The Rise of Skywalker SW: THE RISE OF SKYWALKER - The Rotten Tomatoes thread

[Detective Conan]

TLJ put the trilogy (and whoever was going to try and pick up the pieces after him) in an impossible position. He really screwed the pooch. No matter how bad TROS turns out to be, I think I'll probably struggle to blame JJ all that much.

I would still argue that while having to follow TLJ is an unenviable position I certainly think it wasn’t an impossible task that put J.J in this compromising position like some are making it out to be.

You could absolutely do a follow-up to that film without needing to dig back into the well of old ideas like the Emperor. Bringing back the Emperor is essentially a creatively bankrupt idea in order to compensate for the fact the chief baddie(Snoke) got killed off, and they don’t feel Kylo is a strong enough villain to support the last film by himself.

 

[TheGuy]

Return of the Jedi
The Empire Strikes Back
Revenge of the Sith
Solo
Attack of the Clones
The Force Awakens
The Phantom Menace
Rogue One
A New Hope
The Last Jedi

I'm just hoping The Rise of Skywalker will be good enough to salvage the trilogy. I don't see any real chance that I'll end up liking this trilogy as much as either of the other two.

I'm curious. Our top-3 are the same, but why do you have TLJ so low? Haven't seen TFA and TLJ in full, though.

 

[Detective Conan]

It’s up to 59%. It’s closing in on that fresh rating!

 

[rashad]

213 reviews so far with another 200+ to come.

 

[Webhead38]

Its a sad day when the new celebrated high water mark for Star Wars is whether it can achieve a fresh rating... WOW. How the mighty have fallen.

 

[MahvelBaby!]

If it was in the 90s the excuse machine from the haters would be equally sad

 

[Mr. Peanut]

I tried watching that once on Netflix. I gave up after 10 mins

It's better if you watch it in its correct chronological position as part of the Clone Wars show. Still not great, or anything, but it puts you in the mindset of watching a standard fare, early series multi-parter rather than a theatrical movie, and it gives the story a little bit better context.

 

[Snow Queen]

The Clone Wars movie isn't even an especially great arc of the show. It's fine, but nowhere near their best. The funny thing is, a number of later episodes provide much more cinematic looking and better written experiences than the one that got a theatrical release.

 

[thangaran]

It seems like there were too many things to balance out such as rounding out the whole saga, playing off from the utter garbage of TLJ, fan service and trying to rebuild good faith back. But sadly it seems disappointing. Ill watch it this weekend

 

[TheVileOne]

The Clone Wars movie isn't even an especially great arc of the show. It's fine, but nowhere near their best. The funny thing is, a number of later episodes provide much more cinematic looking and better written experiences than the one that got a theatrical release.

The Clone Wars movie received terrible reviews as I recall.

 

[Snow Queen]

The Clone Wars movie received terrible reviews as I recall.

Yeah, it did.

 

[Mr. Peanut]

The Clone Wars movie isn't even an especially great arc of the show. It's fine, but nowhere near their best. The funny thing is, a number of later episodes provide much more cinematic looking and better written experiences than the one that got a theatrical release.

That's why I'm saying it's best viewed in the context of the whole show. Lots of great shows have episodes, especially early on, that are less than stellar. If it had simply been a regular multi-parter in season 1, no one would give it a second thought. And that's essentially what it is: a group of season one episodes that were put together and aired in theaters.

 

[Fincher]

I'm curious. Our top-3 are the same, but why do you have TLJ so low? Haven't seen TFA and TLJ in full, though.

There's a lot to it, and I didn't want to derail the thread, so I posted it in the The Last Jedi review thread.

 

[Doc Samson]

I'm bias, I didn't hate TLJ and IMO it's wrong to blame that for Abrams doing exactly what he did with FA, which I still haven't seen twice because there was literally no reason to.

This is one of those franchises where people want their cake and blah blah. You can't do anything even remotely different without getting crucified, especially not to the original trilogy cast. And if this is the alternative, well...congratulations. Everyone who hated TLJ should love this....

 

[DeadPresident]

I'm bias, I didn't hate TLJ and IMO it's wrong to blame that for Abrams doing exactly what he did with FA, which I still haven't seen twice because there was literally no reason to.

This is one of those franchises where people want their cake and blah blah. You can't do anything even remotely different without getting crucified, especially not to the original trilogy cast. And if this is the alternative, well...congratulations. Everyone who hated TLJ should love this....

I think this is a massive copout that people love employing to try and deflect from a terrible product, it’s not like every creative decision was going to create the same level of negative reaction.

This constant attempt to make it seem like SW fans will hate literally everything isn’t fair, it’s clear ROS is lacking severely in quality so making it out like even a good movie would’ve gotten this amount of criticism isn’t logical.

 

[Doc Samson]

I think this is a massive copout that people love employing to try and deflect from a terrible product, it’s not like every creative decision was going to create the same level of negative reaction.

This constant attempt to make it seem like SW fans will hate literally everything isn’t fair, it’s clear ROS is lacking severely in quality so making it out like even a good movie would’ve gotten this amount of criticism isn’t logical.

I disagree, I think almost anything dealing with the OT cast would've been met with anger. I believe a lot of the disdain I saw for the newer characters somehow related to this foolish "woke culture" ignorance that's been permeating social media and online the last couple of years.

And if you can agree that at least on some level those things are true, and if so that it helped create this overly critical state of being for this franchise, then what are you able to do other than rehash films we already have? RoS is lacking in quality because yet again JJ had nothing new to bring to the table, and it's directly related to this noise created by a segment of people who absolutely want nothing new brought to said table. Nothing you had in childhood will resonant the same in adulthood, the sooner people understand that, the better off Star Wars will be...

 

[DeadPresident]

I disagree, I think almost anything dealing with the OT cast would've been met with anger. I believe a lot of the disdain I saw for the newer characters somehow related to this foolish "woke culture" ignorance that's been permeating social media and online the last couple of years.

And if you can agree that at least on some level those things are true, and if so that it helped create this overly critical state of being for this franchise, then what are you able to do other than rehash films we already have? RoS is lacking in quality because yet again JJ had nothing new to bring to the table, and it's directly related to this noise created by a segment of people who absolutely want nothing new brought to said table. Nothing you had in childhood will resonant the same in adulthood, the sooner people understand that, the better off Star Wars will be...

Nah, SW is like any other established franchise and the fanbase isn’t that different from other invested fanbases. They had the ability and choice to take as much time as they wanted and employ people who care for the source material.

I guarantee that between the users on this forum we could brainstorm a better trilogy that not only ticks all the representation boxes, but also incorporates new characters while treating the OT ones with respect and resolves their arcs satisfactorily.

This trilogy not only disrespected the original canon but it also delivered garbage B-movie tier new characters with little to no reason to get invested in them and offering minimal development. This isn’t because the SW fandom is impossible to please, it’s because the quality of the product delivered after TFA was incredibly mediocre.

 

[Doc Samson]

TFA was incredibly mediocre though. It's almost the literal definition of mediocre, and not to derail, but how exactly are the new characters B-movie garbage? If they chose not to progress their story in satisfactory ways, that's one thing, but they're fine characters with fine actors portraying them.

And can we be honest, there's two, truly great films in this 9 film franchise. Two. Bears bringing down the empire? I'll pass on that. The less said about the prequel trilogy the better. And now we have two rehashes for virtually no reason other than a director's fear of upsetting a petulant fanbase. A fanbase that I do believe is the most cynical, critical and ignorant that I may have ever seen...

 

[DeadPresident]

TFA was fine as a reinvention of ANH that ended in a way that gave film makers an opportunity to explore interesting narrative arcs.

I’m a big fan of all the actors, they’re great, but the characters have amounted to B movie mediocrity because their development was handled badly. I care no more or less about any of them now than I did at the beginning of the first movie. No events occur that really put them at stake or in danger you don’t already know they’ll escape from, specifically Rey who’s some kind of god tier Jedi that would dispatch Yoda without breaking a sweat.

The trilogy is a mish-mash of poorly executed social and political commentary, very badly executed new characters, and a complete disregard for the canon the established fan base was invested in.

Better film makers and creatives would’ve incorporated intelligent social and political commentary and transitioned old characters into new with better capability than what we’ve seen. This trilogy will be remembered as a ramshackle whole interspersed with some enjoyable moments. It’s the DCEU of the Disney universe.

 

[Doc Samson]

TFA was fine as a reinvention of ANH that ended in a way that gave film makers an opportunity to explore interesting narrative arcs.

I’m a big fan of all the actors, they’re great, but the characters have amounted to B movie mediocrity because their development was handled badly. I care no more or less about any of them now than I did at the beginning of the first movie. No events occur that really put them at stake or in danger you don’t already know they’ll escape from, specifically Rey who’s some kind of god tier Jedi that would dispatch Yoda without breaking a sweat.

The trilogy is a mish-mash of poorly executed social and political commentary, very badly executed new characters, and a complete disregard for the canon the established fan base was invested in.

Better film makers and creatives would’ve incorporated intelligent social and political commentary and transitioned old characters into new with better capability than what we’ve seen. This trilogy will be remembered as a ramshackle whole interspersed with some enjoyable moments. It’s the DCEU of the Disney universe.

Again, I would say the majority of the 9 films were poorly executed. It's impossible to have that same feel and nostalgia of the late 70s/early 80s no matter how hard they try, so why even attempt it?

The only good thing, IMO, about this new trilogy was the characters and the fact that they were different and had genuine chemistry with each other. Like I said previously, it's not their fault they were essentially separated for the better part of one and a half films, which undercuts some of that chemistry.

George Lucas himself couldn't recreate lightning in a bottle, I don't think any of the characters from the prequels were likable in the way the OT cast was, in fact they were largely worse than anything we've gotten in the sequels. It was a special time that Star Wars arrived in, a mishmash of elements on screen that nobody had ever seen before, but that time is over. IF this franchise is going to continue, the creators need to have freedom and increasingly the fandom is making that near impossible...

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

As someone who loved TFA and hates TLJ count me as another who thinks I will enjoy this movie.

As for the future, while I say my feelings on TLJ above I do have hope for Johnson's trilogy, as it won't be existing or beloved characters he will be telling a story about and this is when he is best as a director. Taking over beloved characters and ruining them in many ways, while also leaving them in none interesting places at the end was the whole problem with TLJ for me.

Creating his own characters won't have that stigma and the guy is a good writer and director when doing this.

 

[psylockolussus]

I was viewing the rtpage of this film and I just found that the screenwriter of Bvs and Jl is credited as a screenwriter in SWRoS. Yikes. What a glowing addition to his track record.

 

[jmc]

This sequel trilogy was in many ways always going to be held to ransom by it's predecessors. The fundamental question has to be ask - is Star Wars really anything more than a family drama set within a massive universe? And the answer to that I think we've discovered is a firm no. Star Wars really doesn't work without the Skywalkers. Had the approach been from the start to keep the Skywalker family the focus of this trilogy then I think things could not only have been much better, even if it didn't work 100% smoothly there wouldn't have been the vitriol between fans and the creators because at least there would have been a genuine attempt to honour the original.

This trilogy on the other hand has had no idea what exactly it's trying to do, it's somehow both tried to move forward and stay in the past simultaneously. Unsure of what it is or who its characters are. For crying out loud, the supposed trinity of characters, Rey, Poe and Finn, had not shared the screen together until film 3. The supposed glue of this series of films, haven't had a conversation together until Part 3 of the story. How did it get to this? How did no-one in the lead up to these films being made saw the bleeding obvious fact that our 3 main characters designed to drive the series forward for the next generation don't appear together on screen for the first two films? How does that happen?

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

This sequel trilogy was in many ways always going to be held to ransom by it's predecessors. The fundamental question has to be ask - is Star Wars really anything more than a family drama set within a massive universe? And the answer to that I think we've discovered is a firm no. Star Wars really doesn't work without the Skywalkers. Had the approach been from the start to keep the Skywalker family the focus of this trilogy then I think things could not only have been much better, even if it didn't work 100% smoothly there wouldn't have been the vitriol between fans and the creators because at least there would have been a genuine attempt to honour the original.

This trilogy on the other hand has had no idea what exactly it's trying to do, it's somehow both tried to move forward and stay in the past simultaneously. Unsure of what it is or who its characters are. For crying out loud, the supposed trinity of characters, Rey, Poe and Finn, had not shared the screen together until film 3. The supposed glue of this series of films, haven't had a conversation together until Part 3 of the story. How did it get to this? How did no-one in the lead up to these films being made saw the bleeding obvious fact that our 3 main characters designed to drive the series forward for the next generation don't appear together on screen for the first two films? How does that happen?

Again, I think TLJ was the problem here. TFA set up so much interesting stuff, and rather than pay it off in TLJ, Johnson just seemed obsessed with subverting everything instead. For me this led to character regressions for pretty much all of the new characters. And then what was done with Luke I won't get into as it felt like an insult to me. Johnson also criminally didn't leave any of the characters in interesting places. Giving the next director not much to work with. I said it in 2017 after seeing TLJ, but walking out of that movie it felt like there needed to be another movie between TLJ and the 3rd movie. Judging by the reviews of TROS, this still seems to be the case as TLJ left the 3rd movie with too much to cover.

 

[jmc]

Again, I think TLJ was the problem here. TFA set up so much interesting stuff, and rather than pay it off in TLJ, Johnson just seemed obsessed with subverting everything instead. For me this led to character regressions for pretty much all of the new characters. And then what was done with Luke I won't get into as it felt like an insult to me. Johnson also criminally didn't leave any of the characters in interesting places. Giving the next director not much to work with. I said it in 2017 after seeing TLJ, but walking out of that movie it felt like there needed to be another movie between TLJ and the 3rd movie. Judging by the reviews of TROS, this still seems to be the case as TLJ left the 3rd movie with too much to cover.

I don't even blame TLJ or Johnson to be honest. I just can't understand how something as simple as having our 3 supposed lead characters, the alleged trinity of the sequels, having an actual conversation together in the same room was somehow over looked for 2 movies. What the hell does it say about the people working at Lucasfilm if not a single person ever realised this? How the hell is there suppose to be any connection to these characters for the audience, if they themselves aren't even connecting with each other? It's genuinely baffling to me how something as basic as getting these three in the same bloody room to establish a relationship was seemingly overlooked by everybody.