The Official Boxing Thread!!! - Part 5

Haha, that is a lack of professionalism. He has some good underlying talent. He can absorb big punches and has power, along with being a very good counterpuncher. But no excuse for not being prepared lol.

None at all. All I keep seeing now is how he wants to get in shape and come back...but the huge paydays may have been squandered already. Respect to him, he realized his dream, but he could've enjoyed that type of success again.

Perhaps my view of history is a little different, but at the time I didn't find Lewis anywhere near as boring as I viewed Klitschko during his reign. Perhaps it was because Wlad was also an extremely boring person as well whereas Lennox had a bit more personality.

Lewis is my favourite boxer of all time. He did have some boring fights true. But that's because he was like a chess player. He was happy to keep people at distance with his jab and he had immaculate footwork to go with his intelligence.

But... if he got hurt or if he fancied it, he'd go to war.

Well I guess I saw a bit of that dog in AJ when he fought Wlad, I think that's the type of response we all expected out of him during his first fight with Ruiz, not appearing to quit.

Lewis would engage more readily with anyone, but he still did it strategically. He knew he could outbox Hasim so he took his time, kept him at distance, and when he found the opening he cashed in. Even a washed Tyson was given respect, so much so that Emanuel (rip) was berating him for not being more aggressive.

But part of his lack of popularity came from using a slower pace and not always going to war in the way fans like to see. I do think there's some similarities between the two because of that but clearly AJ is nowhere near Lennox as a boxer right now. Not even close...
 
I mean, how is that fair? Ruiz is the one who knocked Joshua out. What Ruiz did to Joshua was far more of a dominant performance. I mean I don't want to see it, but in terms of what warrants what, Ruiz deserves a rematch more then the guy who quit.

Its sort of a known thing in boxing that if you are trying to dethrone a well known/marketable champion you pretty much always have to do it twice.

I see your logic that Ruiz win was more impressive than AJ's but honestly AJ just needed to win by any means. I like Ruiz for the simple fact I can't help but root for a fat lad going up against someone who looks like they were chiseled out of marble lol. But pretty much everybody in boxing (himself/promoters/family) aside wanted him to lose the rematch,the big money fights rest with potential Joshua vs. Fury or Joshua vs. Wilder matchups so the whole talk of a trilogy fight will be ignored until one of those fights has happened.

AJ put on a Lennox Lewis/Wladimir Klitschko jabbing and holding display, and honestly I can't disagree with that approach. It was absolutely boring and also effective, I'd be a hypocrite for saying anything wrong about it when those other two dominated for years doing the same thing.

My biggest issue is with Ruiz. You tried to train yourself? Really? You thought an extra 15+ pounds on an already gelatinous frame was training? Seriously???!!!

His dad was brutally honest and gave the best account for me basically saying the fame and success got to him and he was spending too much time enjoying that and not enough time training (tale as old as time with guys who get those huge upset wins and are suddenly stars) to quote Hagler "It's tough to get out of bed to do roadwork at 5 am when you've been sleeping in silk pajamas". Agree though coming in at nearly 300lbs when you are only around 6ft is unbelievable.
 
The thing is, it would be nice for Ruiz to get another shot.

But his lack of professionalism is a disgrace. He was world champion, and he didnt take it seriously?

Does he deserve another shot?
 
Ruiz doesn't deserve a rematch until he gets some decent wins under his belt.

Besides the Joshua fight, his best win was a tough 10-round decision against Siarhei Liakhovich.

About 18 months before Ruiz took Liahkovich the distance, Deontay Wilder obliterated him in one round and left him convulsing on the canvas:
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Beyond those two fights, Ruiz has beaten NOBODY and lost to the thoroughly mediocre Joseph Parker.
 
The thing is, it would be nice for Ruiz to get another shot.

But his lack of professionalism is a disgrace. He was world champion, and he didnt take it seriously?

Does he deserve another shot?
Not straightaway anyway. First step is to have another fight and get into good shape for it to show he can be a professional.
 
The thing is, it would be nice for Ruiz to get another shot.

But his lack of professionalism is a disgrace. He was world champion, and he didnt take it seriously?

Does he deserve another shot?

As of now no. I understand the argument they are 1-1 but Ruiz was so out of shape and so below par I think he will need to have an impressive performance before its even discussed.

The boxing world is largely disgusted with him at the moment this kind of unprofessionalism is poison to a guy's career options.
Ruiz doesn't deserve a rematch until he gets some decent wins under his belt.

Besides the Joshua fight, his best win was a tough 10-round decision against Siarhei Liakhovich.

About 18 months before Ruiz took Liahkovich the distance, Deontay Wilder obliterated him in one round and left him convulsing on the canvas:
InbornPoorJanenschia-size_restricted.gif


Beyond those two fights, Ruiz has beaten NOBODY and lost to the thoroughly mediocre Joseph Parker.

Parker is far from mediocre he has lost to the guy with 3 of the 4 HW title belts and a contentious loss to Dillan Whyte which really should have been a draw.
 
Ruiz doesn't deserve a rematch until he gets some decent wins under his belt.

Besides the Joshua fight, his best win was a tough 10-round decision against Siarhei Liakhovich.

About 18 months before Ruiz took Liahkovich the distance, Deontay Wilder obliterated him in one round and left him convulsing on the canvas:
InbornPoorJanenschia-size_restricted.gif


Beyond those two fights, Ruiz has beaten NOBODY and lost to the thoroughly mediocre Joseph Parker.
You clearly didn't see that fight. That was the textbook definition of home court advantage. The only reason Ruiz lost that fight is because he was in Parker's backyard.
 
You clearly didn't see that fight. That was the textbook definition of home court advantage. The only reason Ruiz lost that fight is because he was in Parker's backyard.
It was an extremely close fight either way. I watched the whole thing and neither guy was remotely impressive.

Parker is far from mediocre he has lost to the guy with 3 of the 4 HW title belts and a contentious loss to Dillan Whyte which really should have been a draw.

Dillian Whyte is not good either. He looks worse and worse with each fight, and if he tried to step in there against a guy like Fury, Ortiz, or Wilder he'd get wrecked. He already got wrecked vs Joshua and, as you said, got bailed out against Parker (and, while we're on the subject, Rivas AND Chisora).

Further, Parker has almost no good wins under his belt. Besides the Ruiz fight, who's his best win? Hughie Fury, who loses to every single good fighter he faces? Carlos Takam? Come on.

Parker won a vacant belt in a controversial decision, defended it by going the distance against Cojanu (who got utterly obliterated in the second round by both Luis Ortiz and Daniel Dubois), then barely defended it against Hughie.

And then in the fight against Joshua he turtled the whole time, just trying not to get knocked out.

Parker is not a top 10 fighter. Heavyweight is already a shallow division and Parker isn't among its best.
 
It was an extremely close fight either way. I watched the whole thing and neither guy was remotely impressive.



Dillian Whyte is not good either. He looks worse and worse with each fight, and if he tried to step in there against a guy like Fury, Ortiz, or Wilder he'd get wrecked. He already got wrecked vs Joshua and, as you said, got bailed out against Parker (and, while we're on the subject, Rivas AND Chisora).

Further, Parker has almost no good wins under his belt. Besides the Ruiz fight, who's his best win? Hughie Fury, who loses to every single good fighter he faces? Carlos Takam? Come on.

Parker won a vacant belt in a controversial decision, defended it by going the distance against Cojanu (who got utterly obliterated in the second round by both Luis Ortiz and Daniel Dubois), then barely defended it against Hughie.

And then in the fight against Joshua he turtled the whole time, just trying not to get knocked out.

Parker is not a top 10 fighter. Heavyweight is already a shallow division and Parker isn't among its best.

Have to disagree here. Whyte is a legit top level Heavyweight.

Name Wilder's best win excluding Ortiz. Ruiz? Harrison? Or Fury's excluding Klitschko. Heavyweights fight a lot of no names or are in total mismatches that's pretty much always been the case and why I prefer MMA.

So he won the belt and defended it twice? I can't really see how this is a point for criticism, because he didnt finish them? Styles make fights and were not always going to get a finish.

To whom are you referring fighting Joshua, Parker or Whyte? If Parker then again I have to ask if you watched that fight? Not claiming it would have meant victory for Parker but the referee in that fight was incredibly strict and did not allow any fighting on the inside which seemed to have been about a big element of Parkers gameplan so its not like he really got to show his best performance.

I agree that it is shallow that's how I find this an odd claim. Its not dispuatble the top 3 guys are Fury, Joshua and Wilder (in whatever order you like). But what other 7 guys would you put in there above Parker & Whyte?
 
Have to disagree here. Whyte is a legit top level Heavyweight.

Name Wilder's best win excluding Ortiz. Ruiz? Harrison? Or Fury's excluding Klitschko. Heavyweights fight a lot of no names or are in total mismatches that's pretty much always been the case and why I prefer MMA.

So he won the belt and defended it twice? I can't really see how this is a point for criticism, because he didnt finish them? Styles make fights and were not always going to get a finish.

To whom are you referring fighting Joshua, Parker or Whyte? If Parker then again I have to ask if you watched that fight? Not claiming it would have meant victory for Parker but the referee in that fight was incredibly strict and did not allow any fighting on the inside which seemed to have been about a big element of Parkers gameplan so its not like he really got to show his best performance.

I agree that it is shallow that's how I find this an odd claim. Its not dispuatble the top 3 guys are Fury, Joshua and Wilder (in whatever order you like). But what other 7 guys would you put in there above Parker & Whyte?

Wilder's best wins, in order:
1. Ortiz twice
2. former WBC heavyweight champion Bermane Stiverne twice
3. Chris Arreola (in his prime, not the current washed up version)
4. former WBO heavyweight champion Siarhei Liakhovich
5. Eric Molina in his prime
6. Johan Duahapas
7. Artur Szpilka
8. Dominic Breazeale
9. Malik Scott
10. Gerald Washingto

All were ranked in the top 10 by TBRB and/or BoxRec at the time Wilder fought them.

Plus he signed to fight prime Povektin in Russia, but Povektin tested positive for PEDs so it got cancelled.

And no, Dillian Whyte is not good. He is getting worse every single fight.

-he just went the distance with a completely shot Mariusz Wach, who had been stopped by 3 of his previous 5 opponents

-in his previous fight against Oscar Rivas he had the dirty drug test and he cheated by changing his gloves AFTER the glove inspection. Rivas is a completely untested prospect and Whyte needed to cheat AND score a late knockdown to barely win on the cards.

-in the fight before that, he was getting beaten cleanly by 9-loss Dereck Chisora and won with a left hook out of nowhere.

-in the fight before that, as you said, he needed a bad knockdown call off a headbutt to salvage a win against Joseph Parker, who put Whyte on the canvas and had him on dream street in the 12th

In each of his last four fights, Whyte has looked worse. He gets fatter, slower, and closer to losing to bad opposition. He's had three fights in a 12 month span and still managed to put on 30 pounds in that span.

As for the top 10 at heavyweight:
1. Deontay Wilder
2. Tyson Fury
3. Luis Ortiz
4. Anthony Joshua
5. Alexander Povetkin
6. Michael Hunter
7. Andy Ruiz, Jr
9. Filip Hrgovic
10. Adam Kownacki

If Whyte doesn't get beat before his mandatory with Wilder is enforced next year, Wilder will completely obliterate him like he did Breazeale. Whyte is a cheating hypejob.
 
If Dillian Whyte is that "bad" why has Deontay Wilder been avoiding him all this time.
Why is the WBC constantly avoiding Dillian Whyte and side lining him. They just don't want to give Dillian Whyte a shot.

They, Deontay Wilder and the WBC, definitely see something on Dillian Whyte that they don't like and they'll keep on trying to push away that fight because i'm sure they see potential trouble for Wilder on the horizon.

Also in the last 3 fights Dillian Whyte KO'ed Chisora which know is having a resurgence, while against Rivas i thought he pulled off a good victory against a very though, strong and skillful opponent in Rivas. Against Mariusz Wach, DW won on points and from what i've heard he got very little time to prepare for that fight which could explain certain things.
 
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If Dillian Whyte is that "bad" why has Deontay Wilder been avoiding him all this time.
Why is the WBC constantly avoiding Dillian Whyte and side lining him. They just don't want to give Dillian Whyte a shot.

They, Deontay Wilder and the WBC, definitely see something on Dillian Whyte that they don't like and they'll keep on trying to push away that fight because i'm sure they see potential trouble for Wilder on the horizon.

Also in the last 3 fights Dillian Whyte KO'ed Chisora which know is having a resurgence, while against Rivas i thought he pulled off a good victory against a very though, strong and skillful opponent in Rivas. Against Mariusz Wach, DW won on points and from what i've heard he got very little time to prepare for that fight which could explain certain things.
He didn't avoid him at all. He's fighting much, much better fighters instead. There's a difference.

Whyte hasn't gotten his mandatory shot because he didn't win an eliminator until the Rivas fight, which he popped dirty for PEDs in and then used legal wrangling to maneuver his way out of it. It's as simple as that.

Whyte was ordered to fight Luis Ortiz in an eliminator, and he turned it down. That's why he wasn't mandatory before the Rivas fight. And then Fury was made the next mandatory while Whyte was sorting out his second PED positive test. One mandatory per year.

If Whyte had fought and beaten Ortiz when he was ordered, he'd have already gotten the Wilder fight.

If Whyte doesn't lose or test positive again, he'll be the mandatory for 2021.

But Mariusz Wach is completely shot, and he took the fight on short notice just like Whyte did. Whyte is ballooning in weight; he went from 236 to 254 to 271 in three fights in a 12 month span, each one against a lesser opponent than the last.

Wach got knocked out by Martin Bakole just this year. Whyte had absolutely no business going the distance with him.

Whyte is a rudimentary boxer with no head movement. He's going to get utterly destroyed if he ever gets in there with Wilder.
 
Wilder's best wins, in order:
1. Ortiz twice
2. former WBC heavyweight champion Bermane Stiverne twice
3. Chris Arreola (in his prime, not the current washed up version)
4. former WBO heavyweight champion Siarhei Liakhovich
5. Eric Molina in his prime
6. Johan Duahapas
7. Artur Szpilka
8. Dominic Breazeale
9. Malik Scott
10. Gerald Washingto

All were ranked in the top 10 by TBRB and/or BoxRec at the time Wilder fought them.

Plus he signed to fight prime Povektin in Russia, but Povektin tested positive for PEDs so it got cancelled.

And no, Dillian Whyte is not good. He is getting worse every single fight.

-he just went the distance with a completely shot Mariusz Wach, who had been stopped by 3 of his previous 5 opponents

-in his previous fight against Oscar Rivas he had the dirty drug test and he cheated by changing his gloves AFTER the glove inspection. Rivas is a completely untested prospect and Whyte needed to cheat AND score a late knockdown to barely win on the cards.

-in the fight before that, he was getting beaten cleanly by 9-loss Dereck Chisora and won with a left hook out of nowhere.

-in the fight before that, as you said, he needed a bad knockdown call off a headbutt to salvage a win against Joseph Parker, who put Whyte on the canvas and had him on dream street in the 12th

In each of his last four fights, Whyte has looked worse. He gets fatter, slower, and closer to losing to bad opposition. He's had three fights in a 12 month span and still managed to put on 30 pounds in that span.

As for the top 10 at heavyweight:
1. Deontay Wilder
2. Tyson Fury
3. Luis Ortiz
4. Anthony Joshua
5. Alexander Povetkin
6. Michael Hunter
7. Andy Ruiz, Jr
9. Filip Hrgovic
10. Adam Kownacki

If Whyte doesn't get beat before his mandatory with Wilder is enforced next year, Wilder will completely obliterate him like he did Breazeale. Whyte is a cheating hypejob.

I did say excluding Ortiz but ok lol. On Stiverne being a world champion is not something I rate anymore Charles Martin was the IBF champ for god sakes and that dude looked worse than some amateur bouts I have been to. Arreloa was a good fighter I agree but he always lost to the tip of the spear. Molina decent cruiserweight sub par Heavyweight. Duahapas in all honesty I just had to look up he sounds decent but losses to Teper & Pianeta don't scream world beater to me. Breazeale a good win seriously? You see what I mean, im not saying those guys are bad fighters but that isn't exactly a list of the creme de la creme.

I guess on that we will just have to agree to disagree, bar the Chisora fights which I think for some reason he gets drawn more in to the mind games with him.

Im sorry but to your Rivas & Chisora comments you are literally complaining that he was loosing a fight and managed to rally for a victory, that doesn't seem like sound logic. Wilder has lost nearly every round of 3 of his last 4 fights but still pulled off two victories and a draw does that make him a bad fighter?

You can't hold that against Whyte he isn't the ref and neither guy got robbed either way.

As for your top 10 I agree on Wilder, Fury and Joshua obviously being above him obviously. Would go with Ortiz and Povetkin above him probably to but after that I would have Whyte.
 
I did say excluding Ortiz but ok lol. On Stiverne being a world champion is not something I rate anymore Charles Martin was the IBF champ for god sakes and that dude looked worse than some amateur bouts I have been to. Arreloa was a good fighter I agree but he always lost to the tip of the spear. Molina decent cruiserweight sub par Heavyweight. Duahapas in all honesty I just had to look up he sounds decent but losses to Teper & Pianeta don't scream world beater to me. Breazeale a good win seriously? You see what I mean, im not saying those guys are bad fighters but that isn't exactly a list of the creme de la creme.

I guess on that we will just have to agree to disagree, bar the Chisora fights which I think for some reason he gets drawn more in to the mind games with him.

Im sorry but to your Rivas & Chisora comments you are literally complaining that he was loosing a fight and managed to rally for a victory, that doesn't seem like sound logic. Wilder has lost nearly every round of 3 of his last 4 fights but still pulled off two victories and a draw does that make him a bad fighter?

You can't hold that against Whyte he isn't the ref and neither guy got robbed either way.

As for your top 10 I agree on Wilder, Fury and Joshua obviously being above him obviously. Would go with Ortiz and Povetkin above him probably to but after that I would have Whyte.
Breazeale was top 10, he took Joshua the same amount of rounds Whyte did, and he was a mandatory challenger (because, unlike Whyte, he didn't duck eliminators like a coward).

And the Rivas and Chisora comments need to be informed by WHO he was fighting. Trailing most of the fight against Ortiz or Fury while you look for the kill is NOT AT ALL the same as getting your ass kicked by a prospect or a journeyman for 8 rounds and then barely scraping out a controversial decision (which he cheated to get in multiple ways in the Rivas fight).

Rivas is a low end prospect, Chisora is a 9 loss fighter.

And again, Whyte gets worse every time. Each of his last 4 performances was way worse than the previous one, and each was against a lesser opponent than the previous one.

If he keeps this up he's going to end up fighting some geezer like Fres Oquendo.
 
I take it no one knew Terrence Crawford was fighting last night. :hehe: I keep telling anyone who will listen: Crawford has talent but is looking good against c list fighters. People saying Porter exposed Spence, well that tends to happen when you go up against competition. Bud got knocked down against a c list fighter. He will be in for a rude awakening when/if he finally does go up against one of the top welters.
 
I take it no one knew Terrence Crawford was fighting last night. :hehe: I keep telling anyone who will listen: Crawford has talent but is looking good against c list fighters. People saying Porter exposed Spence, well that tends to happen when you go up against competition. Bud got knocked down against a c list fighter. He will be in for a rude awakening when/if he finally does go up against one of the top welters.
I didn’t know, thanks. Will try and catch this asap.
 
Tyson Fury is changing trainers 2 months from the Wilder rematch. Something must have happened because they just posted a video on social media of them working the pads together a few days back.

Fury has hired Javan Hill, a disciple of Emmanuel Steward.
 
Breazeale was top 10, he took Joshua the same amount of rounds Whyte did, and he was a mandatory challenger (because, unlike Whyte, he didn't duck eliminators like a coward).

And the Rivas and Chisora comments need to be informed by WHO he was fighting. Trailing most of the fight against Ortiz or Fury while you look for the kill is NOT AT ALL the same as getting your ass kicked by a prospect or a journeyman for 8 rounds and then barely scraping out a controversial decision (which he cheated to get in multiple ways in the Rivas fight).

Rivas is a low end prospect, Chisora is a 9 loss fighter.

And again, Whyte gets worse every time. Each of his last 4 performances was way worse than the previous one, and each was against a lesser opponent than the previous one.

If he keeps this up he's going to end up fighting some geezer like Fres Oquendo.

He is a good athlete that's all I would say, he was just looking to survive against Joshua at the very least Whyte went after him looked for the finish.

He won though you can only be so critical of a win mate, whatever the situation if the dude gets the W that's that.

Rivas was 25-0 going in to that fight im not rating him as a low level prospect just because he lost. On Chisora like iive said tehre does seem to be something between him and Whyte as he gets far too overly drawn in to mind games with him.

Doubt he waits for it but he's got the title shot anyway
“Consistent with the WBC Board of Governors’ Ruling at last October’s 57th WBC Annual Convention, Interim Champion Whyte shall become the Mandatory Challenger of the division immediately after Champion Deontay Wilder’s mandatory defence against current Mandatory Challenger Tyson Fury, with the mandatory defence against Whyte being due on or about February of 2021.”
 
Whyte is a fat PED cheat that gets worse every time out, and if he's dumb enough to step in there with Wilder he's getting one-hit KO'd like Breazeale.
 
I take it no one knew Terrence Crawford was fighting last night. :hehe: I keep telling anyone who will listen: Crawford has talent but is looking good against c list fighters. People saying Porter exposed Spence, well that tends to happen when you go up against competition. Bud got knocked down against a c list fighter. He will be in for a rude awakening when/if he finally does go up against one of the top welters.

I did (and lost money smh) but I agree. He's definitely talented, but I never thought he was as good Spence. Of course fighting someone you really don't want to be fighting can make you look bad too (Joshua & Fury are recent examples).

Spence, and Porter for that matter, would be tough fights for him. Errol in particular puts tactical pressure on guys as well as I've seen in a long time. Crawford also has this thing where he smiles or sticks his tongue out every time he gets hit with a good shot. I suspect he would get hit with a lot of good shots against top level competition, and they don't tend to stop throwing either so he might want to get that under control...
 
I did (and lost money smh) but I agree. He's definitely talented, but I never thought he was as good Spence. Of course fighting someone you really don't want to be fighting can make you look bad too (Joshua & Fury are recent examples).

Spence, and Porter for that matter, would be tough fights for him. Errol in particular puts tactical pressure on guys as well as I've seen in a long time. Crawford also has this thing where he smiles or sticks his tongue out every time he gets hit with a good shot. I suspect he would get hit with a lot of good shots against top level competition, and they don't tend to stop throwing either so he might want to get that under control...
Agreed. His defense is not good. He gets way to often. If he thinks Gamboa rocked him, imagine what Porter would do to him. And now there are rumors that he is talking about going up in weight to fight Canelo...............if that's true that is horrible advice from his managers. No way is he ready for that. He has fought no one at 147 but now you want to fight a guy who just won a title at Light Heavyweight?
 
NW5Pr6I.png


Julio Cesar Chavez Sr's look of disgust at his son.

Chavez Jr:
-failed a drug test, but got the whole fight moved to a different state and then got a legal injunction keeping the athletic commission from putting a stop to it
-came in a 173 pounds for a 168 pound fight, probably weighed upwards of 190 in the ring, but Danny Jacobs is a boss and agreed to fight him anyway
-started losing, made up hand/nose injuries and quit on his stool
-his fanbase showered the ring with garbage, hitting commentators
-Michael Buffer just straight up left before announcing the result

What a disaster.
 
Can't understand why that guy is still getting big fights. He's been doing this for years, coming in blown up and/or quitting. Shameful to his father's legacy and name.

On another note, probably more excited for this Harrison-Charlo 2 fight then I should be. But I'll be tuned in, hopefully all the tough talk leads to an exciting bout...
 
...and it did!! Even though I thought the ref should've stopped it after the 2nd knockdown of the 11th, it was a much better fight. Very exciting but still technical bout, wouldn't mind a third match.
 

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