Comics Storm & T'Challa: Royal Wedding Countdown Discussion

[Valechan]

Claremont did say once he wanted to do a story with her grandparents... here's hoping they appear... funny, Jean looses her family and Ororo gains hers

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

Uh huh...

Her first love finally wants to pick up where they left off and you don't think she wouldn't be emotional about it? She cried when Forge decided not to marry her. She just holds it in better than the rest.

Agreed.

Some may be forgetting the fact that T'Challa's bond with Ororo predates that of Logan, Forge, etc. He saved her life, and BP #14 beautifully reintroduces this in greater detail. There's a reason why they've been flirting back and forth for the last few years, there's unfinished business there.

She fell apart in #14, but it was understandable and I thought well done. We don't see Storm with cracks in her armor often, and T'Challa really renders her weak in the knees. I mean, this powerful, "Goddess" figure is like putty in his hands. I don't think any other male character has impacted her on that level like he does.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

^^IQ tests, LS. IQ tests.

I can both giveth and taketh away. Javon knows he needs to behave.

I wasnt exactly doing extensive bashing there, and my follow up post, explained my reasons for dislike and my opinionis.

MM,

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[weatherwitch]

Agreed.

Some may be forgetting the fact that T'Challa's bond with Ororo predates that of Logan, Forge, etc. He saved her life, and BP #14 beautifully reintroduces this in greater detail. There's a reason why they've been flirting back and forth for the last few years, there's unfinished business there.

She fell apart in #14, but it was understandable and I thought well done. We don't see Storm with cracks in her armor often, and T'Challa really renders her weak in the knees. I mean, this powerful, "Goddess" figure is like putty in his hands. I don't think any other male character has impacted her on that level like he does.

And some of you are forgetting that no. No it doesn't. And No! No, he didn't. She saved him! Gah!

T'Challa and Ororo knew each other as teenagers. I can tell you the name of my "first love" too (who I knew since I was 6 until well into my teens) and I can say with utter certainty that those feelings stand NO chance of usurping any love I have right now.

They have not been flirting back and forth over the years. One instance before the Wild Kingdom crossover hardly counts as back and forth for years.

I'm all for T'Challa making 'Ro weak in the knees if done right. But her being distressed over events over a decade ago when she clearly had no understanding of the complexities of love (no one does at 13, most don't at 20), well, forgive me, is very un-Storm.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

And some of you are forgetting that no. No it doesn't. And No! No, he didn't. She saved him! Gah!

T'Challa and Ororo knew each other as teenagers. I can tell you the name of my "first love" too (who I knew since I was 6 until well into my teens) and I can say with utter certainty that those feelings stand NO chance of usurping any love I have right now.

They have not been flirting back and forth over the years. One instance before the Wild Kingdom crossover hardly counts as back and forth for years.

I'm all for T'Challa making 'Ro weak in the knees if done right. But her being distressed over events over a decade ago when she clearly had no understanding of the complexities of love (no one does at 13, most don't at 20), well, forgive me, is very un-Storm.

The "saving" part goes both ways. #14 shows their first meeting.

Anyway, I like how the story is being done so far. I don't have a problem with what some call "retconning", and I'll tell you why:

Storm has always been a member of the X-Men--so she's had to share space with them in the pages of the comics. Therefore, it's not necessary to explore every nook and cranny of her life prior to now for her future to make sense in my opinion.

I'm not sure if you've read the issue yet, but Storm's emotions are obviously running beyond his "dumping" her--it really boils down to her phobia of general abandonment. And she's very private and guarded anyway. So her reaction and deep attachment to him--however new it is to us--is not un-Storm-like in my opinion.

Who said we had to stop learning new things about Storm's deep and dark past?

 

[weatherwitch]

The "saving" part goes both ways. #14 shows their first meeting.

Anyway, I like how the story is being done so far. I don't have a problem with what some call "retconning", and I'll tell you why:

Storm has always been a member of the X-Men--so she's had to share space with them in the pages of the comics. Therefore, it's not necessary to explore every nook and cranny of her life prior to now for her future to make sense in my opinion.

I'm not sure if you've read the issue yet, but Storm's emotions are obviously running beyond his "dumping" her--it really boils down to her phobia of general abandonment. And she's very private and guarded anyway. So her reaction and deep attachment to him--however new it is to us--is not un-Storm-like in my opinion.

Who said we had to stop learning new things about Storm's deep and dark past?

You are of course entitle to your opinion--however wrong it may be.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

You are of course entitle to your opinion--however wrong it may be.

But of course.

 

[Red Mask]

I'm not asking anyone to agree with me. I have yet to read the comic, it's sitting in the other room. Perhaps in context it will feel different, but as of right now, it sounds like a whine.

Well at that moment, it was just her and King T'Challa. Wolverine left and the freed women are away. She could be perfectly frank with the Black Panther without having to save face.

 

[VICTORVONDOOMX]

Here's my opinion of T'challa and Ororo....
*barf....blarg....bu..bu...buffflog...*


Sooo forced, soooo lame.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

I do believe the marriage proposal in BP #14 was a bit rushed--it really could've been saved, stretched out and covered in the next issues. So yes, that did feel crammed a little. But who knows--maybe Storm will tell him "no" in #15?

If they're not getting married until July...a lot can happen.

 

[deemar325]

Here's my opinion of T'challa and Ororo....
*barf....blarg....bu..bu...buffflog...*


Sooo forced, soooo lame.

Speaking of lame..^

 

[mightiest_mortal]

Speaking of lame..^

well to be fair.. it does seem a bit too much like a really bad marketing scam. The two most popular african marvel characters getting married in a series that starts in Black History month. Was kinda hoping after Jessica Jones Daughter, that marvel might have grown out of the whole "oh.. we just have these two Africans.. so theyl have to marry eachother.. god forbid they marry non africans" thing.
I dont mean its a completely bad idea... but the fact that theyre having to retcon this whole series and past romance for them says it all. Far as ive heard theyve only really even had much contact with eachother in one issue of Marvel Team up.
Couldnt she have just moved over to the Black Panther comic for a few years so we could have seen the relationship develop?

...also the Malcolm X connection kinda bugs me.. much as the way the rasputin connection did in Bloodline. Why was he even in the MArvel universe? its a fictional universe with its own fictional characters and its own fictional history. Keep celebrities in Ultimates.

 

[deemar325]

^ I can understand your meaning, I just like the fact Marvel and Hudlin are at least trying to get an black readership. Yeah it's paper thin in it's attempt, but hey I remember when Will Eisner had his lil'coon character running around with the 'Spirit' and Falcon all of a sudden became 'Snap' Wilson and BlackPanther (a King!) being a follower and always deferring to Cap or Tony or Blank white hero of the story.

So sue me if I'm feeling this romance and push to bring attention to these characters.

 

[Red Mask]

Celebrities, public figures, and historical people have been meantioned, and featured in Marvel before. Ultimates is not the first to do so.

 

[FieryBalrog]

Far as ive heard theyve only really even had much contact with eachother in one issue of Marvel Team up.
Couldnt she have just moved over to the Black Panther comic for a few years so we could have seen the relationship develop?

a few years? You think Marvel Editorial has that kind of self-restraint and planning ability? Heh.

 

[MoPlaYa]

I`m not a fan of Black Panther...Storm should have kept it in the X-Men....What other woman is strong enough to keep Logan in check?

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

Why is it a crime that two African characters marry eachother all of a sudden? Storm has dated men of several different cultures, and of them all, only her relationship with Logan has any real gravity. If she married him that'd rock the entire Marvel Universe in a way that hasn't been seen since Reed and Susan, Petey and Mary Jane, or Scott and Jean tied their knots.

However, the dating/marriage pattern for Storm is the same as it's always been for her--microwaved. Seriously, look at her and Forge: They were stranded. They had an intimate moment. And it grew from there. It's the same thing here with T'Challa. They are childhood friends--both in the 616 and other realities. True, we are getting an expansion on their origin together, but the roots have been there for years now (all the way back to the 2002 Priest run). And they've been having run-ins with eachother/flirting in BP's book for a while now too.

Truth be told, people in real life get married for a lot less anyway.

 

[FieryBalrog]

Why is it a crime that two African characters marry eachother all of a sudden? Storm has dated men of several different cultures, and of them all, only her relationship with Logan has any real gravity. If she married him that'd rock the entire Marvel Universe in a way that hasn't been seen since Reed and Susan, Petey and Mary Jane, or Scott and Jean tied their knots.

However, the dating/marriage pattern for Storm is the same as it's always been for her--microwaved. Seriously, look at her and Forge: They were stranded. They had an intimate moment. And it grew from there. It's the same thing here with T'Challa. They are childhood friends--both in the 616 and other realities. True, we are getting an expansion on their origin together, but the roots have been there for years now (all the way back to the 2002 Priest run). And they've been having run-ins with eachother/flirting in BP's book for a while now too.

Truth be told, people in real life get married for a lot less anyway.

I dont think it'd really be that iconic, mostly because it has "contrived" written all over it. Its not an organic relationship that was allowed to develop and grow. Its sudden Editorial mandate that Storm and T'Challa be married, so internal logic and consistency be damned, a relationship and subsequent marriage will suddenly spring full formed like Athena from Zeus's brow and be shoehorned into place.

It'd make much more sense for Storm and Forge to revisit their relationship than this "event", which is obviously a publicity stunt. You can't seriously be claiming this is like Peter marrying MJ. This is like Batman marrying Wonder Woman out of nowhere.

 

[Valechan]

After what Forge did to her? He should be hung from his nose hair until he dies.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

I dont think it'd really be that iconic, mostly because it has "contrived" written all over it. You can't seriously be claiming this is like Peter marrying MJ. This is like Batman marrying Wonder Woman out of nowhere.

I think you may be misreading my post.

I am saying her marriage to Logan would be on that level of iconic gravity a la Petey/Jane, Sue/Reed, Jean/Scott, etc., and only because there is so much history there developed.

The same can't be said for her relationship with T'Challa. Their relationship has roots but they aren't nearly as deep. Therefore the impact won't be as great I think.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

After what Forge did to her? He should be hung from his nose hair until he dies.

Agreed.

Shallow.

 

[weatherwitch]

I dont think it'd really be that iconic, mostly because it has "contrived" written all over it. Its not an organic relationship that was allowed to develop and grow. Its sudden Editorial mandate that Storm and T'Challa be married, so internal logic and consistency be damned, a relationship and subsequent marriage will suddenly spring full formed like Athena from Zeus's brow and be shoehorned into place.

It'd make much more sense for Storm and Forge to revisit their relationship than this "event", which is obviously a publicity stunt. You can't seriously be claiming this is like Peter marrying MJ. This is like Batman marrying Wonder Woman out of nowhere.

On most of this I am in complete agreement--however I'd buy Wonder Woman and Batman long before I'm feeling Storm and Panther. At least Batman and Wonder Woman have been teammates for years.

This farce of a union (the proposal was complete and utter BS at its most fundamental) is not an expansion of any type of relationship from before. The entire MU and Storm's history is being rewritten to force this into place. If anyone--anyone!--can show me issues aside from the singular Marvel Team up and the recent Wild Kingdom (another contrived crossover) where Ororo or T'Challa expressed desire for one another, a fondness, an attraction--or hell, even an "Gee, I wonder how Storm's doing?" I may not see this as so completely and ******edly forced.

I am not against these characters marrying so much as I am against the rushed, half ass, forced way that Marvel is going about it. "We want young female black readers, so let's force these two characters together in a whirlwind romance and see if we can lure them in", as opposed to what? Creating a comic worth reading based on an original character? Developing the comics already in place? I'm no fan of Hudlin, I'm no fan of Joe Q's inhouse office politics, and as of recently I am no real fan of Marvel. And I know I'm not the only one that feels this way.

 

[FieryBalrog]

I think you may be misreading my post.

I am saying her marriage to Logan would be on that level of iconic gravity a la Petey/Jane, Sue/Reed, Jean/Scott, etc., and only because there is so much history there developed.

The same can't be said for her relationship with T'Challa. Their relationship has roots but they aren't nearly as deep. Therefore the impact won't be as great I think.

ahhhhh. I see. Sorry

Although I disagree with that too . Logan has never been shown to love Storm, its never been indicated. They've had a deep friendship with some tender moments, even a few suggestive ones when the writers got bored, but nothing more. It could develop into something more, but it seems based more on fan demand (sort of like Logan/Rogue, although Logan/Storm is more viable) than anything the characters share. There's more evidence in the comics for Storm/Kurt than Storm/Logan by quite a bit. A marriage would be more like hey, we're bored, we've made doe eyes a couple of times over 30 years of comics, so lets break up our friendship and get hitched. It feels wrong, almost... incestuous because of the brother/sister relationship.

It wouldn't be NEARLY as contrived as T'Challa and Storm, of course.

Besides, they're together in Ultimate. For myself, I prefer to keep it that way.

However, I might be just a tad biased because I am a big Jean/Logan shipper. Which I do feel, though, has much more basis in the comics and the characters history.

 

[weatherwitch]

ahhhhh. I see. Sorry

Although I disagree with that too . Logan has never been shown to love Storm, its never been indicated. They've had a deep friendship with some tender moments, even a few suggestive ones when the writers got bored, but nothing more. It could develop into something more, but it seems based more on fan demand (sort of like Logan/Rogue, although Logan/Storm is more viable) than anything the characters share.

It wouldn't be NEARLY as contrived as T'Challa and Storm, of course.

Besides, they're together in Ultimate. For myself, I prefer to keep it that way.

They're not really together in Ultimate, so don't count that.

They have been shown to have attraction and deep feelings on several occassions, including passion, deep friendship and great love-- but I won't ramble endlessly on my RoLoness--as I would, could and am stubborn about it.

The bile in my mouth won't leave at the mention of Logan/Rogue. Ew. Just, ew.

 

[FieryBalrog]

They're not really together in Ultimate, so don't count that.

They have been shown to have attraction and deep feelings on several occassions, including passion, deep friendship and great love-- but I won't ramble endlessly on my RoLoness--as I would, could and am stubborn about it.

The bile in my mouth won't leave at the mention of Logan/Rogue. Ew. Just, ew.

The list of Logan's "true loves" has been compiled a few times in-comic, mostly by villains, and Storm's never been mentioned. It's been a deep friendship, I agree. Love, perhaps, but not in that sense. I edited my post above (I have a bad habit of continually re-editing posts right after I post them) to reflect more of my objections to it.

What's interesting is that there have been a lot of hints that Storm is bi over the years. Perhaps they could explore a bit of that, tastefully of course