The Avengers Should this movie be based more on the Avengers or the Ultimates?

[The Overlord]

Should this movie be based more on the Avengers or the Ultimates?

 

[SuperFerret]

It should be based on the source material.

 

[The Overlord]

It should be based on the source material.

Technically both the 616 Avengers and the Ultimates are source material, they are just different takes on the same basic concept.

 

[SuperFerret]

Well, no. The Avengers are the source material of the Ultimates as well as any other adaption of the Avengers in any medium.

 

[The Overlord]

Well, no. The Avengers are the source material of the Ultimates as well as any other adaption of the Avengers in any medium.

Ok, but most movies have blended stuff from the Ultimate and 616 universes, like Spider-Man and Iron Man, I think that's the best path here.

Nick Fury is already more based on the Ultimate version then the 616 version.

 

[roach]

is the movie called Avengers or Ultimates????
what parts of Spider-man and Iron Man were based on the Ultimates

 

[The Question]

Yes. While certain plot elements of The Ultimates would be very useful for a film adaptation, the characterization and team dynamics won't.

 

[roach]

the movie is called Avengers base it on Avengers

 

[topdog1]

I hate everything Ultimate and I mean EVERYTHING.

It's nothing but a retread and unnecessary bastardization of the material that's come before. Ignore it whenever possible. The only good thing to ever come from anything Ultimate is costume designs.

 

[The Question]

the movie is called Avengers base it on Avengers

I hate everything Ultimate and I mean EVERYTHING.

It's nothing but a retread and unnecessary bastardization of the material that's come before. Ignore it whenever possible. The only good thing to ever come from anything Ultimate is costume designs.

Guys guys guys... let's be reasonable here. There are some aspects of The Ultimates, other than designs, that can be salvaged for a proper Avengers film. The plot structure and certain plot devices... if they combines elements from the first and last story arc of Millar's run (The team coming together and fighting The Hulk, Loki causing WWIII and turning out to have been masterminding the whole thing) and cutting out all of the fluff (The Skrulls, The Defenders, the "Hank Pym being a total bastard" subplot, the trial of the Incredible Hulk, the battle with Thor and his arrest), then that would actually make a pretty good Avengers film. One thing The Ultimates did really really well is turning the fairly simple plot of the first Avengers' story (Thor goes bersek, Loki's behind everything) into something epic and deserving of the team's origin story. Just use the 616 characterizations and team dynamics (which will remove a lot of the team infighting, which is a huge amount of the fluff), and take some elements of The Ultimates to make a story about The Avengers coming together to fight The Hulk while he's tearing through New York, while foreign forces react to them with superhuman force, and have Loki be behind the whole thing.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

is the movie called Avengers or Ultimates????
what parts of Spider-man and Iron Man were based on the Ultimates

Tony Stark's personality was based more off Ultimates. Tony stark is much more cockier and loose in the Ultimates than 616.

And there were some elements that were good. It sucked overall, but I will admit that there are positives with the Ultimates. I kinda liked Ultimate Thor. He and Nick Fury the only Ultimates characters I fully like.

But base it more on Avengers. No one wants Captain ***hole.

 

[roach]

I am not denying that there are some kool elements to Ultimates....im just saying if I did a film called Star Trek Next Generation and based it on Star Trek Enterprise people would be upset.

 

[Tony Stark]

There are certain parts of the Ultimates that I think would work, but I want it more based on the 616. For example, the Ultimates really played Cap as the man out of time. I really like this angle, and this is exactly why he would not hit it off with Tony.

But I don't want to see the hulk running around eating people.

 

[The Question]

Tony Stark's personality was based more off Ultimates. Tony stark is much more cockier and loose in the Ultimates than 616.

Not really. Most of the Tony Stark we saw was him playboying it up, in the first film because it was pre-Iron Man, in the second because he was kind of hitting rock bottom what with the stress of being a super hero and his condition. 616 Tony could get just as cocky and wild when not getting down to brass tacks. When he was in the suit and doing his job, he was just as serious and pragmatic as 616 Tony.

 

[The Question]

There are certain parts of the Ultimates that I think would work, but I want it more based on the 616. For example, the Ultimates really played Cap as the man out of time. I really like this angle, and this is exactly why he would not hit it off with Tony.

But I don't want to see the hulk running around eating people.

But they played him way more *******-ish then he needed to be. I mean, it worked for The Ultimates, but Cap's still a nice guy who doesn't follow orders blindly, regardless of what time he finds himself in.

 

[babykhris]

I know many people are not going to like this but this IS the Ultimates. The original Avengers were a bunch of super heroes committed to saving the day. The Ultimates began as Nick Fury created a super powered army.

None of the current Avengers are super-heroes. Cap is a US soldier. Thor's a reluctant god, Iron Man is a maverick, Black Widow & Hawkeye are SHIELD agents and The Hulk won't be a member for long. Sounds like Ultimates to me.

The whole Marvel Cinematic Universe is basically the Ultimate Universe storyline. If you read Ultimate Origins it basically tell the story how after Cap disappeared everyone was trying to create a Super Soldier.

Ross mentioned it in The Incredible Hulk and he used a bootleg version to create Abomination. Dum Dum Duggan recruits Cap into the Super-Soldier Program in Ultimate Universe and look who's appearing in the upcoming Captain America film.

The Avengers are superheros and honestly I don't think there's any superheros yet. Maybe like the Ultimates the Avengers will break away from SHIELD.

 

[The Question]

I know many people are not going to like this but this IS the Ultimates. The original Avengers were a bunch of super heroes committed to saving the day. The Ultimates began as Nick Fury created a super powered army.

None of the current Avengers are super-heroes. Cap is a US soldier. Thor's a reluctant god, Iron Man is a maverick, Black Widow & Hawkeye are SHIELD agents and The Hulk won't be a member for long. Sounds like Ultimates to me.

The whole Marvel Cinematic Universe is basically the Ultimate Universe storyline. If you read Ultimate Origins it basically tell the story how after Cap disappeared everyone was trying to create a Super Soldier.

Ross mentioned it in The Incredible Hulk and he used a bootleg version to create Abomination. Dum Dum Duggan recruits Cap into the Super-Soldier Program in Ultimate Universe and look who's appearing in the upcoming Captain America film.

The Avengers are superheros and honestly I don't think there's any superheros yet. Maybe like the Ultimates the Avengers will break away from SHIELD.

Iron Man is totally a super hero. Also, there are elements of the Ultimate Universe, but there are far more differences.

 

[roach]

I know many people are not going to like this but this IS the Ultimates. The original Avengers were a bunch of super heroes committed to saving the day. The Ultimates began as Nick Fury created a super powered army.

None of the current Avengers are super-heroes. Cap is a US soldier. Thor's a reluctant god, Iron Man is a maverick, Black Widow & Hawkeye are SHIELD agents and The Hulk won't be a member for long. Sounds like Ultimates to me.

The whole Marvel Cinematic Universe is basically the Ultimate Universe storyline. If you read Ultimate Origins it basically tell the story how after Cap disappeared everyone was trying to create a Super Soldier.

Ross mentioned it in The Incredible Hulk and he used a bootleg version to create Abomination. Dum Dum Duggan recruits Cap into the Super-Soldier Program in Ultimate Universe and look who's appearing in the upcoming Captain America film.

The Avengers are superheros and honestly I don't think there's any superheros yet. Maybe like the Ultimates the Avengers will break away from SHIELD.

I think you are making a lot of assumptions on movies you havent seen.

 

[The Question]

I think you are making a lot of assumptions on movies you havent seen.

Also some fairly skewed assessments of movies we have seen. Movie Iron man isn't very much like Ultimate Iron Man, Movie Hulk isn't very much like Ultimate Hulk, and what we've seen of Movie Captain America and Thor bears little resemblance to their Ultimate Counterparts either. The only real Ultimate aspect of the films is Sam Jackson as Fury and SHIELD having a hand in The Avengers' founding, and that's just convenient for the plot.

 

[SuperFerret]

The only point khris has is the Black Widow and Hawkeye thing. Their inclusion in the founding group suggests an Ultimate basis to me. Their inclusion at the apparent expense of the Pyms upsets me.

That said, I don't mind Jackson as Fury.

 

[roach]

yeah but do we know for sure that Hawkeye is a shield agent????
Wasnt the founding team of Ultimates Wasp and Giant man...so how does the exclusion of them signal this as an Ultimate plot line???

 

[Daredevil]

I personally love the Ultimates and hope that there is tons of stuff based off of that.

 

[SuperFerret]

Having Clint be a SHIELD agent makes him easy to explain, and having him and the Widow there as founders gives it its Ultimate edge. The exclusion of the Pyms is the bigger shame.

 

[roach]

Hawkeye and Widow werent founders of the Ultimates...not that I recall
We dont know what they are going to do with Hawkeye...however we cant claim him to be a Ultimate part of the story

 

[The Question]

Also, Hawkeye being a SHIELD agent makes perfect sense after Iron Man 2. They made The Black Widow a SHIELD agent instead of a foreign agent playing the villain, largely for plot convenience. Since Clint did foray into espionage after meeting Natasha and was on her side, it stands to reason that if they keep his espionage background, it'll be updated to be on the same side that Natasha is, which is SHIELD.