Season 6, Episode 5 "The Door" Discussion Thread

Reek: You're the only person using the phrase "change the past" here; you're also the only person complaining about time travel and casualty loops and saying they're stupid even though they're pretty clearly story ideas that are more than likely going to make it into the novels at some point in the future given that they came "straight from the horse's mouth", as it were.

 

I think Rick Moranis was turned into Brienne by Gozer.

 

... I just added to the post... the only reason i said it was stupid was because it will confuse people into thinking Bran can go back and change things.

But please, continue to get pissy and tell me one more time who the idea came from? I forgot after reading it 900 times for the past 24 hours. But remind me please.

 

Even though you misinterpreted my reasoning for calling it stupid (as I admitted I should have rephrased myself and explained... which I did).. you basically said because it came straight from GRRM, it can't be stupid.

 

Reek, it came straight from GRRM,

STRAIGHT FROM GRRM, STRAIGHT FROM GRRM. STRAIGHT FROM GRRM. STRAFORGRRM, STRAFORRM, STRAFORRM.

 

Storm! Storm! Storm! Storm! Storm!

STORM!

 

That was GRRM when he was a kid... he told me himself, straight from the horses mouth.

 

Thought this was interesting...

 

Ned compared to Jimmy Carter... Mind blown.

 

Boy, oh boy.

You, my friend, are something else.

 

Joe Chill from Batman Begins was The Night King

Brake is creepy on the latest season of Peaky Blinders.

 

No, I'm not sure either a) you understand or b) are communicating your point very well.

Bran's actions didn't affect the past. You're right, he didn't change anything. But his actions didn't 'affect' the past, they 'WERE' the past. They happened. Bran was there when Hodor was young, and he caused it. He didn't go back to the past where there was a normal Hodor/Wylis who had lived a normal un-Hodor life, and suddenly change it. Hodor always became Hodor and Bran was always the cause.

It's the same as the prediction Ned/Lyanna hear Bran say "Jon...." when

Spoiler

Lyanna gives birth to him, hence naming him Jon.

He wasn't called something else and it was changed, he would have been called Jon because of that.

LOST explained this version of 'time travel' (but I wouldn't call this version of it in Game of Thrones 'time travel') best, in my opinion.

Whatever happened, happened

 

Interesting. I like that explanation.

 

Don't bother guys, you're talking to the same person who acting like we were all stupid for thinking Melisandre was going to bring Jon back to life... then disappeared after it happened.

 

Oh I know... You should have seen him argue the whole Harrison Wells = Reverse Flash thing. He was unrelenting in the belief Harrison Wells was a new character and the producers said that. He would not have it that they misled the viewers..... And that was a year or so ago! How things change...or not!

 

Thanks! I wrote this big, I don't even know what you'd call it, THING on (yes it's not real!) time travel, and my understanding that there's two ways it could be explained/shown on screen/book, whichever.

- The Back to the Future way; when someone goes back, changes something, and then there's after effects such as people not existing, history rewriting, that kind of thing

or

- The 'LOST' way; whatever happened, happened. I love this explanation, and it's the one I always imagine the most likely and believable (if time travel can ever be believable).

It's kind of an interest of mine, despite having no scientific knowledge or anything like that at all. I just like to think about it

 

I was using the LOST logic as well. It all happened just not everyone involved (Bran) didn't experience it yet.

 

In general what I don't like about the BttF/Terminator way is that nothing is ever set. There can always be another person X years later going back in time and changing things yet again.

I need to rewatch Lost as I can barely remember the story. (was one of my favourite shows)

 

Yeah exactly. This is how it happened, we're (the viewer) just watching it for the first time, and Bran is experiencing it. It's not a "Oh no! He went back and caused it accidently!" He always caused it, we just seeing that. Easy as pie

 

I did not know that but now that I do it's kind of obvious. I can see his face.

 

People are drawing a distinction with regards to what we saw that I'm not. Yes, I understand that Wylis becoming Hodor because of Bran's actions was always what happened, but I'm putting the emphasis on the fact that without Bran being able to do what he can do and taking the actions he took, nothing that we saw would've happened... ergo, we learned that Bran can affect the past (which is not something that the Three-Eyed Raven was aware of, I might add) and that, because he can affect the past, he ALWAYS affected the past so that what he did BECAME the past.

 

That makes sense too!

 

That's very presumptuous of you. Do you know that as fact? I'd say that earlier in the season, the raven doesn't confirm or deny to Bran that Ned heard him shout "father", and that in this episode he knew Bran was lying when he said the Night King only saw him. The Raven said "he touched you" without even being in the trance with Bran, so I think he knew full well Bran could interact with the events he's projecting himself in to.

 

So anything that comes from GRRM can't be stupid? Wow, didn't know the guy was perfect.

Lets hope they use time travel wisely and it doesn't become the mess it is on The Flash and LoT.