The "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) thread

[fangz]

A reboot means other X-Men films didn't happen.That clearly wasn't the case.Especilly now with DOFP.First Class had more connection to X-Men/X2 than say Star Trek 2009 had to entire past trek franchise.

Disney would rather A new Hope never be seen again than let Fox get some money from Star Wars.As for other films don't expect any more releases of them till 2020 when Fox's distribution rights to empire,jedi,and prequels ends.

Your assuming DIsney would Immedetly jump on FF.GotG being exception DIsney only seems Intrested In Avengers related films.GotG may exsist simply to build up Thanos for Avengers sequel.

Disney doesn't make deals If they don't have to.They would rather just buy out companys.

Why would Fox take a small perchange of one film when they could do the franchise themselves.At least Fox has guts to put Zazis In First Class while Disney downplays nazis
In Captain America and makes Hydra villains.And Hydra was a post WWII organization In comics.

What happened with Star wars makes It less likely Fox would be willing to make a deal.COnsidering what they did to Mandarian In Iron Man 3 who knows what Disney would do to Doom.

Hydra was formed during WWII. not that it should matter anyway.

I've never understood, how people think the Nazis are controversial villains.
Nazis are probably the furthest thing in the world from a controversial villain that takes guts for someone to put in a movie.
who are you at risk of offending from having Nazis be villains in a movie?

Red Skull was a Nazi, this is pretty clear, isn't it? He splinters from the Nazi party to form his own non-nationalist organization Hydra. He kills those Nazis that come to check up on him. so there were Nazis in the movie, anyways. And Skull in the comics also had problems answering to Hitler.

I think what happened is that Marvel definitely wanted to introduce Hydra and show a direct connection to Red Skull. and they must have made some decision that there wasn't enough time in the film to split between these two bad groups of bad guys. Cap really only goes on 2 missions.

unfortunately, Captain America was doomed from the start as having to lead in to Avengers. this wasn't Disney's directive, it was part of Marvel's plan for the Avengers. Captain America would've taken 3 WWII films at least to do the story right and make Bucky's relationship to Cap mean anything to us.

but it's weird how much control you imagine Disney has over the smaller points of these Marvel movies. it's obviously overstated on your part and meant to be ridiculous, and i don't see what kind of point you think it's making.


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[Dark Raven]

If Marvel and Disney ever did get the FF rights back, I wouldn't mind them one day making a Dr Doom movie in the style of their Disney movie Malificent, starring Angelina Jolie, in which the Sleeping Beauty tale is told from the point of view of the Wicked Fairy. There, it shows of her early life and her fall from the side of good to the side of evil, and the events leading up to her cursing Princess Aurora.

Would be great if Doom's life in Latveria and his childhood are explored, and his quest to rescue his mother, leading him to explore the mystic arts and become the eventual dictator of that little Eastern European country. I think we should get a few Marvel movies centering on the villains, and if they had Doom, he would be a very compelling character.

Of course, it's not going to be a Doom franchise but a one-off, just like the Malificent movie is likely to be as well. But since Disney already have made other movies told from the perspective of the heroes or heroines and have decided to explore their main villainess, then I don't see why they couldn't do that if they had Doom.

 

[Iceman]

FF needs to go back to Marvel. Would love to see Reed interacting with Stark, Banner, Fury (& not relevant but even Xavier & Cyclops).

 

[KDM1986]

Fantastic four definitely need to revert back to marvel. No faith in fox after seeing what they did to galactus and surfer. No faith in a good adaption from them.

 

[fangz]

@Dark Raven - i like that a lot. Doom's really a great character and even in the comics, they hardly ever make much use of the potential they have with him.

you know, in fan casts of FF, people always spend a lot of time arguing over who whould play him, when really in an FF movie, i think, we should never even see his face. if there were to be some tiny scene of him and Reed in college, i'd rather they kept his face obscured or turned away from us. and just one little scene is the most any kind of history between the two of them should go. i think it'd be easy to sum up their relationship in a couple sentences from Reed.
but it goes to the love people have for Dr Doom that we always pick an appropriate actor for him, like one that looks like him and everything.
i don't think it'd have to be a total 'comic book movie' either. it's interesting to think about what kind of tone the movie would have. easy to use Batman Begins as a model for the imagination. odds are for that, if it ever were to actually go down in real life.
but i could also imagine something a little more overtly fairy tale-ish about it, maybe cuz u mentioned Maleficent, but something similar to Pan's Labrynth or maybe Heavenly Creatures.

i love the black magic side of Doom and his obsession with his mother. there was one issue of FF where Doom was shown to be working for Hitler for a while, sometime after his accident. he's only there for his own ends and they show him spoil one of Hitler's plots to summon the Norse god Thor to use as an unwitting superweapon. he then goes on to give Hitler a speech about his evil and how his mother was a gypsy. weird little story, pretty ridiculous, but i always love when Doom brings up his mother.
here's the article that i read about it in....
http://goodcomics.comicbookresource...ed-an-forsaked-doctor-doom-worked-for-hitler/

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

There's no reason Fox couldn't do a Doom film, and I would expect that possibility has at least been discussed. It may never happen, but I can't imagine that they haven't at least considered that option.

 

[Dark Raven]

@Dark Raven - i like that a lot. Doom's really a great character and even in the comics, they hardly ever make much use of the potential they have with him.

you know, in fan casts of FF, people always spend a lot of time arguing over who whould play him, when really in an FF movie, i think, we should never even see his face. if there were to be some tiny scene of him and Reed in college, i'd rather they kept his face obscured or turned away from us. and just one little scene is the most any kind of history between the two of them should go. i think it'd be easy to sum up their relationship in a couple sentences from Reed.
but it goes to the love people have for Dr Doom that we always pick an appropriate actor for him, like one that looks like him and everything.
i don't think it'd have to be a total 'comic book movie' either. it's interesting to think about what kind of tone the movie would have. easy to use Batman Begins as a model for the imagination. odds are for that, if it ever were to actually go down in real life.
but i could also imagine something a little more overtly fairy tale-ish about it, maybe cuz u mentioned Maleficent, but something similar to Pan's Labrynth or maybe Heavenly Creatures.

i love the black magic side of Doom and his obsession with his mother. there was one issue of FF where Doom was shown to be working for Hitler for a while, sometime after his accident. he's only there for his own ends and they show him spoil one of Hitler's plots to summon the Norse god Thor to use as an unwitting superweapon. he then goes on to give Hitler a speech about his evil and how his mother was a gypsy. weird little story, pretty ridiculous, but i always love when Doom brings up his mother.
here's the article that i read about it in....
http://goodcomics.comicbookresource...ed-an-forsaked-doctor-doom-worked-for-hitler/

Thanks. I think Doom has great potential for a solo movie.

There's no reason Fox couldn't do a Doom film, and I would expect that possibility has at least been discussed. It may never happen, but I can't imagine that they haven't at least considered that option.

The problem with Fox is that they would probably be considering whether Doom as a character could support his own film franchise before even deciding to make the film. If they see it could only be a one-off, they might ditch it like they did with the planned Magneto film. With Wolverine, he can support his own film series.

On the other hand with Marvel, maybe nothing for them is truly "one off", because everything is connected and so even if they do a film with no direct sequel to it, it still fits into the bigger picture of the universe they've created. The entire MCU is the franchise, not the individual films. So they can afford to just have the odd movie about a villain as a change of pace.

It's like the Maleficent film. I doubt that's a planned franchise. It's just a one-off film exploring that character, because Disney already have a Disney character franchise which can call upon any of the characters at any given moment to headline a movie.

So I see a Doom move more likely to be made at Disney than at Fox where it might not seem as financially viable.

I could even see Disney/ Marvel exploring a Thanos film if they so wanted.

In either case though, I think before you can do a villain film, you have to have set them up as a formidable foe against the heroes in other movies first. No-one would be interested otherwise in why this person is the way they are and their fall from grace. Maleficent has already been establishedin the public consciousness as the main villain of Disney over several decades, so that's why a film about her can work now.

 

[Xeno-noesis]

This is my speculation to add to this thread.

I don't think too many people are reading the current run of Fantastic Four comics, as there are no recent threads in the FF forums or in the Marvel Comics forum.

First and foremost, I am regrettably brand new to the world of the Fantastic Four. I just bought volume one of the Masterworks paperback and also the Jim Lee Heroes Reborn TPB (which has 1-6). It's going to take me a little while to catch up but I'm working on it.

Ok, now to my speculation. As the Marvel NOW run currently stands, I believe Marvel is deliberately reducing it's quality to undermine any potential fan support or interest since FOX is attempting another film. The current Fantastic Four is half-baked...a good premise that has been botched with awful dialogue, gaps of logical progression, and most importantly, it has the worst art I've ever seen for a flagship title. Like, horrible, grade-school scribblings on scraps of paper. It's obvious that Fraction and Bagley don't care about the issues...they're doing just enough to get by. Basically, for such a high-profile title, Marvel purposely hired below-average artistic talent...they could have hired anyone to do pencils, and they chose this.

 

[Kelly]

This is my speculation to add to this thread.

I don't think too many people are reading the current run of Fantastic Four comics, as there are no recent threads in the FF forums or in the Marvel Comics forum.

First and foremost, I am regrettably brand new to the world of the Fantastic Four. I just bought volume one of the Masterworks paperback and also the Jim Lee Heroes Reborn TPB (which has 1-6). It's going to take me a little while to catch up but I'm working on it.

Ok, now to my speculation. As the Marvel NOW run currently stands, I believe Marvel is deliberately reducing it's quality to undermine any potential fan support or interest since FOX is attempting another film. The current Fantastic Four is half-baked...a good premise that has been botched with awful dialogue, gaps of logical progression, and most importantly, it has the worst art I've ever seen for a flagship title. Like, horrible, grade-school scribblings on scraps of paper. It's obvious that Fraction and Bagley don't care about the issues...they're doing just enough to get by. Basically, for such a high-profile title, Marvel purposely hired below-average artistic talent...they could have hired anyone to do pencils, and they chose this.

And you are speculating on about 5% of the population that will be going to a comicbook movie.

If Fox does it right, and I'm doubtful that they will with their history, but I'm willing to give them a slight chance. They will make sure they have a quality script, hire quality director, get actors that fall in love with the premise of this family and give it the time in production that it needs and deserves. If it does that, then as far as I'm concerned, to bad place with Marvel and their disrespect of this first family of comicdom. They are cutting off their own nose to spite their face. Soooo????

 

[Xeno-noesis]

And you are speculating on about 5% of the population that will be going to a comicbook movie.

If Fox does it right, and I'm doubtful that they will with their history, but I'm willing to give them a slight chance. They will make sure they have a quality script, hire quality director, get actors that fall in love with the premise of this family and give it the time in production that it needs and deserves. If it does that, then as far as I'm concerned, to bad place with Marvel and their disrespect of this first family of comicdom. They are cutting off their own nose to spite their face. Soooo????

I don't quite understand your first comment but I definitely agree with you on FOX's inability to craft a good film. You are right - in a way it would be spite. FOX doesn't have any outside support from Marvel except for the comic itself and Marvel wants the rights back, so it's the only advantage Marvel has.

Either way, it's not that important. I'm just trying to find a way to justify the crappiness of the current issues.

 

[Kelly]

I don't quite understand your first comment but I definitely agree with you on FOX's inability to craft a good film. You are right - in a way it would be spite. FOX doesn't have any outside support from Marvel except for the comic itself and Marvel wants the rights back, so it's the only advantage Marvel has.

Either way, it's not that important. I'm just trying to find a way to justify the crappiness of the current issues.

I would say that about 5% of the audience in these movies read these comics, so what happens in those comics really doesn't impact more than that 5%. If that much...

 

[Zarex]

I don't quite understand your first comment but I definitely agree with you on FOX's inability to craft a good film. You are right - in a way it would be spite. FOX doesn't have any outside support from Marvel except for the comic itself and Marvel wants the rights back, so it's the only advantage Marvel has.

Either way, it's not that important. I'm just trying to find a way to justify the crappiness of the current issues.

I just think the FF is an extremely difficult comic (and movie) to get right. If Marvel's intention was to "stick it" to FOX, It would be a lot easier to simply cancel the book rather than to put out a monthly publication of substandard quality.

 

[Duran Man]

There is no hope.

 

[Xeno-noesis]

I would say that about 5% of the audience in these movies read these comics, so what happens in those comics really doesn't impact more than that 5%. If that much...

Oh ok, I got you now. I wasn't sure who the 5% were.

 

[fangz]

This is my speculation to add to this thread.

I don't think too many people are reading the current run of Fantastic Four comics, as there are no recent threads in the FF forums or in the Marvel Comics forum.

First and foremost, I am regrettably brand new to the world of the Fantastic Four. I just bought volume one of the Masterworks paperback and also the Jim Lee Heroes Reborn TPB (which has 1-6). It's going to take me a little while to catch up but I'm working on it.

Ok, now to my speculation. As the Marvel NOW run currently stands, I believe Marvel is deliberately reducing it's quality to undermine any potential fan support or interest since FOX is attempting another film. The current Fantastic Four is half-baked...a good premise that has been botched with awful dialogue, gaps of logical progression, and most importantly, it has the worst art I've ever seen for a flagship title. Like, horrible, grade-school scribblings on scraps of paper. It's obvious that Fraction and Bagley don't care about the issues...they're doing just enough to get by. Basically, for such a high-profile title, Marvel purposely hired below-average artistic talent...they could have hired anyone to do pencils, and they chose this.

people said the same thing when they killed off Johnny a few year's ago.
i really have a hard time believing that tho.
i think what's more likely is that Marvel's going for an aesthetic with the book that you really don't like and which might actually just be, overall, wretched and worthless. you know?
believe me, it wouldn't be the first time they have.

there's also some people who just really hate certain artists, like a lot of people describe Romita Jr the way that you're talking about FF art. which i haven't seen enough to know what you're talking about.

but he's part of Marvel, they're putting him on new things and it's not cuz they're trying to tank those characters.

personally, i like him, sometimes it seems like his composition for a panel isn't based on what would be best, but more on what it's possible for him to pull off drawing, but i think he makes it work and i like how a lot of his stuff is referencing 60's pop art and indie comics from more recent times.

and like a poster above pointed out, that's a pretty strange and esoteric way to tank a character, to mess them up in a medium that almost no percent of the possible audience even vaguely cares about.

 

[Zarex]

In the article from "The Wrap" in which Michael B. Jordan is said to be in contention for the role of Johnny Storm, the most interesting factoid provided (if true) is in the 10th paragraph.

"Fantastic Four" has not been greenlit. Keep hope alive!

 

[Mr. Dent]

I hope to god this reverts. It sounds like Fox is once again trying to change too much and ruin the story instead of just giving us the FF we want. Glad the films hasn't been greenlit, I hope someone drops out at the last second to bite Fox on the ash.

 

[Zarex]

I hope to god this reverts. It sounds like Fox is once again trying to change too much and ruin the story instead of just giving us the FF we want. Glad the films hasn't been greenlit, I hope someone drops out at the last second to bite Fox on the ash.

I don't see how a "true to the comics" FF film makes money for FOX, let alone a reboot that (again) makes major and poorly conceived changes to the First Family. The situation should be settled by fall. If "The Wolverine" flops, and I suspect it will, I can't see the finance team at FOX greenlighting a couple hundred million investment in the FF reboot

 

[KDM1986]

For the love of god please let the rights revert back. Their is nothing I've heard so far about the rumora that make me think this reboot will be successful. I don't even seeing it being better than the original two films.

 

[Kelly]

For the love of god please let the rights revert back. Their is nothing I've heard so far about the rumora that make me think this reboot will be successful. I don't even seeing it being better than the original two films.

I'm pretty much where you are at....I have not heard a rumor that has given me much excitement over the film. I am one to wait, but my anticipation is no where near what it could be.

 

[fangz]

what would that mean, for them to say it's 'not been greenlit' but it's got a release date and supposed to start shooting in a few months?

isn't that really unusual?
what does greenlit mean? this all just sounds weirder and weirder.
(and nothing to do with the casting choice)

or is this explainable by how studios usually start shooting movies?
wouldn't it have been greenlit by now?

 

[Zarex]

what would that mean, for them to say it's 'not been greenlit' but it's got a release date and supposed to start shooting in a few months?

isn't that really unusual?
what does greenlit mean? this all just sounds weirder and weirder.
(and nothing to do with the casting choice)

or is this explainable by how studios usually start shooting movies?
wouldn't it have been greenlit by now?

Greenlighting a film means that the studio has made a financial commitment and has established at least a preliminary budget for the project. That FOX has not done so suggests to me that at least one person with pull at FOX is looking at the same numbers I am looking at and is unwilling to put their job on the line in order to fund a likely flop.

 

[Raiden]

In the article from "The Wrap" in which Michael B. Jordan is said to be in contention for the role of Johnny Storm, the most interesting factoid provided (if true) is in the 10th paragraph.

"Fantastic Four" has not been greenlit. Keep hope alive!

Wait, Michael B. Jordan is up for the Johnny Storm role? I typically don't mind it if they change the race of the characters in superhero movies (I supported the late Michael Clarke Duncan's cast as Kingpin and SLJ as Nick Fury), but I just can't see this working. At all. If Jordan is going to be Johnny then I guess Trank will cast Gabrielle Union as Sue.

 

[Project862006]

mbj is a great young actor who has the perfect balance of cocky/arrogance and comedy on top of dramatic chops which he showed in sundance award winning film fruitville

kid has charisma,likeability and range and a good looking guy

couldn't ask for better traits for johnny

but being white and blonde seems to be far more important than acting chops

 

[Raiden]

mbj is a great young actor who has the perfect balance of cocky/arrogance and comedy on top of dramatic chops which he showed in sundance award winning film fruitville

kid has charisma,likeability and range and a good looking guy

couldn't ask for better traits for johnny

but being white and blonde seems to be far more important than acting chops

You're implying that they cannot find a young blonde actor who has the acting chops to play Johnny Storm in Hollywood.

Btw, I don't understand why Superman has to be white, either. Isn't he an alien?