Discussion in 'Misc. Comics Films' started by Thread Manager, Dec 28, 2017.
This is a continuation thread, the old thread is [split]537135[/split]
This is a continuation thread, the old thread is [split]536817[/split]
Again, just read my response in an earlier post in this very thread. Its not that hard to find unless you are genuinely avoiding obvious plot points and character traits just so that you can make your opinion sound like fact where its not. I get the feeling not enough time was devoted by you to read the actual conversation that was happening around this issue in this very thread.
And since it is a new thread and we are in dire need of moving on, I just rewatched CW and man, there are so many levels of emotional layers to unlock in this movie. Two that stood out this time for me:
1. How the hell were the Russos and the writers able to tell such a rich (in the right way with a lot of love) father-son relationship with a few seconds of dialogue so that when BP gets on the revenge run, you totally get why he feels the way he feels?
2. We all talk about how Stark would feel watching his parents being killed brutally but what about Rogers? Howard was a good friend, men who have fought a war side by side, the guy who was part of the group that made him Cap, the guy who never gave up looking for him even when the rest of the world did. Cap only knew HYDRA was behind it but to see your best friend kill an other good friend, WOW!!! Layers and depths in this movie are just awesome!!!
Emotional layers and Civil War? Nah...not really
Guardians? Oh yeah. Logan? For sure. But CW was not that emotional to me at least. BP's dad's death was no more sad than most standard superhero origin's parent's death. Especially since we only knew the guy for like 2 seconds. Not saying it wasn't sad, but it didn't move me/
Civil War is about as deep as a kiddie pool. It starts and tries to explore deep themes, but it's all surface level until the Bucky reveal.
Maybe be a little less condescending next time and Ill consider giving a damn about what youve written.
I'd like to have less origin stories about "I lost my parent(s), I must now strive for peace by vanquishing evil like the one that offed my folks"
How can anyone be a hero if their parents don't die?
1. I don't think that the relationship between BP and his dad was "rich"...They only had a few minutes of screentime.
2. That's interesting but the movie never actually addresses that, it's hardly a "layer". CW shows that Cap is going to stand by Bucky no matter what so even though it might be horrible for him to see his good friend getting killed by his BFF, the movie completely forgets about that potentially powerful element so that we can get the Cap & Bucky vs IM fight.
Watched Logan again a few nights ago. A year later and it still holds up as the best comic book film of 2017, if you ask me. Still not exactly my cup of tea, but that's what I love about it. It gets you thinking like a Black Mirror episode. Disturbs you like one too. It doesn't have high replay value for the same reason that show doesn't either. It's almost not supposed to.
Also despite the praise it got, I still find Homecoming a little underrated. It wasn't a genre-defining film like Logan and Wonder Woman, but there's a lot of cultural commentary in that film I feel was overlooked. It highlighted how the world changed for the worse since the 1960s, while reminding us of what people loved about Spider-Man in the 1960s. It's not Batman Begins, but I get why Feige compared the two. It did try to "explain" Spider-Man like how BB tried to "explain" Batman, even if BB did it better.
It also shows the advantages of the Marvel formula. The more I think about it, the Marvel films where the shift between drama and humor felt the most natural are Iron Man and Homecoming. I think that's because 1) they're both character pieces and 2) center on protagonists that do the exact same thing. It didn't ruin the stakes when that guy yelled "Yay Iron Man", because I knew how shameful Peter felt. Tony's wisecracks don't hurt my interest in him, because I know how much he fakes it.
Characters like Thor and Cap don't have that privilege. Even when they get a solo piece, I'm never always in their head like I am around Peter and Tony. They just don't have that personality; they're more extroverted and emotionally stable so they don't benefit as much from the formula as the latter two do.
Civil War didn't get nearly into the issues of registration and the divide between the heroes as I would have wanted, but Zemo's scenes were very fell done and emotional. I'd say his attempted suicide was one of the best scenes in the MCU to date.
Lol.. I was not being condescending at all. I just pointed out that its better to take your time reading the thread before posting a response. And yeah, I stand by my post.
Nah.. its nice that you like to pass around your opinion as if its undeniable fact but I just watched multiple reviews and takes on the movie as I had some time yesterday night and its obvious how different people had different takeaways from the movie. That is what rich and layered story telling is all about. It may not have worked for you, does not mean it did not work for others. Too bad you can't see what is so obvious to me in that movie.
1. That is the very reason why I said it was rich. It was about as strong as any standard SH parent death scene and yet they had only few seconds to build it. THAT is the achievement I am talking about. To me, it was the performance of those two that made me buy it. So I guess its more props to Kani and Boseman there but the lines very powerful and yet made sense too. Them making it seem like T'Challa at that point is a hot head who does not believe much in diplomacy was a smart call to make that moment work.
2. I agree that the movie does not address it enough. I still feel Evans played it a bit in his performance but yeah, it could have been addressed in a bigger way in that movie. I am just pointing out how layered the story was even though the screen play perhaps did not address it enough. That is a credit to the guys who came up with this tie in idea, not sure if its from the comics themselves or this was something specifically set up for the MCU but either way, it works a treat and provides so much potential with respect to screen play.
I lost this debate before it even started.
You sure about that?
Well, re-reading it I guess it can feel that way but I just meant to point out that having had the last whatever number of posts debate the issue, its a little lazy on the part of that poster to simply ignore all of it and come back and post an agreement with the original point without caring to at least read up on the discussion. Anyways, if it came off as condescending, I apologize. That was not the intent. It was more frustration than condescension if that makes sense.
I was a part of the conversation before you were. And for your information, I skimmed through some of the posts I missed before commenting. I missed yours, but not only do I doubt that you said anything I havent heard before, but your know-it-all tone and insistence on pointing out that what I wrote was only my opinion and not a fact (spoiler alert: Im aware) has made me completely uninterested in anything you have to say. Have a good day.
Wonder Woman's mom is still alive and she never knew her dad anyway. And her mom loves her very much so it's not like she had a miserable childhood she had to overcome.
Suit yourself. Hope you do realize the irony of this post, its tone and you calling me a "know it all".. And yeah, I still maintain your original point has no basis on any fact.
Isn't Antiope her "daddy"?
I thought it was obvious that my comment was a joke.