy in a way.

 

[Gaultheria]

So is Marvel afraid or reluctant in using Baron Zemo as the big bad for any program? Given the show's promotional material, you'd think that he was going to be portrayed as the big bad for this show. Instead, he came off as an ally and anti-hero.

My guess is that they see the potential for him to be the next Loki.

 

[metaphysician]

Walker’s lie to Hoskins’ family makes the scene with Bucky’s admission all the more powerful. Both men sought to bring closure and comfort of a sort to grieving families, but Walker tried to protect his own reputation whereas Bucky chose integrity and full disclosure. Walker continued on in a fragile state of denial, and Bucky got to unwind for the first time in decades.

Eh, I would be a bit kinder, and say Walker lied *because* it would give the family closure. He thought it was better if they believed the person who killed Lemar was dead, rather than deal with the more complicated "they are still out there". They already generally seemed to approve of John ( Lemar's sister possibly aside? ), I don't think the truth would have meaningfully changed that.

 

[djsunyc]

 

[DoomRulz]

Now because diversity of voices is very important I feel an obligation to share this review.

This was a good and fair review, albeit with a heavy dose of sarcasm at times. While I enjoyed the series overall, I did feel it was a bit preachy at times and Drinker does raise some good questions at the end there. I was confused as to how the writers wanted me to feel about Carli most of the time. Like, you want me to feel sorry for her, yet she willingly blew up a building filled with innocent people. Why should I care about her?

 

[WatchProtect]

I mean I'm not gonna change anyone's mind but Zemo blew up a building too with arguably more "important" people

 

[Batmannerism]

I mean I'm not gonna change anyone's mind but Zemo blew up a building too with arguably more "important" people

This is true, but Zemo doesn't pretend to be anything other than what he is - he's a ruthless killer, although as Bucky mentions he does seem to have some sort of code, he does keep his word
and we discover that he enjoys a good boogie.

You could say that he's less hypocritical than Karli, which is probably a factor to some people.


Like Karli, Zemo uses murder to advance his aims , but in FATWS we only see him murder criminals and scientists working for criminals.

What also possibly grates on people is that Karli claims to be a freedom fighter, with badly defined goals, and her murders are even shocking to her own team. That's where the show narrative is weak, because I think its trying to tell us that Karli is a complex character ( you know, like Magneto, who's a terrorist but we understand why he is the way he is because of his tragic past).

If this was done cleverly then Karli would be a good character. But...it isn't. Instead we get a discord between Karli ( and Sam) telling us she's not a terrorist but being shown that she clearly is and if anything is escalating in her ruthlessness.

A huge factor, not to be underestimated, is that Daniel Bruhl is a talented actor who plays Zemo with lots of charm and subtlety.

Can't say the same for Karli.

Those are some of the reasons people probably prefer the Zemo character.

 

[Web-Head]

Zemo also has charisma and charm. I mean, look at Loki. Plenty of people love him. Karli just came across annoying and entitled.

 

[Zyraquis]

While the series is called Falcon and the Winter Soldier, I think it would benefit to have a mid season episode with a focus on Sharon and flagsmasher to flesh out their background and POV, and to actually show a bit the effects and problems that half of the population is suddenly back instead of through conversations.

also I don’t see the need to hold the power broker reveal until the end, it real adds no value at that point. A mid series episode to show how they became what they are I think would work better.

 

[Batmannerism]

While the series is called Falcon and the Winter Soldier, I think it would benefit to have a mid season episode with a focus on Sharon and flagsmasher to flesh out their background and POV, and to actually show a bit the effects and problems that half of the population is suddenly back instead of through conversations.

also I don’t see the need to hold the power broker reveal until the end, it real adds no value at that point. A mid series episode to show how they became what they are I think would work better.

Maybe that could have taken the place of all the riveting stuff about Sam trying to save the family business and fixing the boat - I mean I couldn't get enough of that, oh wait.....no, no I got way too forking much.

Captain America TWS, is possibly the MCU's best film. Cap does some establishing stuff, visiting the Smithsonian ( which actually serves a greater story purpose by reminding us of Bucky's "death"), visiting Sharon, and visiting the vets centre ( which also serves a greater story purpose by consolidating his friendship with Sam). Otherwise pretty much everything that happens drives the central plot forward.

In a 6 episode series, there was a dire need to flesh out the Flag Smashers, because the backstory that we did get for them was pretty vague - who tf was Dona whatsername again, other than someone who Karli knew before and is now dead ? How did a clearly british orphan end up in forking central Europe as a refugee ? With an Asian Australian guy and some other anonymous people.

I mean TWS set up Batroc as a credible adversary, and while we don't know a lot about him, we know enough to understand his motivations $$$!
Also, he's played by GSP who brings a massive physical presence, despite not speaking English at all in the film. When we see him fight Cap, we know he's a badass. Somehow all of that combines to make a villain far more memorable ( in about 5 minutes of screentime than the Smashers).

Something that pissed me off about the series to no end was the Smashers' ability to hold their own, much less beat up experienced soldiers. If there was a clever explanation then that would make sense......but no, we just need to accept what we're given.

The Dora Milaje are a different story, they are an elite fighting force with nearly magical weapons and technology - the jurisdiction thing is bullshirt, and exactly what got the Avengers into trouble, so they better not have any collateral damage.

Anyway, your idea about an episode that told the Smashers and Sharon's story would have given us a fleshed out, well rounded adversary who we understood. I mean you can have mysterious adversaries, but they need to be intriguing rather than annoying.

Oh well, maybe next time.....

 

[Dark Raven]

Did Batroc not speak English at all in the series? Was it in subtitles the whole time? I didn't notice.

What if Sharon couldn't speak French? Then when he said he was going to blackmail her, she would've needed an interpreter or would just have to smile and nod oblivious to what he actually said.

 

[Web-Head]

Did Batroc not speak English at all in the series? Was it in subtitles the whole time? I didn't notice.

What if Sharon couldn't speak French? Then when he said he was going to blackmail her, she would've needed an interpreter or would just have to smile and nod oblivious to what he actually said.

He spoke English plenty. Pretty much every line of his in the finale was in English

 

[Dark Raven]

He spoke English plenty. Pretty much every line of his in the finale was in English

I thought it was in English and didn't remember him speaking French the whole time. But I began questioning that and wondered if I simply didn't notice anymore.

 

[thalidomide]

Maybe that could have taken the place of all the riveting stuff about Sam trying to save the family business and fixing the boat - I mean I couldn't get enough of that, oh wait.....no, no I got way too ****ing much.

Captain America TWS, is possibly the MCU's best film. Cap does some establishing stuff, visiting the Smithsonian ( which actually serves a greater story purpose by reminding us of Bucky's "death"), visiting Sharon, and visiting the vets centre ( which also serves a greater story purpose by consolidating his friendship with Sam). Otherwise pretty much everything that happens drives the central plot forward.

In a 6 episode series, there was a dire need to flesh out the Flag Smashers, because the backstory that we did get for them was pretty vague - who tf was Dona whatsername again, other than someone who Karli knew before and is now dead ? How did a clearly british orphan end up in ****ing central Europe as a refugee ? With an Asian Australian guy and some other anonymous people.

I mean TWS set up Batroc as a credible adversary, and while we don't know a lot about him, we know enough to understand his motivations $$$!
Also, he's played by GSP who brings a massive physical presence, despite not speaking English at all in the film. When we see him fight Cap, we know he's a badass. Somehow all of that combines to make a villain far more memorable ( in about 5 minutes of screentime than the Smashers).

Something that pissed me off about the series to no end was the Smashers' ability to hold their own, much less beat up experienced soldiers. If there was a clever explanation then that would make sense......but no, we just need to accept what we're given.

The Dora Milaje are a different story, they are an elite fighting force with nearly magical weapons and technology - the jurisdiction thing is bull****, and exactly what got the Avengers into trouble, so they better not have any collateral damage.

Anyway, your idea about an episode that told the Smashers and Sharon's story would have given us a fleshed out, well rounded adversary who we understood. I mean you can have mysterious adversaries, but they need to be intriguing rather than annoying.

Oh well, maybe next time.....

All valid points. WOW.

I wonder what it's like if the Russos were the ones who handled this series?

 

[Zarex]

In a 6 episode series, there was a dire need to flesh out the Flag Smashers, because the backstory that we did get for them was pretty vague - who tf was Dona whatsername again, other than someone who Karli knew before and is now dead ? How did a clearly british orphan end up in ****ing central Europe as a refugee ? With an Asian Australian guy and some other anonymous people.

The Smashers also ended up in Madripoor working for Evil Sharon. So if I am understanding the timeline correctly this group of ethnically diverse troublemakers met in Eastern Europe, were then able to travel all the way down to Madripoor - which has a surprising low Asian population - got juiced up (Intentionally I guess? They were working as Sharon's muscle) and then hightailed it back to Europe with the remaining vials.

As so many others have stated, they REALLY needed a Flag Smashers centric episode to give us a clue who these people are and why we should care about them. Or failing that, let them keep the masks on, edit out Karli's speeches to her various hench people and let them just be anonymous punching bags for our heroes.

(I did enjoy the parts with Sam's family. Even the boat stuff.)

 

[Hannibal75]

The Smashers also ended up in Madripoor working for Evil Sharon. So if I am understanding the timeline correctly this group of ethnically diverse troublemakers met in Eastern Europe, were then able to travel all the way down to Madripoor - which has a surprising low Asian population - got juiced up (Intentionally I guess? They were working as Sharon's muscle) and then hightailed it back to Europe with the remaining vials.

As so many others have stated, they REALLY needed a Flag Smashers centric episode to give us a clue who these people are and why we should care about them. Or failing that, let them keep the masks on, edit out Karli's speeches to her various hench people and let them just be anonymous punching bags for our heroes.

(I did enjoy the parts with Sam's family. Even the boat stuff.)

The only excuse might be that there was indeed a subplot about a virus which featured the Flagsmashers heavily, and explained their link with Sharon, but was jettisoned because of the uncomfortable real-world similarities.

 

[thalidomide]

I hope they release the #beforethepandemiccut

 

[Dark Raven]

In the UK, up until recently, it was #releasethehaircut