Siegel & Shuster vs WB: Superman and Infinite Crisis

[solidsnake86]

Hopefully Brainiac will be consider for the villain. I'm not sure if any of you have read the Geoff Johns interview and how they are planning on doing a large story for him at the end of this year but here's the link

http://www.wizarduniverse.com/magazine/wizard/003071109.cfm

I wonder how they will re-do his character and if that will have any effect on the direction they take him in the movie, provided that people like the take.

 

[lexlives]

HAHAHAHAHAHA!
SO TRUE!

SR's Lex was close to the 1980's Superfriends' Lex
ridiculous to jump from THAT version to the one close to the STAS version
AND they have to fix the massive outcry against kate bosworth as lois
AND, of course, the KID

the way i see it, it's either go with Singer's EGO or save the franchise w/ a new director, & a fresh approach

You got it - its go with Singer's ego or go with Superman and save the franchise with a new director/vision/approach.

The Lex rumored here is how Singer should have done it from the start. To jump from Singer's campy over-the-top Lex to this corporate Lex would be, make no mistake, essentially a "re-boot" or "re-start" of Lex. An admission of failure. An attempt to "fix' what is not fixable IMO.

The kid, some of the cast, the FX team - they all need to be as radically altered as this "new" Lex would be if this rumor is true.

To show you how shaky the foundation of SR is let's think. Say they go with this new Lex. To get there from here (SR) a lot of time would have elapsed. So how are Superman/Lois/Jason/Richard introduced in a sequel taking place a few years after SR?

Surely, Heaven forbid, not Superman still pining and "spying" on Lois.

No, that situation will have to have been resolved off-screen. Either Lois is with Richard years later or with Superman. The transition to this new relationship which prersumably Singer wanted to be key now becomes a falshback if that.

WB has a mess on its hands any way you look at it if they give Singer a go-ahead.

It is brought home by the Spiderman clips shown at the electronics convention a few weeks back. They blew away the audience and I am told make the SR visuals look like a college film project.

Koeppe's script so amazed the Sony suits they are trying to sign him like today to write Spiderman 4. How different from the reaction of the WB suits last May/June to the SR script.

Come on folks, we are seeing GREAT stuff with Spiderman 3 and potentially great stuff with FF 2. Don't you want that for Superman? In your heart of hearts do you really think Singer and his team is capable of anything near to what we will be getting in Spiderman 3?

That is the choice and rather than settling fans should be upset that Spiderman and FF are delivering so much more depsite the fact Singer, up to that time, had the biggest budget in film history.

We all as Superman fans who have waited decades for this deserve so much more than Singer is capable of giving

 

[Hunter Rider]

ALL of that Lexlives is your opinion and a lot of it supposition based on unseen movies but there are a lot that feel just a few tweaks and the sequel can be X2 level good

 

[lexlives]

ALL of that Lexlives is your opinion and a lot of it supposition based on unseen movies but there are a lot that feel just a few tweaks and the sequel can be X2 level good

A few tweaks?! With all due respect you have to be kidding. Have you seen the Spiderman 3 stuff. As they are saying it makes SR look like a college film project.

This is it - if Singer gets a green light - the whole pile of chips is depending on him, Harris & Dougherty, Bosworth and Routh. Is that a bet you are really willing to bet the farm on? Do you have confidence in that team? In the FX company Singer chose - yeah great realisitc flying scenes. If a Singer sequel fails you and I will never see another Superman film in our lifetimes. Think about it.

 

[Hunter Rider]

A few tweaks?! With all due respect you have to be kidding. Have you seen the Spiderman 3 stuff. As they are saying it makes SR look like a college film project.

ive seen it yeah,it's a few CGI sequences,so what,i need to see a movie first that is good not a few "cool" shots

This is it - if Singer gets a green light - the whole pile of chips is depending on him, Harris & Dougherty, Bosworth and Routh. Is that a bet you are really willing to bet the farm on? Do you have confidence in that team? In the FX company Singer chose - yeah great realisitc flying scenes. If a Singer sequel fails you and I will never see another Superman film in our lifetimes. Think about it.

I have no problem with Routh or bosworth and Singer is capable IMO,changing an SFX house is also completely managable even though i had no issues with the CGI in SR,why can't you accept that some of us don't have this obsessive hate of the film that you do and actually enjoyed a lot of SR ?

 

[Super Kal]

I agree with HR... I liked Routh and Bosworth, and even though I didn't like it, I respect other people's opinions on liking /loving it.

 

[Maze]

Thanks kakaroth ditto.

I have a lot of compassion for you lex.

i mean all this rage , this fear , i feel for you sincerely..

the problem is that that you like it or not (and you will not like it's obvious even if Singer does the greatest movie of the decade ) Singer will do this movie.

no? okkkk. we'll see in a few month

will it be good? of course for you it has no chances to be good. but the thing is , personnaly i don't settle , i'm even asking a lot when it come to movies ..

the thing is , even if i find a lot of flaws in Sr ,i liked a lot of what i saw overall, and i have huge expectations that the sequel will be even better... because you know what ? Singer is a good filmmaker .Even more, he is a filmmaker who grow all the time in some area or another ( for example he topped himself with the plane sequence ) , and especially learn from his mistakes ( X2 <- X1 )No? you don't like him , but that doesn't make him bad . you say that he is bad , you think that he is bad . that's an opinion.fair enough.. But that's not my opinion, and because you insist in stating your opinion as a fact, that's not the opinion of a lot of people including most critics..So what? like Hunter said , why can't you accept that people has a different opinion?

The sequel has potential imo.

And untill proved otherwise , that's what i think about.

 

[X Knight]

hey maze.......

yes...the sequel does have potential. It's time for Singer and co to really mine through the comics, cartoons, and other media that have provided Superman with such a rich mythos.

If you think about it, we have had 5 Superman movies, and we've barely even scratched the surface of what the character's mythos can offer.

i really hope Singer and co learn from the "shortcomings and mistakes" of SR, see where they went right, and more importantly, recognize where they can make improvements.

for many of us, Singer made a less than spectacular "first impression."

hopefully, Singer will be able to make a sequel that puts the first one to shame. a sequel that cotinues to please fans and proves itself to detractors of SR.

and.....please....PLEASE.....Singer........if you have a great idea on paper or in your mind........don't skimp on the details/context when translating to the big screen........

as for me, I find myself strangely more interested in a movie about a certain red and gold avenger...........EVEN MORE THAN SPIDER-MAN 3!!!?????

 

[bosef982]

hey maze.......

yes...the sequel does have potential. It's time for Singer and co to really mine through the comics, cartoons, and other media that have provided Superman with such a rich mythos.

If you think about it, we have had 5 Superman movies, and we've barely even scratched the surface of what the character's mythos can offer.

i really hope Singer and co learn from the "shortcomings and mistakes" of SR, see where they went right, and more importantly, recognize where they can make improvements.

for many of us, Singer made a less than spectacular "first impression."

hopefully, Singer will be able to make a sequel that puts the first one to shame. a sequel that cotinues to please fans and proves itself to detractors of SR.

and.....please....PLEASE.....Singer........if you have a great idea on paper or in your mind........don't skimp on the details/context when translating to the big screen........

as for me, I find myself strangely more interested in a movie about a certain red and gold avenger...........EVEN MORE THAN SPIDER-MAN 3!!!?????

I'm always a bit taken back by some. I actually agree with EVERYTHING you said...except the bolded. It really isn't a MANY of us...it's a very vague numercial quantity.

Also, keep this in mind, watch Singer's interviews on X2. He humbly and frankly speaks about the things he felt could've been better in X1, and he went out of his way to correct them -- talking about them.

Yet, you have people like LexLives, that just leech onto what i think is artistic itnegrity (you don't get many 'drafts" of a movie) to realize what you could've done better and turn it into an admission of failure. I just dont' see it that way...

Look at Raimi, who really didn't "improve' anything he messed up with in SM1. I don't know, I just am really getting tired of lexLives...there's disliking this movie, and then ther'es just bashing.

LexLives represents the exact symbol of blind, near-trolling bashing of this film and it just is disgusting.

 

[\S/JcDc\S/]

I'm always a bit taken back by some. I actually agree with EVERYTHING you said...except the bolded. It really isn't a MANY of us...it's a very vague numercial quantity.

Also, keep this in mind, watch Singer's interviews on X2. He humbly and frankly speaks about the things he felt could've been better in X1, and he went out of his way to correct them -- talking about them.

Yet, you have people like LexLives, that just leech onto what i think is artistic itnegrity (you don't get many 'drafts" of a movie) to realize what you could've done better and turn it into an admission of failure. I just dont' see it that way...

Look at Raimi, who really didn't "improve' anything he messed up with in SM1. I don't know, I just am really getting tired of lexLives...there's disliking this movie, and then ther'es just bashing.

LexLives represents the exact symbol of blind, near-trolling bashing of this film and it just is disgusting.

pwnage as the kids say

WOW

 

[X Knight]

i actually agree with you bosef......

no, I don't like the movie much myself, but I'm not going to just blindly bash it. yes, I vent, sometimes I rant, and I argue my points ( often passionately )...........and there are elements in SR with which I STRONGLY disagree......

but I do that to point out where I thought the movie went wrong....and how it could have been so much better. I also give SR praise where I feel praise is due.

Would I have preferred a total restart, instead of SR? Yes. Would I still prefer WB to pull an "Incredible Hulk" and go with a different director and direction for the next movie? Yes.

But, as far as I know, that is not going to happen. All I can do is hope for the best for the sequel. If the story turns out to be great and addresses many of the problems I had with SR.....then I may just go and see it. OTOH, if I feel it's just going to continue in the same vein.....then I don't have to see it.

After all, no one is forcing me to see the movie.

I also think it is fair to say that SR DID NOT Bomb or Fail at the BO. It may have "underperformed" or failed to do gangbuster numbers like Spider-man.........it's performance may be considered "lackluster" compared to what was expected.....but it was not an outright bomb or failure.

So, overall, I feel my criticisms are fair, not blind hatred.

oh.......I also caught a bit of Spacey on Letterman last night. He mentioned that SR did well and they were going forward on another one.

i don't know how much that is worth......but there it is from Luthor's mouth......lol

 

[bsquad]

hey maze.......

If you think about it, we have had 5 Superman movies, and we've barely even scratched the surface of what the character's mythos can offer.

good point. I actually think the events of Superman Returns really forces them to do something we have not seen before in a Superman film when it comes to the character(s).

 

[Showtime]

i actually agree with you bosef......

no, I don't like the movie much myself, but I'm not going to just blindly bash it. yes, I vent, sometimes I rant, and I argue my points ( often passionately )...........and there are elements in SR with which I STRONGLY disagree......

but I do that to point out where I thought the movie went wrong....and how it could have been so much better. I also give SR praise where I feel praise is due.

Would I have preferred a total restart, instead of SR? Yes. Would I still prefer WB to pull an "Incredible Hulk" and go with a different director and direction for the next movie? Yes.

But, as far as I know, that is not going to happen. All I can do is hope for the best for the sequel. If the story turns out to be great and addresses many of the problems I had with SR.....then I may just go and see it. OTOH, if I feel it's just going to continue in the same vein.....then I don't have to see it.

After all, no one is forcing me to see the movie.

I also think it is fair to say that SR DID NOT Bomb or Fail at the BO. It may have "underperformed" or failed to do gangbuster numbers like Spider-man.........it's performance may be considered "lackluster" compared to what was expected.....but it was not an outright bomb or failure.

So, overall, I feel my criticisms are fair, not blind hatred.

oh.......I also caught a bit of Spacey on Letterman last night. He mentioned that SR did well and they were going forward on another one.

i don't know how much that is worth......but there it is from Luthor's mouth......lol

You impress me SBats...you have the knack of not liking the movie, but still being able to discuss it intelligently and without malice towards other viewpoints.

That is a good little "tidbit" about Spacey annoucing they were going forward with a 2nd Superman movie. Thanks.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

^Yeah good to know Spacey will seemingly be on board for a sequel if he knows they are going ahead with it.

Lexlives you really need to get a grip, your opinion is not fact, accept that, just as many people liked this movie as disliked it, and from personnal experience, i dont know anyone outside the boards who disliked SR.

 

[Showtime]

^Yeah good to know Spacey will seemingly be on board for a sequel if he knows they are going ahead with it.

Lexlives you really need to get a grip, your opinion is not fact, accept that, just as many people liked this movie as disliked it, and from personnal experience, i dont know anyone outside the boards who disliked SR.

Lexlives did not like one thing about this movie as far as I know. He didn't like Ottman's hairstyle and things it hurt the box office. He thinks that the Clark's dog was overshined by Kitty's dog which hurt the general public's opinion of Superman. Heck, he even hated the catering and thinks it ruined Spacey's potrayal of Lex.

 

[X Knight]

hey showtime....thanks for the comment. I appreciate it.

I just try to be fair, that's all. just as I feel you and maze, especially, are fair. While we have opposite views on SR, you are willing to listen to our complaints, to admit where SR could have been better, and overall, discuss the movie intelligently and politely.

so, kudos to you and maze........

as for the Spacey / sequel thing......I'm pretty sure that's what he said.

now, mind you, it was late at night and I was tired......but I was flicking through the channels and I cam across Letterman. I really don't like Letterman ( prefer Leno ), but I wanted to see if Spacey mentioned SR.

sure enough, I caught the very tail end of their Superman discussion......I believe Spacey said that SR did very well and that they were going ahead on a another one.

did anyone else catch Spacey on Letterman?

 

[Showtime]

hey showtime....thanks for the comment. I appreciate it.

I just try to be fair, that's all. just as I feel you and maze, especially, are fair. While we have opposite views on SR, you are willing to listen to our complaints, to admit where SR could have been better, and overall, discuss the movie intelligently and politely.

so, kudos to you and maze........

as for the Spacey / sequel thing......I'm pretty sure that's what he said.

now, mind you, it was late at night and I was tired......but I was flicking through the channels and I cam across Letterman. I really don't like Letterman ( prefer Leno ), but I wanted to see if Spacey mentioned SR.

sure enough, I caught the very tail end of their Superman discussion......I believe Spacey said that SR did very well and that they were going ahead on a another one.

did anyone else catch Spacey on Letterman?

Thanks for the kind words.

I am sure somebody will be able to cfm what Spacey said. I would imagine he would mention SR, since I am not sure what he is doing otherwise at the moment.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Lexlives did not like one thing about this movie as far as I know. He didn't like Ottman's hairstyle and things it hurt the box office. He thinks that the Clark's dog was overshined by Kitty's dog which hurt the general public's opinion of Superman. Heck, he even hated the catering and thinks it ruined Spacey's potrayal of Lex.

It wouldnt surprise me if he did think all those things.

 

[X Knight]

if Braniac does turn out to be the main villain.....I would soooo love to have a dialogue scene like this:

As Braniac and Lex team up to attack Earth, Superman and the JLA huddle together in the Batcave:

Superman: What happen?
Wonder Woman: Somebody set up us the bomb.
Batman: We get signal.
Superman: What!!
Batman: Main screen turn on.
Superman: It's you!!

(Braniac and Lex appear on the bat computer screen)

Lex: How are you gentlemen!!
Braniac: ALL YOUR BASE ARE BELONG TO US!!!
Lex: You are on the way to destruction.
Superman: What you say!!
Braniac: You have no chance to survive make your time.
Braniac + Lex: Ha ha ha ha...
Superman: You spoony Bard!!!
Wonder Woman: This guy are sick!!!!
Batman: Superman!!
Superman to JLA: You know what you doing.
Superman + JLA: For great justice!!!

(just then.......Robin shows up and tries to warn the JLA about Zod)

Robin: Listen to me! Just now, some guy in a black cloak goes walked east towards that grassy field!!!

Superman + JLA: **** NOOB!!!!!

 

[GreenKToo]

too true..

I'm always a bit taken back by some. I actually agree with EVERYTHING you said...except the bolded. It really isn't a MANY of us...it's a very vague numercial quantity.

Also, keep this in mind, watch Singer's interviews on X2. He humbly and frankly speaks about the things he felt could've been better in X1, and he went out of his way to correct them -- talking about them.

Yet, you have people like LexLives, that just leech onto what i think is artistic itnegrity (you don't get many 'drafts" of a movie) to realize what you could've done better and turn it into an admission of failure. I just dont' see it that way...

Look at Raimi, who really didn't "improve' anything he messed up with in SM1. I don't know, I just am really getting tired of lexLives...there's disliking this movie, and then ther'es just bashing.

LexLives represents the exact symbol of blind, near-trolling bashing of this film and it just is disgusting.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

If Brainiac is the villain i hope he just calls Superman Kal-El throughout the movie, its cool the way he said it on the JLUTAS.

 

[\S/JcDc\S/]

If Brainiac is the villain i hope he just calls Superman Kal-El throughout the movie, its cool the way he said it on the JLUTAS.

If Brainiac is cut out of second movie... There won't be a third Fans will revolt!

 

[wellsy]

I think I'll post how I'd like to see the next Superman movie turn out:

Set 3-4 years after SR, Lex has managed to get off that little island, has fired Kitty (who wanders around aimlessly, maybe gets a cameo), and has founded a small property business - Lexcorp Properties PTY LTD (That means he owns it with limited liability). He's sorted out with Supes and Lois that in return for keeping Jason's secret under wraps, and not doing anything wrong, they won't send him back to gaol (yes - THAT is how you spell jail!). This last little bit gets revealed in a flashback (maybe while Lex/Lois/Clark is staring out the window of his/her office or something).

Jason is left in the care of Richard and Lois, and Supes did have a quiet word with Richard, something IMO along the lines of:

S: You know about Jason...?

R: It seemed kind of obvious.

S: Even so... he knows you as father.

R (Gets a bit aggro): But YOU are his father.

S: No... not yet. He needs someone who can be there for him, who can take care of him. You're a good person, like those who raised me.

R (a bit surprised) : Wait... you're saying...

S: He needs you now. You're a good role model for him.

Richard looks as Supes as though he has three heads.

S: Don't worry - I'll still be around.

R (a wee bit confused) : Alright.

S: Take care of him.

Something like that in a flash back (say with Richard and Jason on a plane to work as European correspondant or something) would also look incredable.

And then theres the Krypton flashback scenes that we could have (the shots made for SR that were never used.

Those might just give us a clue as to Brainiac's (or however they'll spell it) origins.

Thats just setting it up really. It would then descend into what we'd probably expect (Brainy goes to find Jason, Supes, and does the usual thing, and the whole event greatly benefits Luthor, who begins to expand into weapons production and science R&D (someone mentioned CADMUS earlier?), using the wealth created by Lexcorp Properties and makes Lexcorp a holding company like Coca Cola (here in Oz its Coca Cola Amatil)).

Now, as for having Lex start corporate life in property - an obvious nod to the previous plot lines. The flashbacks work by allowing the characters to progress, while explaining what happened in the meantime.

Just my ideas for the start. Think it could work?

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

If Brainiac is cut out of second movie... There won't be a third Fans will revolt!

Er, i didnt mention mention anything about a 3rd or cutting out Brainiac JcDc! . I would like the villains in movies to go like this:

2nd: Brainiac and Lex
3rd: Darksied and Apokolips
4th: Imperiex and full blown epic end of the galaxy movie!

 

[\S/JcDc\S/]

Never said you did.