Season 7, Episode 7 "The Dragon and the Wolf" Discussion Thread

[Havok83]

i thought they were faking the whole time. i thought they wanted baelish to think they were at each other's throats for the plan to work. i guess i just assumed that bran told them off screen or at least told one and the other told the other. i guess i just thought they schemed together or something at neds tomb

They most definitely were not faking. That scene last week makes no sense if they were bc it wasnt for an audience but the two privately. Littlefinger set them up to go agianst each other and Sansa was falling for it. She was truly terrified in her scene with Arya. Arya was testing her and show her that she's made so many decisions out of fear and she needs to stop it. Sansa definitely viewed her as a threat until Littlefinger told her that Arya was trying to take her out so she could be Lady of Wiinterfell. Thats when things clicked with her bc she knows Arya has NEVER wanted to be a Lady. Sansa realized she was being manipulated by him and he needed to be brought to justice

 

[JeetKuneDo]

But there was no need for some silly charade. Sansa already knew about Baelish's murder of Lysa and could have hanged him with that alone. Plus she had Bran to give her more dirt on the guy. It makes more sense that she locked onto his scheme around that time he decided to play his game with her.



But I believe the only reason Bran told them about Baelish was because Sansa approached him with her suspicions. So her mind was tending in that direction anyway.

That's not how it sounded according to Wright.

“We actually did a scene that clearly got cut, a short scene with Sansa where she knocks on Bran’s door and says, ‘I need your help,’ or something along those lines. So basically, as far as I know, the story was that it suddenly occurred to Sansa that she had a huge CCTV department at her discretion and it might be a good idea to check with him first before she guts her own sister. So she goes to Bran, and Bran tells her everything she needs to know, and she’s like, ‘Oh, *****,' ” Hampstead-Wright said.

Sounds like she was terrified of Arya and was coming to Bran first before she had her killed or something.

I like that better than the idea of LF suddenly being outsmarted by the two sisters. Better that it took something extraordinary to defeat him.

 

[DACrowe]

Well he outplayed himself. He already knew he was on thin ice after this.

But a player has to be a player, and he played until it was game over.

 

[Havok83]

What he should have done was kill Sansa and framed Arya for it. That would have been more in tradition to the kind of plot twists GOT would have done in the early seasons. Arya's story next season would have been trying to prove her innocence, but I guess they dont have time for that. Speaking of which, I cant tell what they will do with the two sisters next season. Their character arcs were effectively ended with this episode. There really isnt anything left for them

 

[Reek]

I have to imagine Arya will be fighting the great war.... with Nymeria and her pack behind her.

Sansa can **** off.


oh nevermind...i forgot D&D aren't dog people.

 

[Roose Bolton]

Arya still has to reunite with Gendry, I guess.

 

[Iceman]

he doesn't have to be around for stuff to get back to him. i felt like it was deliberate

No but someone or something has to be, even a bird or a rat lol. In the books Littlefinger mentions that Varys has almost supernatural ways of getting info, and the way he says it implies that he doesn't himself have anything like that. If you rewatch the scenes Sansa is genuinely unsettled and Arya trying to make her so in a wholly private scene. We would need at least one visual cue or hint (like when they showed Littlefinger lying in wait for Arya at the staircase) of the conversation not being private and preferably a hint that at least Arya was aware of that. Otherwise we can project any assumption on to scenes like this to help out the writers when they don't do things effectively. There is a big difference between this scheme and previous Littlefinger schemes from the early seasons for me, which really were impressive.

 

[Iceman]

But I believe the only reason Bran told them about Baelish was because Sansa approached him with her suspicions. So her mind was tending in that direction anyway.

Yes, but what I was saying is that it's easy to win at these games when you can ask the Oracle when you get suspicions rather than figure things out for yourself and have the confidence in your own guile to take the risks of acting on it even when things are uncertain. Noone else has access to an all-time history, global CCTV bank like this. t:

 

[TLH]

Two things on the finale...I really liked it overall.

They should have had Gendry with Beric and Tormund at the wall. Not sure where he was during the finale, and it seems so odd to bring him back for Beyond the Wall - actually it seems odd to have him in that suicide squad just to send him off as a message boy but whatever - only to never show him once in the last episode, and a shot of him on the wall would have made sense, or even standing with Davos in KL.

Man, I can't believe I'm saying this as a non-book reader, but how the hell did they get Rhaegar so goddamn wrong? Guy looks exactly like Viserys (hair, face) when I was expecting long, flowing hair and the most handsome warrior in Westeros.

Nitpicks. Other than that I enjoyed the finale and the season overall. A bit too much fast travel for me, but eh.

 

[Kane52630]

 

[Iceman]

They should have had Gendry with Beric and Tormund at the wall. Not sure where he was during the finale

He was still running. Till he reached shore and then started rowing.

 

[I Am The Knight]

What he should have done was kill Sansa and framed Arya for it. That would have been more in tradition to the kind of plot twists GOT would have done in the early seasons. Arya's story next season would have been trying to prove her innocence, but I guess they dont have time for that. Speaking of which, I cant tell what they will do with the two sisters next season. Their character arcs were effectively ended with this episode. There really isnt anything left for them

Arya was on her way to KL as she wanted to kill Cersei before she decided to return to Winterfell. I guess she could fast travel to KL at the end of the season to meet with Cersei

 

[Ezio Auditore]

Bloody hell the look on Jaime's face between cersei nodding to the mountain and him look at her to figure out her bluff. He had the true look of someone coming to the realisation that the one person who he was willing to break all his morals for was in fact prepared to discard him just like that for disobeying her. Nikolaj truly is an astonishing actor.

This is gold, lol.


Also I've realised that in every scene where Daenerys is on screen, one of the dragon heads on her penchant is covering one of them. Great simbology of Viserion's death.

 

[Drizzle]

 

[warhorse78]

Arya still has to reunite with Gendry, I guess.

I would love if this is Arya's happily ever after, but I wont be surprised if they throw in some last minute drama with a Sansa/Gendry/Arya triangle.

On a personal note, I just hope Arya and Sandor make peace, and brcome BFF, roaming the country side and helping to guard the realm.

 

[Iceman]

I would love if this is Arya's happily ever after, but I wont be surprised if they throw in some last minute drama with a Sansa/Gendry/Arya triangle.

Bloody hell, that would be terrible!

On a personal note, I just hope Arya and Sandor make peace, and brcome BFF, roaming the country side and helping to guard the realm.

I wouldn't mind that.

 

[DawnWarrior]

I also hope Sansa and Tyrion meet up and make peace too. Probably to settle their sham of a marriage once and for all, but I think it would be funny if the now older and more mature Sansa looked at Tyrion and decided, "eh, I could do worse," and so they let Dany oversee the vow renewal, or whatever they call it up North.

 

[Iceman]

Ha, I kind of forgot about that.

 

[warhorse78]

Ok. So here are some questions. Did they show Sansa giving the dagger back to Arya? Is that what she usedto take out Littlefinger?

And, if word gets out that Dany has struck a relationship with Jon, how is Darrio going to take it? Could he turn on her in retaliation?

 

[Havok83]

Ok. So here are some questions. Did they show Sansa giving the dagger back to Arya? Is that what she usedto take out Littlefinger?

And, if word gets out that Dany has struck a relationship with Jon, how is Darrio going to take it? Could he turn on her in retaliation?

I dont see why he would. He knew she was going to get with someone else. When she dumped him, aside from saying she didnt love him, she told him that her next relationship would need to be politically motivated. She needed someone with power, of nobility and the people would accept as king. Darrio knew the score so her hooking up with the King of the North, shouldnt be a surprise

ETA: There's also only 6 episodes. I really dont think there's any time to reintroduce and handle a betrayal plotline

 

[Drizzle]

I also hope Sansa and Tyrion meet up and make peace too. Probably to settle their sham of a marriage once and for all, but I think it would be funny if the now older and more mature Sansa looked at Tyrion and decided, "eh, I could do worse," and so they let Dany oversee the vow renewal, or whatever they call it up North.

They don't need to make peace when there was never bad blood between them in the first place. I don't think either of them see each other in that way though.

 

[warhorse78]

But who could Sansa marry that would help her keep reign of the north and build a good foundation with? Jon could legitimize Gendry, but most fans see him with Arya. The books hinted something going on in a spiritual way between Sansa and The Hound, but the show obviously didnt even touch that except for Sandors little crush.

 

[Havok83]

But who could Sansa marry that would help her keep reign of the north and build a good foundation with? Jon could legitimize Gendry, but most fans see him with Arya. The books hinted something going on in a spiritual way between Sansa and The Hound, but the show obviously didnt even touch that except for Sandors little crush.

Most of the major houses have fallen. Especially with a Danearyus reign, it seems the land is headed for a change in the old rules. Going forward, I dont think marriages will need to be prearranged, so deliberate and/or political. There are millions of potential suitors out there. Im sure she wouldnt have much trouble finding a man