Gotham The Official Gotham News and discussion thread - Part 1

[Hunter Rider]

I thought the pilot hit the spot, looks great, has the atmosphere spot on and is already intriguing, my only gripe would be the route they have gone with Alfred, but other than I loved it.

 

[antsman41]

For some reason, with 25 years of reading comics... this episode made me finally question where the hell/why the hell wasn't Alfred around the night the Wayne's were murdered. At least Nolan cheated wit the whole train ride into town to make the Wayne's more grounded...

But, yeah.

 

[squeekness]

It was alright.

This is me. It was just okay, nothing to jump up and down about. I might watch one more, but so far, there are much better shows out there to waste my time on. I was hoping for better.

 

[shauner111]

OK im done. Here's my thoughts, spoilers included..

I haved mixed feelings. Ill keep watching since im curious and a couple of characters have potential. Plus it's Batman related, in live-action, so i just have to keep watching.

But i thought some of the acting and dialogue was hammy. Some scenes were trying to be too "hip". The intro was bad. Rushed and poorly acted. Bruce's scream was dumb. But then it gets better because Gordon/Bullock are introduced..

I like how Bullock, Montoya and Allen are present. It's good to see a couple of these characters finally. They're fine. I dont really care about Bullock, but that's not an issue. He's always been a character that's somewhere in the middle. Gordon is fine and so is Cobblepot (they're the reasons ill continue).

The little Riddler cameo was pointless, same with little Poison Ivy. Why is Selina everywhere in the right place? I really can't stand these villain nods. It's totally forced and this show would be so much better without them. I have zero interest in this Nygma and why the hell did they change Pamela Isley's name to something goofier like "Ivy Pepper". If you're going to change something from the mythos, change it to make it more believable, not the other way around.

Jada Pinkett Smith as Fish Mooney was fine. A bit hammy in places but it didn't bother me. She won't last past this season, and honestly the mob is the thing this show should be centered around anyway. Carmine Falcone makes an appearance and that was alright as well. I heard Batista from Dexter will appear as Maroni soon, so the gangsters are looking to be the brighter part of this series.

Penguin has the potential to be the demented, but hilarious pain in the ass of the show. I liked the guys acting. We basically got his origin story here.

Barbara was very plain, meh.

Alfred is an A-Hole here. He's a bit of a hardass in the few scenes he's in. It's not my Alfred that's for sure. I felt zero sympathy from him towards Bruce. More like he was more worried about their public image. Telling Bruce, who is in shock at the crime scene, to basically walk away with his head held up so they don't see him crying. I wish Michael Caine was there to kick this Alfreds ass and give this kid a damn hug!

The head of this show once said that the kid who plays Bruce is the best actor to play this character, adult or child. That's ridiculous. He's fine. I have no complaints, but he's nothing special. That intro wasn't his fault though.

Gotham's look is good. The music they chose was out of place but i do like the visual of this city. Nothing mind blowing but it served its purpose. But damnit, did Burton sneak in or something?? Because this pilot ends with two characters: Selina Kyle looking down on something and has Penguin looking a little bit freaky while coming out of water!!

 

[Lilbaz]

Said this in the Alfred thread. I didn't see anything wrong with it. It's how the Brits are especially an ex soldier. You don't show your emotion in public especially crying (the only exception allowed is when watching soccer).

Their relationship will grow over the course of the series.

 

[TheNextNolan22]

Said this in the Alfred thread. I didn't see anything wrong with it. It's how the Brits are especially an ex soldier. You don't show your emotion in public especially crying (the only exception allowed is when watching soccer).

Their relationship will grow over the course of the series.

I chalked it up to him helping Bruce put on a public facade already.

 

[Mindreaper21]

There are many mixed feelings so far, though the upside to all of this is that it's a different view of the story and it helps to build the Batman mythos. Be that we like something or not, there's always at least one idea that inspires another writer. It's the ones that take the risks that can end up doing something legendary.

 

[SuperBatman]

I have a feeling the show will get better. Pilots are pretty much hard to judge a series just by a pilot and even a 1st season. Overall I liked the pilot. Especially the penguin I'll keep watching it.

 

[Human Torch]

Eh,I just spent an hour posting a review on my blog and for whatever reason lost the whole ********* thing.


So instead of detailed excerpts,I'll just touch base on my thoughts:


Penguin stole the show.He could be the hook that keeps me interested.

The cast was generally good all around.Couldn't dig Bullock though.He couldn't top the B:TAS version,and he didn't even come close.He's also corrupt,apparently.The B:TAS version was "unpleasant" but hardly corrupt.

I hated Selina witnessing the murder.No need to get cute.The universe doesn't need to be THAT small.

Alfred-meh.Not the version I prefer.But it's early yet.He may grow on me.

Nigma working for the police.

The "Barbara's explosive secret" potboiler is gonna get old fast,I'm predicting.

Didn't like the Waynes killed "for no reason".

So,kinda a mixed bag.I liked the first half a lot,they started to lose me about halfway through,but I'll give it a chance.

 

[The Shape]

Pilots are typically underwhelming (for me, at least). There's just so much that has t come across in a network pilot episode, so much that has to be introduced/established. Plus, we'd all essentially seen the entire pilot episode anyway through clips, previews, and behind-the-scenes looks.

But I have faith that this show will grow and wind uo being pretty damn great. The pilot was a solid start.

 

[SlamAdams]

I liked it. I'll stick around. I still wish that the death of the Wayne's came in the first season finale rather the pilot. Build up the Wayne's, show what they did for the city, develop young Hush as a character.

 

[LurkNoMore]

I really enjoyed the Gotham pilot, especially considering that it was a pilot. With the exception of Lost, which had the highest quality pilot episode in the history of television, most pilots tend to be the weakest episode of a series until the eventual shark jumping episode three quarters of the way through its run.

I really like the cast:
- Camren Bicondova as Selina Kyle has the attitude and physicality of the role down, but it’s interesting how the show has kept her scenes very close to the vest and haven’t revealed much of her performance as compared to all of the other characters. Next week’s episode devoted to her character (I’m assuming it will be as the title of the episode is ‘Selina Kyle&#8217 should be interesting.
- David Mazouz as young Bruce Wayne, as the episode developed, turned in a very convincing portrait of a very young and innocent boy who, though deeply wounded, had made the decision by episode’s end that he would never be a victim again. He convinced me that he could one day become the Batman.
- Ben McKenzie as Jim Gordon was a little unintentionally stiff in some of the quieter scenes and seems a bit indimidated by the very talented Donal Logue, but I believe he will settle into this role beautifully over the next few episodes. He has the intensity required for the role and is playing the fish out of water angle nicely.
- Donal Logue as Harvey Bullock was awesome! This could have been, in the hands of a lesser actor, a very unlikeable/unwatchable character, and even though he was given some of the most awkward expositional dialogue he came across as the most real and relatable person on the show.
- Sean Pertwee as Alfred Pennyworth portrayed the kind of Alfred I like. Not just as a loving nurturer to Bruce, but also his primary guide to becoming the tough-minded man that Bruce would have to become to dawn the cape and cowel and cow the city's criminal elements through not only violent retribution, but also through his sheer force of will. He’s even more jaded and sarcastic than I expected, but it’s good to have a fresh take on the character in a live-action production.
- Jada Pinket Smith as Fish Mooney was much better than I thought she would be, though my doubt was based more on her unkonwn character rather than the actress’ talent. She came across as a genuine threat to anyone who crosses her.
- Robin Lorde Taylor as Oswald Cobblepot/Penguin did some really wonderful work here, making a sniveling, sickly, unattractive, and violent psychopath into a likeable character. I’m still trying to figure out how he’s accomplished that, but he has.
- Cory Michael Smith as Edward Nigma showed potential, but seemed a little over the top and a bit too on the nose, and Harvey Bullock’s expositional dialogue with the Nigma character was a bit painful. I think he could be good in the role; I liked his hurt double take when Jim effortlessly and casually solved the ‘nothing’ riddle before Nigma could even finish asking it.
- John Doman as Carmine Falcone was awesome! I loved how he didn’t play the role as the stereotypical (for Hollywood) Italian mobster; “If’n yous don’t get in line, people’s gonna get hurt. Know what I’m sayin’?”, but rather played Falcone as a very erudite and sophisticated political player as much as a mobster, pulling the strings of everyone in the city. Nicely done.
- The rest of the cast…I don’t care enough about any of the rest to comment yet, but I didn’t notice any truly painful acting from any of them.

The cinematography was really terrific and the set design is truly theatrical-release quality.

The writing, at this point, is the weakest link and needs to be tightened up. It’s kind of like a David Goyer script; there are flashes of brilliance followed immediately by outright hackery (I’m referring mainly to the dialogue).

This show has the potential to become the best comic book based television ever produced. It’s not groundbreaking outside of the comic book genre; it’s no Hannibal, Breaking Bad, or Game of Thrones, but it’s super solid and entertaining television.

 

[Travesty]

We'll see, I'll keep watching, but right now, I just find it to be ok. Nothing great, but not terrible.

One thing I didn't like at all, was the up close shots of Gordon when he was running. I've seen plenty of movies and TV shows do that, but it was so bad here, it really took me out for a second. I hope they don't do that again.

 

[SlamAdams]

Even though this has been known for awhile that Riddler would the ME, it is a strange choice considering how many doctors are in Batman's rogue's gallery. Someone like Dr. Fries of Dr. Hellfren (Dr. Death) would be more appropriate.

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

''That pill head loony bird!''

God bless Donal Logue for at least trying to pull that off.

 

[Doctor Jones]

This pilot... God.

Am I the only one who thought this was awful? Typically pilots get the pass from me because they still have yet to find their footing, but I give those the pass because there's usually a lot of stuff that I not only like but what is actually well done, hence the potential. This pilot had potential, but I was let down in almost every way.

But this? The writing was awful. Even Logue's Bullock is disappointing. The dialogue is about as subtle as a sledge hammer, the acting just downright hammy at times.

Haha he said riddle! Get it? Because he's gonna be The Riddler some day! The contrived future villains became pretty much what I feared. Contrived. I really liked Taylor's Copplepot, but he was overshadowed by the bad quality of everything else.

Seriously? An adult wrote this? I enjoy finally seeing Bullock, Montoya, Allen, and Kean as much as the next Batman fan, but ****, if this is going to be the quality in which they're represented, then what's the point? Why should I enjoy this? I can't believe I'm saying this, but I kept checking the clock hoping it would reach nine.

The only thing to be praised is the look. My God, there were times where I said, "That's Gotham City!" It looks spot on. I love the GCPD. Perfect. It has that Se7en feel to it which I adore. This series is shot very well. But unfortunately, scenes with Gordon and Kean, and Montoya and Kean, made me realize this is just typical network television dressed up very well using Gotham as its gimmick. Again, an adult wrote that Montoya/Kean scene. Talk about awful dialogue with stilted direction and acting to cater to what was written.

A part of me wants to watch the second episode because there's some germ of hope that this can get better. Or I'm just blinded by the same way how I thought the pilot could have been good. So why should I care to watch next week? Hopefully the staff writers are better, but why should I try to carve out time at 8 o'clock every week out of my busy schedule when I just think it could be like what I just saw?

This should have been on HBO. Or Cable. Some place where there might be some semblance of not just people looking at Agent of SHIELD and going, "Look that worked! People love Batman! Let's do our own Batman show!"

 

[DrMylesOBoogie]

I really liked the cast. Everyone nailed their parts. The exceptions being Alfred, Barbara and Montoya. I just didn't like how their characters are represented. The hints of

Spoiler

Barbara and Montoya's past relationship

seems very rushed and almost a case of the writers being insecure about having supporting characters that don't have shocking subplots happening. This occurs a lot in TV and hurts shows. Chloe Sullivan in Smallville, Tara in True Blood bounced around different big stories to justify their spot on their shows but very little of the plotting made sense. I fear that's the case here.

Penguin, Gordon, Bullock and Falcone were spot on. I hope we get more of Bruce adn Selina. I found myself wanting to know what they were up to. They need to soften Alfred. I despised his character in this. The swag when he walks and the dour expression on his face. He's better as the softer father figure. Bruce is the angry one. There's no dynamic if they're both miserable.

 

[Travesty]

''That pill head loony bird!''

God bless Donal Logue for at least trying to pull that off.

Ha, when I heard that, I just thought, "loony bird?".

Yeah, that was pretty bad.

 

[DigificWriter]

Am I the only one who thought this was awful?

No, but you are mistaken in feeling that way.

 

[Doctor Jones]

No, but you are mistaken in feeling that way.

Checking back in the past pages, I seem to be. What is the general consensus? Is it partly because this is a Batman related show with a lot of expectation surrounding it, people aren't willing to admit that it really isn't that good? I get a feeling that it disappointed some people but won't go past saying, "It was okay" or care to analyze its glaring problems. So far here at least, I'm just hearing positive things or people saying, "It's not awful." I don't know. It's pretty wishy-washy here. I'd like to see other facets of these opinions.

It's fine if people like it though. But come on, despite pilots at some points able to get the pass because they're the pilot, the whole other point of pilots is that they're supposed to impress me and want me to keep watching. This pilot didn't do that.

 

[Kane52630]

I liked the pilot, it's got a lot of promise. My only complaint for it would be the some of the unsubtle dialogue and cramming in every character and plot line into one episode. But I get it, it's a pilot. Most shows do that all the time. I hope we get to see what the show is really like in the next episode when the dust settles.

I really enjoyed Ben and Donald as Gordon and Bullock, great chemistry there. Fish Mooney and Oswald did a great job being those pulpy villains. And the person who I thought stole the show was Doman as Faclone, he definitely brought his experience from The Wire on to that show.

As expected, the city itself was incredible, it's the closest thing we'll get to a live action BTAS. People complain about cellphones being in the show yet somehow forget BTAS had computers, tvs, and robots. It's meant to be a timeless atmosphere and I think they got it right.

 

[TheNextNolan22]

Positioned against Monday Night Football, the season premiere of “The Big Bang Theory,” the season premiere of “The Voice” and “Dancing with the Stars,” FOX’s new drama “Gotham” was not given a shortcut to a successful launch. It was asked to open in what will likely emerge as the most competitive timeslot on television.
Given that, the origins drama performed well.


Monday’s series premiere delivered a 5.7 overnight household rating. While that falls well below the marks posted by “Big Bang” (11.1), “The Voice” (8.5 for its two hour premiere; rating for the 8-9PM portion not yet available) and “Dancing with the Stars” (7.9 from 8-10PM), it represents a very respectable number for a FOX launch.
And insofar as the show is expected to skew in the direction of younger audiences, a solid adults 18-49 rating–and certainly one that beats that of “Dancing”–should emerge when the fast nationals come out later Tuesday morning.

http://headlineplanet.com/home/2014/09/23/ratings-gotham-starts-decently-sleepy-hollow-stumbles/

 

[The Shape]

Not sure why FOX felt they had to position Gotham against Monday Night Football....

 

[SlamAdams]

Checking back in the past pages, I seem to be. What is the general consensus? Is it partly because this is a Batman related show with a lot of expectation surrounding it, people aren't willing to admit that it really isn't that good? I get a feeling that it disappointed some people but won't go past saying, "It was okay" or care to analyze its glaring problems. So far here at least, I'm just hearing positive things or people saying, "It's not awful." I don't know. It's pretty wishy-washy here. I'd like to see other facets of these opinions.

I think expectations were pretty low. Batman show without Batman was lampooned constantly.

It's fine if people like it though. But come on, despite pilots at some points able to get the pass because they're the pilot, the whole other point of pilots is that they're supposed to impress me and want me to keep watching. This pilot didn't do that.

its broadcast tv, they don't aim to impress. They aim for the middle.

 

[kguillou]

This pilot was pretty on par with Arrow's pilot imo. Pretty good, not great, rushed plot, hammy dialogue (and boy, Arrow had some CHEESY dialogue) but ultimately had compelling characters, great atmosphere and a great premise with lots of room for potential.