Iron Man 3 The Mandarin in Iron Man 3...Love it or hate it? - Part 2

[GENERAL RAAM582]

Yeah, he was badass and all, and I can understand the muscle part of it, but Killian put up the more cinematic fight.

 

[A Necessary Evil]

Well...yeah. He was the main baddie.

 

[GENERAL RAAM582]

Indeed.

 

[StarLord]

TBF, Savin was a badass too. Took out a whole water tower on Tony lol. Also, he got to die like Mallen, which was cool.

It's such a shame Savin was killed off. I would've liked to see his character develop.

 

[Levsky]

"The rumour I have mentioned was about the Mandarin group in which Killian is like brain, Trevor his mouth and creator of appearances, Savin makes muscles"

the guy who played Savin actually said that, as a matter of fact lol.

The only rumor I heard about Mandarin anytime before/after IM3, was the Mandy was a sentient AI or something.

Hey, you're right. I've completely forgotten about his statement some time before the movie's premiere. But I'm certain that there was also a leak about the Mandarin group back in 2012 and that most of people just didn't pay attention to that rumour or whatever you call it. Oh, look, I've just found some source for support: link. And, as we can see, it turned out to be true. The only difference is the Mandarin group wasn't led by Ben Kingsley's character but by Guy Pearce's one.

 

[A Necessary Evil]

Oh, I wasn't calling you out or anything, I was just saying that Savin's actor also said that lol. Still likea da twist. Oh and Starlord, I agree and disagree. I had a blast with Savin on screen (as well as anything else, loved IM3), but I don't see IM4 in the foreseeable future, so I find it necessary. Plus, he'd pretty much just be an unresolved plot thread.

 

[Lord]

I hope we get Iron Man 4 soon, would like to see it competing against Transformers on the same year, and if it's as entertaining as Iron Man 3 then this franchise will officially become my favorite popcorn fun film series.

 

[StarLord]

Oh and Starlord, I agree and disagree. I had a blast with Savin on screen (as well as anything else, loved IM3), but I don't see IM4 in the foreseeable future, so I find it necessary. Plus, he'd pretty much just be an unresolved plot thread.

I guess part of me wishes that they wouldn't kill off characters so quickly.

 

[A Necessary Evil]

I hope we get Iron Man 4 soon, would like to see it competing against Transformers on the same year, and if it's as entertaining as Iron Man 3 then this franchise will officially become my favorite popcorn fun film series.

Despite IM2's shortcomings, It already is pretty much mine. I have a blast watching RDJ in these films.

I guess part of me wishes that they wouldn't kill off characters so quickly.

I agree, but sometimes when they save them for the long run, things change (Abomination & Leader being key examples).

 

[Uskok]

Actually, these rumours we were hearing about a year before the movie hit the screens turned out to be true. According to them, The Mandarin would be some kind of group, not just a single person. And after rewatching this movie a few times, I've realised it is the point. If you pay attention to words of Savin when he's about to kidnapp the president, you'll notice he's using "that's not how the Mandarin works" line which is the key. He's not referring to one person who is supposed to be in charge of all this operation but he's clearly talking like he himself would be the part of some big Mandarin group. The rumour I have mentioned was about the Mandarin group in which Killian is like brain, Trevor his mouth and creator of appearances, Savin makes muscles. All of this became the reality. I must admit that I really liked this whole idea they came up with in this film. I find it sorta intriguing and creative. Also I consider Killian the most dangerous, interesting and intelligent of all Tony's villains so far. Just look at what he has done and how he has gained all his power, influences, supplies... Not only was he a great mind, but also a really strong and experienced in combat opponent who could almost kill Stark if not for Pepper's help.

But Savin was lying because it was confirmed in Iron Man 3, Iron Man 3 Prelude, and All Hail the King that neither Killian nor Savin have any connection with the Mandarin.

 

[A Necessary Evil]

IM3 said Killian was the Mandarin. IM3 Prelude (which is not canonical to the MCU) showed that a Mandarin existed. Not specifying if it was some other Mofather or Killian or even Kingsley's TV Mandarin. AHTK is the only thing to rectify that some other Mandarin is out there.

 

[Lord]

I really liked the first one, and 2 to a certain extent too, but there was just something in Iron Man 3 that made it a lot of fun to me, it probably was due to Shane's Writting and some creative fight scenes, that film was just what i would hope for a blockbuster film, it was not exactly profound or genius, but it wasn't dumb, had heart, entertaining characters and had a lot of wit.

I actually prefer each Iron Man film to more or less stand on its oun, instead of relying on advertising The Avengers events, since IM itself is already kind of an event. A lot of the ideas in the Iron Man sequel section sound very exciting and promising.

 

[A Necessary Evil]

I like IM2, don't get me wrong. I just think that they failed to capture what made the first so great, and wasted what could have been a great villain (in b4 someone claims the same about Iron Man 3, which they did NOT ). I blame Marvel for IM2's faults, however. Favs wanted 3 years for it, and Maaahvel said no.

 

[Lord]

I agree, 2 had much wasted potencial, Whiplash Vanko seemed like he was going to be a great villain. It's kind of a shame that Favrew wasn't able to make his dream Iron Man Trilogy.

 

[A Necessary Evil]

Yeah, same. I mean, I'm somewhat glad he walked for 3, because as much as I love IM1 and enjoy IM2, IM3 was the most fun I had at the theater last year. Vanko literally did nothing, except fight Tony on a racetrack and then in Armor for about 8 seconds...with his helmet open...and watching Rhodes and Stark obviously form a battle plan.

Didn't really think that one through, did ya Ivan?

 

[Chris B]

I agree, 2 had much wasted potencial, Whiplash Vanko seemed like he was going to be a great villain. It's kind of a shame that Favrew wasn't able to make his dream Iron Man Trilogy.

I've read in the past about how appearantly Favreau's original plan for IM2 was to have Justin Hammer be the main villain and financing a private army of supervillains. Despite liking Vanko, I wonder if that would've been the better way to go.

Anyway, I wish Favreau had come back for IM3. I feel pretty confident that he would've rectified the problems IM2 had and recapture at least some of the magic IM1 had. Its a shame since the film that he opted to do over IM3 at the time never happened.

 

[Lord]

Yeah, he left Iron Man 3 to do Magic Kingdom and it never hapened, i even remember him planing with Guillermo Del Toro's Haunted Mansion reboot to have a connected universe based on Disney's atractions.

This whole thing reminds me of when Frasier left Mummy 4 to do Journey 2, only for him to leave and the Rock to take the lead in that film.

 

[Uskok]

IM3 said Killian was the Mandarin. IM3 Prelude (which is not canonical to the MCU) showed that a Mandarin existed. Not specifying if it was some other Mofather or Killian or even Kingsley's TV Mandarin. AHTK is the only thing to rectify that some other Mandarin is out there.

IM3 Prelude isn't canon only in your dreams. AHTK proves that IM3 Prelude is canon. And Killian was never the Mandarin. You may like that or not, but you can't change that.

 

[Levsky]

But Savin was lying because it was confirmed in Iron Man 3, Iron Man 3 Prelude, and All Hail the King that neither Killian nor Savin have any connection with the Mandarin.

Okay, but what makes you believe that Savin was aware of existence of the true Mandarin? We know that the Mandarin group was just a propaganda style idea created by Killian for his own purpose. He used some ancient symbols, legends and tried to impersonate terrorists from Ten Rings so that his operations seemed more legit. This has nothing to do with the real Mandarin who may now claim his rights to this appearance (as we have already seen in "All Hail the King" one-shot). These two situations does not contradict each other.

 

[A Necessary Evil]

IM3 Prelude isn't canon only in your dreams. AHTK proves that IM3 Prelude is canon. And Killian was never the Mandarin. You may like that or not, but you can't change that.

Did anyone mention any of the events that took place in that comic? No.

Was there even any nods to what happened in the comic? No.

Has Feige even mentioned the importance of the Prelude comic? No.


Was Killian the Mandarin originally? Yes. Shane Black even said that in interviews, commentary, and when he held a F-T-F meeting with unhappy fans. This was obviously to appease the fans. Why throw in Mandarin, prove him to be a decoy for the real Mandarin, then oh yeah L0L there's another fake Mandarin too, here's the real real super not fake not decoy Mandarin...but we had this planned the whole time.


Yeaaah not buying it.

Also, if One-Shot comics are canon to the films, how about that awesome Venom getting Peter Parker's memories scene in Spider-Man 3?

 

[A Necessary Evil]

I've read in the past about how appearantly Favreau's original plan for IM2 was to have Justin Hammer be the main villain and financing a private army of supervillains. Despite liking Vanko, I wonder if that would've been the better way to go.

That would have been awesome. I'm serious. As fun as Hammer was in IM2 (dat Hammertime ), he was only menacing when he yelled at Ivan and when he threatened Pepper. Hammer is (imo) one of the better IM villains, and I thought making him Tony's age instead of an old fart was a good idea...but not into a goofball instead of a ruthless tycoon. Waste of Rockwell's talents also, except his comedic chops.

 

[Uskok]

Did anyone mention any of the events that took place in that comic? No.

Was there even any nods to what happened in the comic? No.

Has Feige even mentioned the importance of the Prelude comic? No.

Did you participate in World War I? No, you didn't. Then how do you know it happened?

Was Killian the Mandarin originally? Yes. Shane Black even said that in interviews, commentary, and when he held a F-T-F meeting with unhappy fans. This was obviously to appease the fans. Why throw in Mandarin, prove him to be a decoy for the real Mandarin, then oh yeah L0L there's another fake Mandarin too, here's the real real super not fake not decoy Mandarin...but we had this planned the whole time.


Yeaaah not buying it.

If Killian wanted to be the Mandarin, he would never hire Slattery to play the Mandarin.

Also, if One-Shot comics are canon to the films, how about that awesome Venom getting Peter Parker's memories scene in Spider-Man 3?

Different franchises, different people. Some people care about what they're making, and some don't.

 

[Lord]

Killian was the Mandarin, he simply didn't want to show his face as it and had a decoy.

 

[A Necessary Evil]

Did you participate in World War I? No, you didn't. Then how do you know it happened?

Wow. Using a real life event in comparison to a nan-canonical comic book to a film that has no references to it. Great argument.

If Killian wanted to be the Mandarin, he would never hire Slattery to play the Mandarin.

"You see, you simply rule from behind the shadows, because the second you give evil a face, you hand the people a target. Bin Laden. Gahdaffi. The Mandarin."

Later on

"No more false faces, you wanted the Mandarin, well you're looking right at him."

Killian was using a facade to not only control the war on terror, but to do it without raising eyebrows and give away that it was *he* who was doing it. I'm sorry you must have the attention span of like, two seconds to not pay attention to the movie.

Different franchises, different people. Some people care about what they're making, and some don't.

Nope, not a good argument. If a one-shot that has no mention in the film is canon, so must the other. Because...logic.

 

[Lord]

The MCU comics are kind of part of an expanded universe, Marvel acnouledges them and we constantly see new one, they're more of an add in to the movies, i don't think they're supposed to be foreshawing of what's to come