The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it? - Part 1

Discussion in 'Iron Man 3' started by Thread Manager, May 6, 2013.

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  1. BatsDC

    BatsDC Side-Kicker

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    I had no problem with the twist in Iron Man 3. Of course I'd have preferred the proper Mandarin - but Black executed his take in a great way.
     
    #926
  2. MichaelChen

    MichaelChen Well-Known Member

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    The Mandarin was never a Red Scare villain. He was manipulating both sides in order to create World War III, right from the begining. He believes in war and social darwinism, not communism.
     
    #927
  3. guitarking

    guitarking Well-Known Member

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    The big Mandarin twist SHOULD have been that he's a middle Eastern terrorist leader (Ben Kingsley) like Bin Laden instead of a Chinese guy with 10 rings. THAT should have been the extent of the big twist.
     
    #928
  4. giveyourself12%

    giveyourself12% Team Walt

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    Bingo. When we only had the trailers to go on, everyone was raving about the fact that we were getting an actual villain who was unique and menacing (as well as finally getting to see the founder of the Ten Rings) instead of a another fellow tech genius and/or another guy in a business suit which is really all we've gotten except for Loki.
     
    #929
  5. sdc10

    sdc10 Well-Known Member

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    Unique in what way? If we had the kingsley mandarin as the true villain then yes it would have been cool but not unique. He wouldve been just like Bane from TDKR, a leader of a terrorist group with a funny way of talking who talks about how society is crappy and is in need of a change.
     
    #930
  6. OcStat

    OcStat Well-Known Member

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    A terrorist villain in my opinion is not unique.

    A villain who has a whole entire terrorist fabricated to manipulate people and events for his own gain sounds a little more unique to me.

    Killian was not just another tech guy.
     
    #931
  7. C. Lee

    C. Lee I'm not old...I'm ancient

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    I still have no problem with how they portrayed the Mandarin in IM3. I started reading comics in the early to mid 60's. Grew up with the original characters and storylines. I have seen so many changes made to characters by the comic companies that produced them over the years...that now I don't get too upset by any changes that the movie makers do. That doesn't mean that some changes don't irritate me...but on a whole, I don't get too put out by them.
     
    #932
  8. giveyourself12%

    giveyourself12% Team Walt

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    I'm talking about unique in terms of previous Iron Man films, not all of cinema.

    While you might argue that Vanko was a terrorist, he was clearly a tech genius as shown when he miniaturized the arc reactor on his own with nothing but the schematics for the large one that powered Stark Industries and the knowledge that Tony had already done so. (As well as whatever information on the arc reactor that had been published up to that point. I'm speaking of things like the "Stark's Arc" magazine article)

    Stane's tech guys at Stark Industries couldn't replicate what Tony had done at their lab but Vanko was able to at his Russian apartment.

    Are you saying this because of his Extremis abilities? Because otherwise, I can't see how he was anything else. He founded AIM.

    Even accounting for his abilities, they're rooted in science that he was able to apply to himself.
    One could argue that that kind of villain goes all the way back to the Wizard of Oz but I'll grant you that that's not the usual way of doing things, villain-wise.

    However, I do not believe that it was done well in IM3.
     
    #933
  9. giveyourself12%

    giveyourself12% Team Walt

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    I have to say though that I would have liked him to be American ex-military or ex-CIA as Feige had said *cough* lied *cough* in early interviews.
     
    #934
  10. Crossopholis

    Crossopholis Member

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    This is an interesting point, but the argument doesn't work for me. I can see how others might have wanted a more traditional or "generic," for lack of a better term, terrorist version of the Mandarin simply within the contexts of the IM movieverse, but I can't un-see the countless other movies I've seen that have plots centered on a big bad terrorist.

    Without this twist, I probably would have still liked the movie, but it wouldn't have been anything special to me; just another superhero movie that plays things safe. And even as it is, I still think the movie played certain plot elements a bit too by-the-books, mainly with regards to [BLACKOUT]Pepper's "death" scene[/BLACKOUT]. When that part happened, I was thinking, "Oh wow, awesome. The IM we see in the next Avengers' movie is going to be completely warped due to this (in a good storytelling way)," but, no, of course [BLACKOUT]she comes back and saves the day for a happy ending. Yay.[/BLACKOUT]
     
    #935
  11. CyclopsWasRight

    CyclopsWasRight Well, he was.

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    Of all the marvel characters from all the marvel movies from all the studios, this is the rapiest of the raped
     
    #936
  12. VictorShade

    VictorShade Well-Known Member

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    Better check with Hank Pym on that.
     
    #937
  13. Broseph44

    Broseph44 Witness Me

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    Oh boyyyyyy
     
    #938
  14. S. Grundy

    S. Grundy Well-Known Member

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    And let's face it, the movie wouldn't have been any different if Kingsley replaced Pearce in the final fight. It would have gone through the same beats.
     
    #939
  15. DarthDaveBanner

    DarthDaveBanner Well-Known Member

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    Anyone see the new deleted scene with Mandy? Very interesting manipulation of the audience there!

    I'm convinced theres a lot of deleted stuff with him, looooads of his best lines from the trailer weren't in the final film.
     
    #940
  16. Green Goblin

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    Look into your heart and you'll know that deep down, the mandarin from the trailers was more awesome than the final product.
     
    #941
  17. Green Goblin

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    People complaining about no rock music need to grow up though.
     
    #942
  18. Moridin

    Moridin Death Contagious Deity

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    How about you take some of your advice, and stop being so condesceding:

    :whatever:
     
    #943
  19. Lord

    Lord All Mighty

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    A villain hiding behind a decoy has been done almost to death by now, not only movies, but even Naruto has done that (which ironically enough also ruined the series). A Terrorist that doesn't come from the USA or Russia is way more unique than another fake out
     
    #944
  20. Senator Pleasury

    Senator Pleasury Well-Known Member

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    It was fairly obvious.
     
    #945
  21. Green Goblin

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    I'm saying complaining about the lack of rock music is silly but doing the same when a villain gets a big change is different, especially when a the comic version was better IMO.
     
    #946
  22. Surfer

    Surfer Sentinel of the Spaceways

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    I have spent the last couple of months since seeing IM3 trying to accept how the Mandarin was portrayed on the screen, but still haven't come to terms with it. I know it won't happen, but it would be really cool if they decided with all of the money they made from Iron Man 3 & the Avengers, they were going to do some reshoots and make a Iron Man 3 Comic Book Fan edition for Blue Ray & DVD (almost like a director's cut of sorts) for all of the fans that were disappointed with how things went down in the movie regarding the Mandarin. I mean it probably wouldn't take too much to do it. They would need to cut out the parts with Ben Kingsley as Trevor Slattery from the film, and just have it skip ahead with a little filler sequence between, perhaps to show them discovering Killian's involvement with the terrorist attacks and his connection to the Mandarin. Then at the end have the battle between Killian and the extremis soldiers commences with Iron Man & his hall of armors more or less like it did in Iron Man 3 (only this time without Killian saying I am the Mandarin). Once Killian has been defeated by Tony (please not Pepper), then Ben Kingsley comes out of the shadows as the Mandarin for the grand finale. With almost all of Iron Man's armors badly damaged in the battle with Killian & the other extremis soldiers he is forced to take on the Mandarin and his rings of power one on one (and that is where most of the new footage would be necessary & special effects). I mean sure it would cost the studio money to do this, but if Iron Man 3's entire movie budget was $200 Million and it racked up over 1.2 Billion world wide, not to mention how well the Avengers did in the Box Office, reinvesting some of that money back in the fans that weren't happy could be a smart move, because I got to be honest. I was all gung ho about Marvel & what they were doing, but after what happened with Iron Man 3 I almost feel disinterested in seeing Thor, Captain America & Guardian's due to them all being a shared universe. What was Marvel's strength to me has now become it's weakness. To me a shared universe is only as good as it worst film, and while Iron Man 3 itself was not necessarily a terrible movie, what happened with the Mandarin character to me still marks it as the worst Marvel Studio's film to date for me. Also, for those people & fans that did like the original theatrical version of Iron Man 3, well they could still buy that version, or better yet bundle them together as a 2 disc set with lots of extras. Anyways, I know I am dreaming, but still I wish I wasn't.

    Surfer
     
    #947
  23. Green Goblin

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    They should advertise that the Blu-ray has the real mandarin lol.
     
    #948
  24. Surfer

    Surfer Sentinel of the Spaceways

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    Well many would argue that we got the real Mandarin in Iron Man 3, so I am not trying to start World War 3 here with my comments. but I would just say that I was hoping for something "I feel" closer represents a more traditional look of the character and his powers (rings) from the comics. To those that are happy with what we got, I am truly happy for them, but it does suck being one of the individuals that can't seem to find peace with it. I am just hoping Thor will blow me away & make me forget what happened and I will be able to move on as if this film never happened. So, I guess we will see, but right now due to Iron Man 3 my expectations have been squashed.

    Surfer
     
    #949
  25. Loki882

    Loki882 Well-Known Member

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    I actually don't know how I feel about the twist. Every time I find a reason to dislike it, I think of another reason to like it, then I think of another reason to dislike it, and the cycle repeats. I do think that the second half of the film had too much comedy, it kind of killed the tension in scenes that should have been serious.
     
    #950
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