The Better General Ross: Sam Elliott vs. William Hurt

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Then you should read what the movie goers are saying on other unbiased message boards as well, know it all. :whatever:

I don't know it all, or that much for the matter lol. Just saying these kind of polls are a bit silly because it's been a few years since the last Hulk movie and people are wanting the new one to not only be better but do better. I'm sure there were even some votes from people for the new actors that haven't even seen the movie yet.
 
Again, another poll people will vote in support of the newcomer in the role due to wanting the new franchise to do well. Understandable but hardly an accurate measure :o

Or people just think he was genuinely the better ross :huh:.
 
I don't know it all, or that much for the matter lol. Just saying these kind of polls are a bit silly because it's been a few years since the last Hulk movie and people are wanting the new one to not only be better but do better. I'm sure there were even some votes from people for the new actors that haven't even seen the movie yet.

Well I guess then I have to disagree with your statement, you're being hasty. There are quite a few fans and regulars who have chosen the 03 cast in some of these polls. So I can't agree that your assessment is correct.

And it's not like there's any landslide pools here. They're all pretty close.
 
That other movie shouldn't be spoken of ever again, nothing in it was done right, it was NOT the Hulk at all in any way!

Sam Elliot was no Ross.

Hurt is Thunderbolt!
 
That other movie shouldn't be spoken of ever again, nothing in it was done right, it was NOT the Hulk at all in any way!

Sam Elliot was no Ross.

Hurt is Thunderbolt!


^ You just mentioned it again. :oldrazz:
 
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That's not the case at all, it's worked fine in the comics for decades and also in ang lee's hulk, why is it suddenly a lack of motivation now. Is not stopping and killing a murdering monster enough motivation?


Justice doesn't work that way, you don't stop hunting a mass murdering rapist just because he's had no victims in a few months.

You don't stop hunting a rampaging beast capable of killing more innocents and nearly killed you and your daughter just because you haven't seen him for a while. It's supposed to be a personal vendetta against the hulk, hurt's ross only wanted him for business, he didn't care he nearly killed him or betty or the amount of damage or lives he's ruined, he just wants the serum, there's no connection between the entities, the hulk to hurt is just finishing a job and getting a paycheck.

Elliot's ross is personal, even after a nuclear bomb goes off, he still wants to make sure the hulk is dead personally, he has no reason to continue, the hulk case is officially closed, yet he is uneasy years after the events and still wants to make sure the hulk is down and so stalks and taps his own daughter's communications. That is a ross.

also which one started caring about the hulk and ultimately stopped chasing him.

Ross to the hulk is like jonah to spiderman, they are always constant antagonists that will never cease even though physically they may not amount to much, their neutrality and consistence are underlying factors to which they may never be underestimated.

look at jonah when he screated scorpion, he was still mouthing off ot spidey after the experiment went wrong and still persues him to this day, there's no moral backlash because men like himself and ross are stubborn leaders with personal vendettas and the resources to continue their fixations till the end.

WOW......first off comparing the HULK to a mass murderer or rapist, people who constantly kill be it they are crazy or sane, and do it with the knowledge and intentions of pleasure, is an insane comparison.

If you knew there was a monster that you saw was indestructible WOULD YOU GO AFTER IT. H*ll the F**K NA!!!

Hurt was so much more than just obsessed with the power of the Hulk. He wanted to rid the world of Him or enslave him *Undertones* "As far as I am concern that whole man's body is property of the U.S. Army."

We need an antagonist in the film. Someone to make Banner Angry or at least push his buttons, repeatedly.

Also, if you think about it...Since Hurt's Ross new you couldn't kill the Hulk at least not with anything he has got in his arsenal, he may as well try to capture it.

And just because we do not see Hurt's Ross tap, Betty's phone like we did in the 03 version, doesn't mean he probably didn't do it. Heck why else would Norton have to go back into hiding. Things were not peachy king with him and Hurt at the end of the movie. The act of Hurt/Ross letting Hulk go and not chasing him at that moment was his way of saying thanks. H*ll he was probably thinking, "I'm tired, your tired, My daughter and I almost died. You saved us. I hate that you did, but at least I'm alive and Betty is alive. I can see that part of Bruce is in there. You cleaned up my mess. I'll get you some other day....you can bet on it"

This was conveyed in his face and is implicit but implied if you know about conveying emotion without speaking.

I mean come on....Hurt/Ross has been chasing him for 5 Years....you would be obsessed if your life's work and reputation slips through your hands.

Hurt was better.....better motivation, better character analysis, better over all reason for not liking the HULK. Disgruntled dad is a bad approach compared to Power Hungry jerk on film.

AND the reason it has worked so long in the comics or well [whatever you said] is that IT IS THE COMICS.....certain things translate better to comics than they do film, and vice a versa. Plus you have explore other motives if you want Comics do be around for 30 years....
...Geesh...if we had 8 Hulk movies then. I would say that Elliott's Ross would be a good angle, but I do not want to see it in the 1st film.

Comic movies and especially Hulk should be an ACTION ADVENTURE with certain exploratory elements [sci-fi, romance, drama], not a comic pseudo-psychoanalysis, drama, or whatever.

WE ALL KNOW about the Hulk....I don't need to see a movie where an 1 Hour goes by telling me who the Hulk is and where he comes from and bull crap antagonism between ROSS and Banner, when it can be simplified and get to the point, their stances should be this ROSS-"I can stop you and control you" Banner-"Please don't try.....but if you want to, I warned you"

Get to the Gold baby the good stuff. Hurt was the good stuff. He wasn't polished and neat and pretty like Elliot. Elliot is to me what X-Men the Movie would have been if they wore "Yellow Spandex". It is too cheesy and basic. [Enter Batman and Robin-very comicy and cheesy and basic, as compared to Begins, Returns, the First Movie, and soon to be TDK movie].

Hurt, Hurt, Hurt!
 
Easily Sam Elliott.

Hurt was OK.

Norton was the better Banner though.

As for the Betty Ross character, I enjoyed both actresses' work there but I think the script for '03 gave her more to do.
 
Anyone who thinks Hurt's Ross was just a one dimensional bad guy clearly weren't watching the final act of the movie properly.

Or they totally didn't watch the opening sequence with a beat and broke up Ross, attempting to protect an unconscious Betty, from a new born Hulk.

Sheesh, sometimes you have to spell it out.
 
I can't believe I read this from you.!?! :wow: Figured you for an Elliot guy.

I really, really loved Elliot as Ross in Ang's Hulk, but Ross in this movie was more of a role suited for an actor like Hurt. Hurt can play a sympathetic psychotic scumbag, but Elliot can play a mailman as a hardcore ball busting bada$$.
 
I really, really loved Elliot as Ross in Ang's Hulk, but Ross in this movie was more of a role suited for an actor like Hurt. Hurt can play a sympathetic psychotic scumbag, but Elliot can play a mailman as a hardcore ball busting bada$$.

Pretty much sums it up right there.

:up:
 
Voted for William Hurt. Both are great. I agree with a previous post that:

Sam - Stern/Strick persona
William - Bad/***** persona

The guy you would hate more would be Hurt's. And from the comics that i've seen. Both Looks and the personality that i see how Ross's character would be in real life would be Hurt's.

That is my take.
 
Just watched Hulk again today.

Elliot's Ross is more calm and composed. Basically a level-headed military man. When you actually look at it, he's just an alright kinduva guy who has a real mistrust of both Banners and a strained relationship with his daughter.

Hurt's Ross showed more of the characteristics that I've come to associate with 'Thunderbolt' in the comics over the years. He's basically an A-hole that will use any means necessary (however morally ethical they may be) to achieve his own agenda.
 
I disagree with Ross being made "evil" in the new movie. He has historically been Hulk's nemesis, but that doesn't mean he should be a villain.
 
Given that the Hulks always gonna be portrayed as a tragic figure; the audience is always gonna side with him.

It's only natural that the 'nemisis' of the 'hero' is thought of as the villain; even if it isnt neccessarily the case.
 
Given that the Hulks always gonna be portrayed as a tragic figure; the audience is always gonna side with him.

It's only natural that the 'nemisis' of the 'hero' is thought of as the villain; even if it isnt neccessarily the case.

Too, True

I don't think that Hurt's Ross was "evil" but he was an antagonist, to the Hulk/Norton's protagonist.

To put it simply....in 03 HULK we got General Ross, In 08 TIH we got Thunderbolt Ross........at least that is how I look at it.
 
I'd say that's pretty accurate, M.B.

Different actors interpretting the roles in different ways working off different scripts with different depictions of the characters.
 
Having seen it a second time this is really a hard decision. Hurt played Ross excellently. And Elliott did that too.
 
Pretty even in my opinion.

While I thought that Sam Elliott had the look and tone down better, Hurt was the more sophisticated actor.
 
Hurt can play a sympathetic psychotic scumbag, but Elliot can play a mailman as a hardcore ball busting bada$$.

I've always thought of Ross as kinda both.

from the comics that i've seen. Both Looks and the personality that i see how Ross's character would be in real life would be Hurt's.

I personally think that Elliott looks more like Ross. He just naturally looks like Ross IMO, whereas they had to go to so much effort to make Hurt look like Ross that, IMO, he ended up looking as if he was wearing a plastic mask, the kind that they were always ripping off in Mission: Impossible.
 
sam elliot by far. there's a certain warmth to his acting that Hurt lacked with the Ross character. I know that it depends on the writing, but I felt Elliot did a better job.
 
WOW......first off comparing the HULK to a mass murderer or rapist, people who constantly kill be it they are crazy or sane, and do it with the knowledge and intentions of pleasure, is an insane comparison.

If you knew there was a monster that you saw was indestructible WOULD YOU GO AFTER IT. H*ll the F**K NA!!!
people who commit crimes are always not aware of the damage they are causing, simply by either being mentally unstable or somewhat ******ed and unaware of what affect their actions are really causing. so Yeah, the hulk in this film has killed and therefore lacks the mental capacity to understand the effects of his actions while in the moment. That's why he'd killed before the film and kicked a somewhat defenseless blonksy to near death and also tried to strangle him to death at the end and was persuaded not to.

If a monster had tried to kill me and my daughter, and I was somewhat responsible for its creation then yes, i have a responsibility to bring it to justice.

as for being indestructible, there is no indication of this in the film especially when ross started his crusade against him. Even at the end of the film, he gets hurt getting penetrated by bone so no, he's not indestructible.

Hurt was so much more than just obsessed with the power of the Hulk. He wanted to rid the world of Him or enslave him *Undertones* "As far as I am concern that whole man's body is property of the U.S. Army."

Hurt showed no hate or malice or ridding of the hulk, the trailers consistently showed he believed banner is a property of the goverment and saw him primarily as something to be brought in and researched and so did banner.

Banner showed no indication that the government wanted to 'destroy' him, rather try to harness the powers of the hulk which may end up killing him but his primary concerns were their inability to control it.


We need an antagonist in the film. Someone to make Banner Angry or at least push his buttons, repeatedly.
Well if someone was trying to continually kill you and keep you away from his daughter, i would call that motivation enough. Besides he had blonksy. I don't know why you bring up this motivation because in neither film did ross directly cause the hulk to manifest.
Also, if you think about it...Since Hurt's Ross new you couldn't kill the Hulk at least not with anything he has got in his arsenal, he may as well try to capture it.
This sentence is based on no fact at all. There's no where in the film did they say they couldn't kill it and that capturing it was a last form of action. Capturing him was always the priority.
And just because we do not see Hurt's Ross tap, Betty's phone like we did in the 03 version, doesn't mean he probably didn't do it. Heck why else would Norton have to go back into hiding. Things were not peachy king with him and Hurt at the end of the movie. The act of Hurt/Ross letting Hulk go and not chasing him at that moment was his way of saying thanks. H*ll he was probably thinking, "I'm tired, your tired, My daughter and I almost died. You saved us. I hate that you did, but at least I'm alive and Betty is alive. I can see that part of Bruce is in there. You cleaned up my mess. I'll get you some other day....you can bet on it"

Ok, i'm getting very tired of these weak arguments people keep throwing. Just because you don't see it doesnt mean it doesn't happen. Sorry, that's not how I was taught basic comprehension. Apart from natural human things like giong to the bathroom and washing, it i don't see it, it doesn't happen and you can't say it any other way.

I can also prove hurt didn't tap betty because he had completely no indication that banner was with betty until samson betrayed them. No idea what so ever and why would he? She had started dating someone else.

*sigh*

Banner's actions at the end of the film are somewhat inconsistent with everything else. The hulk is somewhat excepted but he still can't trust the government of wishes to try out some other avenues. It personally doesn't make sense to me.

as for letting the hulk go, your description is not consistent with the fact he's boozing in a bar after the event. He acts like he's lost his big chance in the bar, not for some kinda mutual respect for the hulk, he's clearly not focussed or relieved which is what someone who released a wild animal (like the hulk) would be into getting him back or letting it go respectively.

This was conveyed in his face and is implicit but implied if you know about conveying emotion without speaking.
the scene is on youtube, show me exactly where you mean because i see acceptance of defeat on his face.
I mean come on....Hurt/Ross has been chasing him for 5 Years....you would be obsessed if your life's work and reputation slips through your hands.

Hurt was better.....better motivation, better character analysis, better over all reason for not liking the HULK. Disgruntled dad is a bad approach compared to Power Hungry jerk on film.
I don't see any manifestation of thunderbolt ross that would let him go without a fight even if he did save his life 2 seconds earlier, that's how deep the obsession is.

How cold hurt have a better character analysis? He has far less screen time than Elliot, has less dialogue, less interaction with his troops, less interaction with the hulk, Less interaction with betty and his character doesn't flip from teh original all the way through the film.

Considering there were two families being portrayed on film and elliot's inability to want history to repeat itself, I do think that brings more depth to the 'taking down' the hulk threat ross originally has, it's a personal vendetta on multiple levels now, against david's son, banner individually and also the hulk. And you can see in every scene which one of those manifestations of the character is playing on his mind.

hurts' hulk was always always the rogue experiment he wanted to test. Doesnt' really care about the fact the hulk nearly killed him or his daughter, doesn't care about the lives or property damage the hulk causes, I don't even think he holds a grudge against the hulk, clearly by letting him go at the end.

Elliot's ross spends one solid year chasing a ghost when the hulk threat is supposedly eliminated. Thunderbolt goes to kick back in a bar....:up:...

AND the reason it has worked so long in the comics or well [whatever you said] is that IT IS THE COMICS.....certain things translate better to comics than they do film, and vice a versa. Plus you have explore other motives if you want Comics do be around for 30 years....
...Geesh...if we had 8 Hulk movies then. I would say that Elliott's Ross would be a good angle, but I do not want to see it in the 1st film.

That's not true, how many monster films have been released where the army simply wants to eliminate the threat, how many alien invasion films or sci fi programs based on characters being hunted?

It's a solid line which is suppose to make us think of how the army is technically doing a good thing but because we side with bruce, we can see his relationship with them and the turmoil it causes. If you simplify it and simply make the army 'evil' then they become boring and stale.

A neutral army can always play a part in a film because that's there job. However when characters like the absorbing man, the leader and everyone else starts comnig into the film wanting the hulks power,the army are going to be in that line up with the very same motivation and they become stale.
Comic movies and especially Hulk should be an ACTION ADVENTURE with certain exploratory elements [sci-fi, romance, drama], not a comic pseudo-psychoanalysis, drama, or whatever.

You're wrong here. Very wrong. The best hulk stories in the past have really dealt more with bruce/hulk and their interactions with one another as well as their shared loved ones and hated foes. They've dealt with the multiple personality aspects and the drives of both the intense characters.

unfortunately the hulk is now mainly a plot device in the comics to have newer 'hardcore characters' test their strength against to establish themselves as worthy opponents.

Hulk's not spiderman, he's not ironman, he's inspired by doctor jekyll and mr hyde, that's a pretty deep psychological read, why bother dumbing it down to action adventure, what's so adventurous from a suicidal man running away from the government as his alter ego kills innocents in rages of anger :confused:
WE ALL KNOW about the Hulk....I don't need to see a movie where an 1 Hour goes by telling me who the Hulk is and where he comes from and bull crap antagonism between ROSS and Banner, when it can be simplified and get to the point, their stances should be this ROSS-"I can stop you and control you" Banner-"Please don't try.....but if you want to, I warned you"

Get to the Gold baby the good stuff. Hurt was the good stuff. He wasn't polished and neat and pretty like Elliot. Elliot is to me what X-Men the Movie would have been if they wore "Yellow Spandex". It is too cheesy and basic. [Enter Batman and Robin-very comicy and cheesy and basic, as compared to Begins, Returns, the First Movie, and soon to be TDK movie].

Hurt, Hurt, Hurt!
Well it probably seems you do need to see a hulk film like that because you feel the character is an action adventurer like indiana jones or something :up:

Those two sentences don't sum up their relationship at all, with all respect I think you've missed the core of the characters.

Wait first of all you are going on about the detail ang lee's hulk spent on character development and now you're describing elliot as basic, it makes no sense (especially since he had more screen time). I could give you a detailed list of all the aspects of his character covered.

what cheesy lines did elliot give, anything more cheesy than 'my god, he's really doing it' ??

Dude, you know you can't make a bandR vs batman begins comparison to these two actors, even I can't do that. If anyone truelly thought that, the poll wouldn't be so even...

let's not bring in any hyperboles shall we.....

:o
 
WOW....this is so deep and touching...lol.
 
Too emotive you think? :(

on a 1-10 scale, i'd only give it a 4.
 

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