The "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) thread - Part 5

[RAE072]

I'm afraid there may be no great options left. FF may be doomed no matter how things shake out. Fox could very well make a couple mediocre films, let FF go and they could end up dormant for the next thirty years - turned into D-listers by Fox while Marvel turns former D-listers to A-listers.

What a ****ing bummer.

 

[Donut]

My hope is that Kinberg and the others involved in this are just terrible at communicating and Trank really does have a vision to bring something special to the screen. When I was watching ASM 2, I did find myself wanting something more 'realistic'.

My concern at this point is Marvel may quickly be moving beyond FF. GOTG looks like it might have franchise potential. Add in Ant-Man, Dr. Strange, Inhumans, Black Panther, Namor etc. to all the characters Marvel has already eatablished and why the heck do they need FF?

I'm afraid there may be no great options left. FF may be doomed no matter how things shake out. Fox could very well make a couple mediocre films, let FF go and they could end up dormant for the next thirty years - turned into D-listers by Fox while Marvel turns former D-listers to A-listers.

I could imagine MARVEL using Silver Surfer & Galactus no matter what. But the actual teams themselves. Yeah they will probably be dead

 

[Docker2.0]

My hope is that Kinberg and the others involved in this are just terrible at communicating and Trank really does have a vision to bring something special to the screen. When I was watching ASM 2, I did find myself wanting something more 'realistic'.

My concern at this point is Marvel may quickly be moving beyond FF. GOTG looks like it might have franchise potential. Add in Ant-Man, Dr. Strange, Inhumans, Black Panther, Namor etc. to all the characters Marvel has already eatablished and why the heck do they need FF?

I'm afraid there may be no great options left. FF may be doomed no matter how things shake out. Fox could very well make a couple mediocre films, let FF go and they could end up dormant for the next thirty years - turned into D-listers by Fox while Marvel turns former D-listers to A-listers.

No way that happens. If there is any franchise that Marvel has that screams Disney, it's Fantastic Four. I think/know this film was made hoping that Marvel will buy it back. I also think that's why Guardians of the Galaxy was made. To not only prove a point by making D-listers into household names but to show Fox "we want the F4 but we don't need them" because we have hundreds of characters to chose from. Fox has the entire Xmen Universe but they have only gotten to the first 30 characters. They haven't even touched their cosmic side or one of their top characters in Deadpool, nor have they shown any interest. Trying to merge Xmen with F4 is so stupid and there is no way it can work because they are way to different. They should just Xpand(pun intended)the X-verse and go from there.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

No way that happens. If there is any franchise that Marvel has that screams Disney, it's Fantastic Four. I think/know this film was made hoping that Marvel will buy it back. I also think that's why Guardians of the Galaxy was made. To not only prove a point by making D-listers into household names but to show Fox "we want the F4 but we don't need them" because we have hundreds of characters to chose from. Fox has the entire Xmen Universe but they have only gotten to the first 30 characters. They haven't even touched their cosmic side or one of their top characters in Deadpool, nor have they shown any interest. Trying to merge Xmen with F4 is so stupid and there is no way it can work because they are way to different. They should just Xpand(pun intended)the X-verse and go from there.

Yeah, I'm baffled why Fox doesn't focus on fleshing out the X-Men. As much as I like the FF, when it comes to a film, it's more about the writer and director than the characters. A good writer and director could make a Ms. Marvel film that would blow away a Fantastic Four film made by a weak director with a weak script.

And once that good film is out there, there are suddenly millions of filmgoers who are now Ms. Marvel fans and the strength or weakness of the her comic book history becomes somewhat irrelevant.

So in terms of Marvel's interest, sure if Marvel had FF right now, I'm sure they'd love to have them and they'd be a key part of their next 30 years.

But I'm just afraid that once Marvel has built a universe with 20-30 characters, they'll have the characters they need to make films for the next 100 years. And not only will they need the FF less, but the FF could be in the way of characters that will be more popular all over the world than the FF ever was.

 

[Docker2.0]

If Marvel got their hands on the F4 tomorrow, I think they'd make the movie just for one character alone: Doom. It's quite possible that he's bigger than the F4 themselves. To be honest, I'm a comic guy and have read comics since I was a child in the 80's so I'm a F4 guy. But Doom is just THAT dude! I so want to see him on screen made the right way and to be honest, Fox just doesn't get it. For him to stand in Latveria with his Doom bots wielding technology and magic taking on the heroes in the Marvel universe, it would be amazing to see on screen. The Doom from the F4 movies has been a joke and to turn him into a business man just shows that Fox doesn't know what to do with the character. Sorry for the rant but this just grinds my gears!

 

[Kelly]

If Marvel got their hands on the F4 tomorrow, I think they'd make the movie just for one character alone: Doom. It's quite possible that he's bigger than the F4 themselves. To be honest, I'm a comic guy and have read comics since I was a child in the 80's so I'm a F4 guy. But Doom is just THAT dude! I so want to see him on screen made the right way and to be honest, Fox just doesn't get it. For him to stand in Latveria with his Doom bots wielding technology and magic taking on the heroes in the Marvel universe, it would be amazing to see on screen. The Doom from the F4 movies has been a joke and to turn him into a business man just shows that Fox doesn't know what to do with the character. Sorry for the rant but this just grinds my gears!

I agree with you to CB fans Doom is ALL OF THAT AND MORE...but to the GA, he is what they saw in the last two movies.

 

[Docker2.0]

Don't remind me.

 

[The.Brotherhood]

Hate to break it but I'm sure that majority of FF fans knows that Marvel wants the rights back because of Doom, Silver Surfer and Galactus. I mean, in the MCU, those 3 characters are going to be more important and great big properties than the first family (if you look at the big picture).

 

[Danalys]

i think for galactus' part in the various cross overs they could probably just use a celestial.
most events aren't character defining they are pure spectacle and if you can find an analogue that's as powerful then it would work. silver surfer in most cross over events could be replaced as well. but it's hard to think of some one who could fill in for doom but perhaps kang could. they'd have to keep quiet about his origins tho.

 

[Mr.M]

Hard to imagine we will see any celestial threats in this origin flick. And fanboys are already of the belief that this film won't get a sequel, rightfully so. Hence SS and Galactus should remain viable as MCU parts apart from the damage the Story films already did. If this bombs I highly doubt Fox will produce more FF films or spinoffs for that matter, but they may keep SS in "development" to hold onto the rights for another seven years. After that, SS could be a fresh character in the MCU.

 

[Danalys]

the FF film definitely wont have celestials since marvel has the rights to them and GotG has a brief semi introduction to them.

 

[The.Brotherhood]

If this film proves all the haters wrong and turns out to be a decent-cool flick then...

BUT

If this turns out to be the real s***...


HELLO MARVEL STUDIOS!

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

In terms of having a very powerful being - sure, you could use a Celestial or just invent a new character.

But in terms of a having a being that is the top of the food-chain . . . that just sees the rest of the universe as food, and in terms of really re-creating the MCU on film, they need Galactus.

The Silver Surfer is cool, but not nearly as necessary as Galactus. I just don't think it will ever quite truly feel like the Marvel Universe without Galactus.

 

[Ragnaroknroll]

In terms of having a very powerful being - sure, you could use a Celestial or just invent a new character.

But in terms of a having a being that is the top of the food-chain . . . that just sees the rest of the universe as food, and in terms of really re-creating the MCU on film, they need Galactus.

The Silver Surfer is cool, but not nearly as necessary as Galactus. I just don't think it will ever quite truly feel like the Marvel Universe without Galactus.

Agreed. Galactus to me is one of Kirby's greatest creations. (If not the greatest) And I'm of the personal belief that Marvel is the only one with the kahunas to put the big purple man in the suit on the big screen. The leaked picture of the Thing just proves to me that Fox hasn't changed, they still don't trust the comics and they just have to tweak things just enough to be "different".

 

[justanotherguy]

Agreed. Galactus to me is one of Kirby's greatest creations. (If not the greatest) And I'm of the personal belief that Marvel is the only one with the kahunas to put the big purple man in the suit on the big screen. The leaked picture of the Thing just proves to me that Fox hasn't changed, they still don't trust the comics and they just have to tweak things just enough to be "different".

This probably should be in the positive thread, but I think the Thing looks pretty good if that leak is true. Yeah he's not orange, but obviously Trank and co. don't care about color......

 

[justanotherguy]

I swear my microphone must be broken....because my joke was hilarious.

 

[Ragnaroknroll]

I swear my microphone must be broken....because my joke was hilarious.

Haha. I see what you did there.

 

[Ragnaroknroll]

The thing that jumps out at me most is the chin. I'd definitely like to see that rounded off. I'm not convinced he's not more orange than this photo shows, so I'm not going to get worked up over that. The brow could be a little better, but at least he has one, so that's a huge improvement over the previous films.

It's a different take, and it certainly doesn't perfectly match Kirby's version or other comic versions. But it has enough of the key characteristics that I'm going to try to not let the relatively minor imperfections bother me that much.

We still don't know how well they'll do the CGI, and if they screw that up, the design won't matter. But I'm comfortable enough with the design that I think good CGI could make this version of the Thing something pretty cool to see on screen. He definitely looks like he can project the strength and power of the Thing much more effectively than the earlier films.

I also have to hope he has the traditional three fingers and huge hands. If not, that could throw the whole thing off

Yeah the chin is all wrong and I strongly dislike the brow. I think it's a lazy design. Wobbly's version actually conveys a sadness that is more true to character. The original just looks like some pissed off rock golem. I don't want to sound like a broken record but suffice to say I'm not impressed at all.

 

[Tony Stark]

My hope is that Kinberg and the others involved in this are just terrible at communicating and Trank really does have a vision to bring something special to the screen. When I was watching ASM 2, I did find myself wanting something more 'realistic'.

My concern at this point is Marvel may quickly be moving beyond FF. GOTG looks like it might have franchise potential. Add in Ant-Man, Dr. Strange, Inhumans, Black Panther, Namor etc. to all the characters Marvel has already eatablished and why the heck do they need FF?

I'm afraid there may be no great options left. FF may be doomed no matter how things shake out. Fox could very well make a couple mediocre films, let FF go and they could end up dormant for the next thirty years - turned into D-listers by Fox while Marvel turns former D-listers to A-listers.

They can't let it go dormant. The contracts are clear that if no future films are planned the rights go back to Marvel.

I think the FF2 announcement is only to try and extort some money out of MS should this film fail (which there's about an %80 chance right now).

FF will always have potential, but if this movie turns out a stinker, that potential I believe will be in the form of a Netflix series, the audience won't go for another reboot.

 

[RAE072]

I can't believe you guys are gushing over generic looking rock man. Guess I'm alone on this one. Sigh.

Nah you're not alone. I think it looks just alright.

But then I was expecting something awful, so my expectations were REALLY low.

I agree though that that manip is perfect and there was no reason at all why he couldn't look like that.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

They can't let it go dormant. The contracts are clear that if no future films are planned the rights go back to Marvel.

I think the FF2 announcement is only to try and extort some money out of MS should this film fail (which there's about an %80 chance right now).

FF will always have potential, but if this movie turns out a stinker, that potential I believe will be in the form of a Netflix series, the audience won't go for another reboot.

I'm not afraid of Fox letting it go dormant, I'm concerned about Marvel.

Once they've got 10 properties that are all more valuable than FF, why would they bother reviving that dead franchise?

 

[wobbly]

Nah you're not alone. I think it looks just alright.

But then I was expecting something awful, so my expectations were REALLY low.

I agree though that that manip is perfect and there was no reason at all why he couldn't look like that.

Same here. When I first saw it I thought, "Well that isn't too bad at all!!" and quite liked it. But that was with the Chiklis suit in mind though, so they didn't exactly have a high bar to beat...

Whiskey Tango I think was the 1st to point out that without being told that was the FF Thing, would you know it was definitely meant to be him?

With that in mind I didn't like it so much as I wouldn't. Colour it orange, then yes, but 'as is'? It could be from something else entirely. Considering Ben has some unique trademark features, it is somewhat bemusing (if this is for real) that they are not really using them and have in fact toned them down, in effect making the face a lot more human like than it either should or needs to be.

 

[Joe Rockhead]

I'm not afraid of Fox letting it go dormant, I'm concerned about Marvel.

Once they've got 10 properties that are all more valuable than FF, why would they bother reviving that dead franchise?

At that point, I think if Marvel were to get their hands on FF, they would end up the subtitle for an existing successful MCU property.

Say some villain like the Leader orchestrates a conflict between the Hulk and the FF. He's created Gamma powered operatives who could easily be used to frame the Hulk for some attack, the FF get called in to go after him, and during the battle they discover the Leader's manipulations and team up to go after him.

 

[wobbly]

Now THAT looks like the Thing! Wobbly says he came up with that in less than 10 minutes. There's no excuse for Fox.

In fairness, I didn't have to change much, and a manip from a photo is obviously a lot faster to knock out than a sculpture.

That being said the main things I changed (colour, brow, nose & chin line) could easily have been done with the real bust itself. The eyes are the same (just lightened around them a little to lessen the 'racoon' effect), and the mouth is the same.

I did also move the head back a little as it looked like it was jutting a wee bit too far out but that was it in the end.

 

[Ragnaroknroll]

Nah you're not alone. I think it looks just alright.

But then I was expecting something awful, so my expectations were REALLY low.

I agree though that that manip is perfect and there was no reason at all why he couldn't look like that.

Ok good. Glad to know I'm not going crazy.

In fairness, I didn't have to change much, and a manip from a photo is obviously a lot faster to knock out than a sculpture.

That being said the main things I changed (colour, brow, nose & chin line) could easily have been done with the real bust itself. The eyes are the same (just lightened around them a little to lessen the 'racoon' effect), and the mouth is the same.

I did also move the head back a little as it looked like it was jutting a wee bit too far out but that was it in the end.

Exactly. You didn't need to change much but you changed what mattered. You get it. How many years has Fox had this property in their possession? And they still don't get it.