BvS The BvS Ultimate Cut Thread - Part 2

[FlawlessVictory]

Lex believed he could control Doomsday, seeing that he was a sort of parental figure to it by using his own blood to help create it. Obviously he was wrong. Villains are wrong from time to time/make miscalculations, if they didn't then they would always win.

 

[Mr. Wayne]

It's a quote (or similar to a quote in the book, I haven't read the book, lol.) from "Lolita" a novel by Vladimir Nabokov.

A movie which Jeremy Irons starred in ironically enough. Wow, a Jeremy Irons Easter Egg. Ok Terrio, not bad.

 

[Unbreakable Lex]

Lex's Doomsday plan didn't work out as Lex initially planned, you can see that Lex was confident that Doomsday would only attack Superman, not him but Doomsday attacked Lex.

Lex was overconfident that he had the Kryptonian knowledge, which basically meant power, ("knowledge is power") but miscalculated Doomsday's power, he thought "Power can be innocent".

Absolutely. That's the line that tripped him up at the Library book charity as well.

 

[ApophènX]

Actually Doomsday was about to crush lex before superman intervened. so his whole plan came off looking laughably dumb to me.But Im glad you enjoyed that part even though to me it was as dumb as Gene Hackman's lex creating nuclear man in superman IV.

I explained in the following lines of what you quote in black why he believed so. If you can't understand the emotional complex behind his action of course it's going to seem dumb. It's somehow interesting to see how the "stupid" argument often comes by when people are angry about the plot not being elaborate and perfect enough when it just seem you did not connect with the emotion. If you don't relate things in the movie it's never going to seem coherent, it's going to seem dumb.

 

[ApophènX]

Absolutely. That's the line that tripped him up at the Library book charity as well.

The innocence is a therm that cale often in this movie. At the beggining Lois is told that "ignorance is not innocence". Interesting that she is the one who follows up to reveal Lex's plot and that she found a red book with a bullet. Lex is presented alot as a love of books and knowledge.

The african lines applied to Lex as well, it was ignorance.

 

[idiot09]

The whole thing with Lex believing he could control Doomsday because it was from his blood,also ties in with the theme that Lex grew up with his father controlling his life and he thought he could do the same with his "son".

Edit : And the whole thing of "no god saved me from daddy's fists and abominations",but it ends up Superman saves him from Doomsday's fists.

 

[idiot09]

I also noticed just before the commitee blew up,Lex had that talk with the senator, and he said "Do you know the oldest lie in america senator?Its that power can be innocent".Which on surface sounds like he is talking about Superman,but he is actually talking about himself because he knows that the senator knows about him now.

 

[Aquafinn90]

I also noticed just before the commitee blew up,Lex had that talk with the senator, and he said "Do you know the oldest lie in america senator?Its that power can be innocent".Which on surface sounds like he is talking about Superman,but he is actually talking about himself because he knows that the senator knows about him now.

exactly. always loved thaat part.

 

[Micromind]

A movie which Jeremy Irons starred in ironically enough. Wow, a Jeremy Irons Easter Egg. Ok Terrio, not bad.

I didn't know that, Terrio's writing is full of surprises.

 

[Micromind]

The whole thing with Lex believing he could control Doomsday because it was from his blood,also ties in with the theme that Lex grew up with his father controlling his life and he thought he could do the same with his "son".

Edit : And the whole thing of "no god saved me from daddy's fists and abominations",but it ends up Superman saves him from Doomsday's fists.

Yeah, "Blood of my blood".

 

[Cobblepot]

In the end you can see Lex kinda subdued, immersed in a fluid with three motherboxes and an image off Steppenwolf. This to me is evidence that Lex was under the (atleast partly) influence of Steppenwolf/Darkseid. Al they want is to get rid of Superman, DD could have done it for them.

Don't forget that Batman also recieves some subliminal imagery from somewhere in this movie.

I'm hoping to see the answer of this in JL, but they might have abanded that idea now with the whole lighter tone...

 

[Micromind]

The innocence is a therm that cale often in this movie. At the beggining Lois is told that "ignorance is not innocence". Interesting that she is the one who follows up to reveal Lex's plot and that she found a red book with a bullet. Lex is presented alot as a love of books and knowledge.

The african lines applied to Lex as well, it was ignorance.

"Ignorance is not same as Innocence" principle is also applied by some people for Superman, when Superman says he was not aware that the wheelchair had a bomb in it.

Which is why some hold him accountable for what happened in the Senate that day .

 

[Micromind]

In the end you can see Lex kinda subdued, immersed in a fluid with three motherboxes and an image off Steppenwolf. This to me is evidence that Lex was under the (atleast partly) influence of Steppenwolf/Darkseid. Al they want is to get rid of Superman, DD could have done it for them.

Don't forget that Batman also recieves some subliminal imagery from somewhere in this movie.

I'm hoping to see the answer of this in JL, but they might have abanded that idea now with the whole lighter tone...

That's possible too, as all DC movies are going to be interlinked in some way.

 

[idiot09]

Lex look scared as **** and was crying when he was found with Steppenwolf.I believe some stuff went down and we will know in JL.As for Lex's behaviour didnt he imply that acted crazy so that he escapes jail?

 

[Sleiek]

No more dumb than Tony Stark creating Ultron.

Nailed it.

It's not even dumb. Even geniuses don't know EVERYTHING.

 

[ApophènX]

Lex look scared as **** and was crying when he was found with Steppenwolf.I believe some stuff went down and we will know in JL.As for Lex's behaviour didnt he imply that acted crazy so that he escapes jail?

I think in his quest for knowledge Lex had a glimpse of a foreign super advenced technology and true horror it could bring. He kinda pactize with the devil. Batman said he assured him he would go to Arkham and Lex felt scared. But i think there is something in Lex's head like a link, he knows it's going to come and partly through him. Bad buisnessman, sold his soul to the devil.

 

[idiot09]

Also Geoff Johns said that this manic Lex is him just starting out,and that he will evolve and mature into something more like the Luthor from comics.So I am interested to see how that plays out.

 

[Micromind]

Also Geoff Johns said that this manic Lex is him just starting out,and that he will evolve and mature into something more like the Luthor from comics.So I am interested to see how that plays out.

Best Lex Luthor moment in the movie was when Lex tells Wallace "I want you to stand for something" and donates him the battery operated wheelchair, looks like he is doing something noble but has his own nefarious hidden agenda behind it.

Edit: And, as you have pointed out, Lex Luthor will evolve in the next (JL) movie.

 

[SuperAl]

Watched the Ult cut last night and thought it was great.

One thing i noticed when i was watching it was when Lex was creating Doomsday, the AI seemed to imply that this abomination was created before which is why the council banned this type of experiment. I wonder if there is another doomsday out there.

 

[SuperAl]

Also Geoff Johns said that this manic Lex is him just starting out,and that he will evolve and mature into something more like the Luthor from comics.So I am interested to see how that plays out.

Thats awesome to hear, do you know where he said that though? I havent seen many quotes on Lex's erratic behavior.

I am assuming he'll get out of jail in Suicide squad, im sure he'll get recruited by amanda waller to help her with the metahuman issue.

 

[The Joker]

Watched the UC and IMO it's still a garbage film, except now it's a garbage film that doesn't look like it was edited by an 8 yr old!

The dessert sequence makes no sense what so ever! Why the heck would superman need bullets to kill anyone? And why the hell wasn't lois called to testify in the hearing since SHE WAS ACTUALLY THERE!

The explosion at the senate made no sense, why the heck would superman need a bomb for the love of christ! And what would he gain from blowing the building up? Or conspiring with a guy who clearly hates his gut?

IF lex is afraid of superman's power then why the hell would he go out and create a being who is "like 5 supermen with a fist for a brain" as the nostalgia critic put it?

I could go on and on about things that don't make sense in the movie but like i said before no 3 or 4 hrs of extra footage is going to erase the film's s**ty writing.

 

[kguillou]

I'm surprised there wasn't more to the scene where Superman is talking to his mom at the farm. That scene always felt very abrupt to me and its still pretty short and abrupt in the UC version. I've got to think there is more footage to that scene.

 

[idiot09]

Thats awesome to hear, do you know where he said that though? I havent seen many quotes on Lex's erratic behavior.

I am assuming he'll get out of jail in Suicide squad, im sure he'll get recruited by amanda waller to help her with the metahuman issue.

He said it in one of the extras in the blue-ray,saw this quote being mentioned in a dc subreddit from a mod,so its legit.

 

[idiot09]

Watched the Ult cut last night and thought it was great.

One thing i noticed when i was watching it was when Lex was creating Doomsday, the AI seemed to imply that this abomination was created before which is why the council banned this type of experiment. I wonder if there is another doomsday out there.

Well I do think there has been a doomsday before.Jay Oliva,who worked on the film,suggested in a podcast about ,"Have you ever wondered why Kryptons dont allow natural birth?"and when Jor-El did it,thats why it was a big deal,"HERESY" etc.He says that may tie in with the doomsday stuff.

 

[idiot09]

Here is the full quote from Geoff Johns, taken from his appearance in "The Empire of Luthor," the Lex Luthor featurette that came with the Ultimate Edition.
"Lex in the film is very maniacal. He’s just kind of starting out. He’s on his way to becoming the iconic Lex Luthor from the comic books. But it’s a very different version."