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Discussion in 'Fantastic Four' started by Silvermoth, Mar 8, 2021.
this whole thread is basically a spoiler lol. I think we need to tag spoilers better imho
'Multiverse of Madness' Screenwriter Wanted Tom Cruise to Play An Alternate Iron Man
From Waldron Interview:
Is John Krasinski’s casting an indication that he’ll be the Reed Richards we eventually meet in Fantastic Four? Or was this just a cool way for him to satisfy all the fan-casting and bow out from here?
That’s a question above my paygrade.
When John Krasinski’s Reed Richards is introduced as being from the Fantastic Four, Dr. Strange says, “Didn’t you guys chart in the 1960s?” Was that just a Beatles-referencing joke about the name, or was it meant to suggest that perhaps in the main MCU there actually had been a Fantastic Four in the 1960s?
I think Benedict riffed that, and I think that was just a joke about Fab Four, Fantastic Four. Yeah, I think that was just a gag.
--END OF INTERVIEW
My theory is Strange in every other universe that is not 616 is evil or becomes evil - so Reed in every other universe that is not 616 is a lot dumber than the 616 version - which will hopefully be a mastermind with contingency plans upon contingency plans. Truly THE smartest man alive.
I saw one video that theorized that The Illuminati was not as dumb or reckless as they appeared. This guy's theory was that Mordu had the time stone, and that they knew the outcome of their fight with Wanda, and how things as they played out would allow Wanda to come to her senses and destroy the Darkhold. They kept Mordu back, instead of engaging her, and later used the time stone to bring back the slain members. As evidence, he points out that in the movie where Thanos is defeated, his glove does not have the time stone in it. And Reed's use of the time platform also shows that they were involved with time.
I have no idea if any of that makes sense, but it's somehow comforting to think there might have been more going on beneath the surface than what we saw. Because if we take what we saw at face value, not only is Reed not the smartest man alive, he's a dunce. Which doesn't seem likely.
The Illuminati weren't dumb. They just didn't understand how powerful Wanda was because there was no 838 Scarlet Witch [yet]. Much like the 616 Sorcerers they were just learning of this incredibly powerful supervillain.
Dumb people don't defeat Thanos.
Unfortunately, I think it was just lazy writing and the fans put more thought into it than the film-makers and came up with better ideas.
I’d like to be wrong, but I wouldn’t bet on the film-makers being that clever while also giving us a scene that was overtly empty, gratuitous and a waste of great characters.
Arrogance is the opposite of wisdom. Reed literally told Wanda how to defeat Black Bolt. I guess everybody's entitled to an off day, but wow.
I think everyone is focused more on the result of the scene than the logic. How was Reed to know that Wanda could do the Matrix trick on Black Bolt? That's very one in a trillion, so I honestly am not mad about that
I don't think Waldron is a lazy writer nor do I believe Raimi isn't a clever filmmaker. They're both very talented and crafted a great CBM. I don't think you understood the point of the Illuminati in the film, which was to convey the immense power Wanda amassed after Wandavision. The Illuminati scene showcases that Wanda is now a Supervillain and one comparable to Thanos.
She single-handedly defeated and killed the 838 Universe's answer to The Avengers.
I know if it had been Apocalypse that wiped out the Illuminati or The Beyonder or Dormammu people wouldn't be upset & complaining. They're upset that it was Wanda because much like the Illuminati did, they underestimate the powers of the Scarlet Witch.
No offense to Waldron or Raimi, but the film and scene speak for themselves.
Even the best can make poor choices.
It’s among the poorest reviewed of the Marvel
Films for a reason.
They didn't know how powerful Wanda was and they didn't know how insane she was. REED was trying to empathise with her at first and when that didn't work he tried to warn her. It was all in getting her to surrender peacefully.
As others have said, it was impossible for him to know that she could render Black Bolt useless. Remember that these characters didn't know the extent of her powers. Heck, we as the audience didn't know until she killed them.
So I think people are over-exaggerating the mistake
If you're referring to Rotten Tomatoes and movie critics, you've totally lost me. They're inherently useless. Thor: The Dark World was Certified Fresh in 2013. As was Iron Man 3. As was Ant-Man and The Wasp. As was Black Widow.
Critics are useless. What I listen to is the fandom. Because I'm a fan. And
at both my sold out opening weekend IMAX screenings for Doctor Strange 2, the crowds went NUTS when Reed was onscreen. Both during his incursion speech and again when he was front and center leading the Illuminati against Wanda.
While Doctor Strange 2 isn't Top 10 MCU for me, it's still Top 20 MCU. A very good Raimi-heavy multiverse chapter that pushes us closer to the next big imminent crossover event.
The movie made half a Billion in 4 days and the talk of the town when it comes to the fandom centers around
Krasinski as Reed Richards and the upcoming MCU Fantastic Four feature.
So for me as a fan, Doctor Strange 2 was en epic win. Specially the Illuminati sequences.
I don't think people are upset because they made Wanda so powerful, they just think the Illuminati should have and would have mounted a better defense. And the Illuminati were portrayed as blundering, arrogant fools. If they really had no idea of Wanda's abilities, why did Captain Marvel say "Oh, we can handle your witch". They were familiar with dream walking, and the powers of the Darkhold. I don't buy that they didn't know how powerful Wanda was.
They didn't know.
838 Wanda had not become the Scarlet Witch. Their Wanda was just raising kids. Even the 616 Sorcerer Supreme and his bff Stephen Strange didn't know how powerful Wanda was and that's literally the plot of the film. 616 Strange witnessing her vast power & trying to figure out how to stop her. The Illuminati didn't even have a Strange to advise them on Scarlet Witch.
People say "The Illuminati got wrecked by Wanda. What a joke." That's literally why 838 Captain Marvel is so cocky in the movie. She has no idea what they're going up against. None of them do. Hence their epic demise. Both the Illuminati and us the audience are learning of Wanda's uber-powerful supervillain status.
I disagree. They didn't have a Dr. Strange, but they had their own Sorcerer Supreme in Mordu. They knew she could dream walk, and they knew her motivations (which is why Reed tried to talk to her about her kids). They knew about the Darkhold, and they knew that it put their entire reality in danger.
Everybody is welcome to their opinion.
In my opinion and in the opinion of many other fans, the filmmakers could have achieved the stated objectives of
Showing Wanda is very powerful and showing the Illuminati are arrogant
with a better crafted, more entertaining, less gratuitous scene that paid more respect to iconic characters that were the highlight of the film but ended up being used as simple fodder.
Give me a couple days and I could use that situation and those characters to write an epic scene that would be remembered as a highlight in MCU history while doing justice to the characters involved (and I’m not trying to brag - nearly everyone reading this could have written a better scene).
All the ingredients were there, but they squandered them.
Three examples of lazy writing:
1. Superman meets Batman. Superman flicks Batman’s head and it ends up three counties away from his body.
2. Superman meets Batman. Batman stabs Superman in the heart with a Kryptonite dagger.
3. The Illuminati scene in MOM.
You’ll never believe who was supposed to originally play that character in that movie.
Daniel Craig was supposed to be Reed!
This actually even further makes me think Krasinski as Reed is nothing more than a one and done cameo.
Sadly with no director in place, I think the idea that FF is cast and ready to go is wishful thinking.
But regarding the thing that everybody knows but we can’t discuss openly, let’s consider it an audition and if the studio, director and actor are all interested, it’s certainly a possibility.
Yeah I don't think you know who is going to be playing him in the main timeline if that was the case
ironically you're the one making it a spoiler by saying that... the OP could have easily just been seen as a hypothetical
as Krasinski has been discussed as a fan-cast for years, long before he actually showed up or was rumor/leaked to be in the movie
an as to the OP in question
this can be said of anyone older/more mature, not just him... an although I do agree about the older angle for the character being more fitting, giving the depth of MCU it's getting harder to explain a per-established F4 team/ Reed as we saw there... that just hasn't been mentioned/or known yet
I'd be of curious to see how such a thing would be explained, but, my fear is it just wouldn't be
The original report here is off. He was supposed to be Balder the Brave, not Reed. Couldn’t shoot the scenes and that’s when they replaced him with Krasinski.
I referenced a possibility like that in another thread. That the Illuminati had more in store for us than their underwhelming appearance in DS:MoM.
Glad to hear that, he would have made a terrible Reed. Didn't tag that because his name is only mentioned in spoilers.
The name is Richards.