The Ongoing Serie A, La Liga, All English Football, Champions League Thread - - - - - - - - - - Part 19

[Hunter Rider]

Marko Marin has gone on loan from Chelsea to Sevilla.

Roma's President says De Rossi is up for sale, in fact he says everyone is.

Tbh, I don't even know. I've grown fed up of thinking of potential players I'd like to see brought in because the liklihood is we'd just flirt with them, show no intent and instead identify them for our rivals to snap up. I've also lost so much interest in the game lately I really have no idea what's going on anymore, nor do I have any incline to get interested again.

That's a shame man, is it due to how things have been handled at Arsenal over the last 8 years?

I understand that but wasn't buttner bought to replace evra , and again he has never really had a chance. Baines is a great player I'm not disputing that, it just again united are putting a sticking plaster over a minor nick while the open wound of the midfield is ignored.

Buttner is a cheap back-up, nothing more. If we don't buy two CM's I'll be right there with you mate, but all reports suggest we have done all we can to land Thiago and we supposedly made a bid yesterday for Kondogbia while we also are strongly linked with Strootman.

 

[Van Petrol]

That's a shame man, is it due to how things have been handled at Arsenal over the last 8 years?

Pretty much. I can understand the restrictions and hindrances given the stadium debt and the arrival of the sugar daddies over the years. But what I can't stand is the dishonesty and exploitation the club has shown to their own fans over the years. Pricing out the true fans in favour of the corporate schmucks who haven't got a clue. Charging the highest prices at a premium of all the clubs and showing no intent to improve. Being greeted with a cold couldn't care less attitude when those fans who pay their hard earn money question the club's direction, intent and actions. As well as having the blame shifted onto them for not supporting the club by the hacks at the top when things have gone **** up.

In many ways I've become disgusted by the club, almost to the point where it doesn't bother me in the slightest whether we win, lose or draw. It's one of the reasons that for a while now and for the foreseeable future I refuse to buy any more merchandise and go to any more games.

Wenger and the club have yet another chance this summer to put their money where their mouths are and show the intent that they have banged on about for so long. If they think signing one £20m player as an appeasement action is going to be sufficient enough, then I think they are sorely mistaken.

 

[B]

I honestly can't see Ronaldo leaving madrid, and I'm surprised there's so much speculation. With moyes now in charge of Man UTD, it's even less incentive.

I believe perez when he says ronnie will retire at madrid, with the exception of course if he feels like playing in the mls ever, as I could see him loving the american dream.

I don't feel he'd move to MLS, certainly not now when he is just about to hit the peak of his career, I also don't think moves to Russian, Chinese or any other mega rich countries/teams with poor standard leagues would appeal to him.

I don't feel he'd sign for City or Chelsea because of the respect he has for Manchester United, I feel if he is going to leave Madrid, which is a possibility if Madrid are trying to make him take a cut in wages or whatever they are doing that is giving him problems with his contract, he will either go to PSG or return to Manchester United.

Moyes being the manager won't effect his reasons for joining the club anymore than Mourinho leaving Real Madrid have effected his reasons for staying or leaving Real Madrid. + Ferguson still will be in & around the club, he just won't be giving the tactical instructions anymore.. however I'm sure if the boys are playing **** he'll pop down to give them a duel hairdryer with Moyes.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Pretty much. I can understand the restrictions and hindrances given the stadium debt and the arrival of the sugar daddies over the years. But what I can't stand is the dishonesty and exploitation the club has shown to their own fans over the years. Pricing out the true fans in favour of the corporate schmucks who haven't got a clue. Charging the highest prices at a premium of all the clubs and showing no intent to improve. Being greeted with a cold couldn't care less attitude when those fans who pay their hard earn money question the club's direction, intent and actions. As well as having the blame shifted onto them for not supporting the club by the hacks at the top when things have gone **** up.

In many ways I've become disgusted by the club, almost to the point where it doesn't bother me in the slightest whether we win, lose or draw. It's one of the reasons that for a while now and for the foreseeable future I refuse to buy any more merchandise and go to any more games.

Wenger and the club have yet another chance this summer to put their money where their mouths are and show the intent that they have banged on about for so long. If they think signing one £20m player as an appeasement action is going to be sufficient enough, then I think they are sorely mistaken.

I wont patronize you and claim to fully understand mate, I've been frustrated over the debt and the fact we've lost out on multiple top players as well as the inexplicable refusal to sort midfield out, but we've never been told "4th place is as good as a trophy, you're ungrateful." That to me was a disgrace to the long time fans the club was built on, it was an open admittance of limited ambition while still charging top dollar for the privilege.

Out of curiosity, what would they need to do this summer to fully convince you change was indeed here? I mean no one can guarantee a trophy but what would make you feel like everything had been done to give Arsenal the best shot at winning something?

 

[BatmanBeyond]

Marko Marin has gone on loan from Chelsea to Sevilla.

Roma's President says De Rossi is up for sale, in fact he says everyone is.

Can United pleaaaaase sign him up?

 

[Darthphere]

Does De Rossi get his shirts custom made with the one long sleeve or does he do that himself?

 

[Van Petrol]

I wont patronize you and claim to fully understand mate, I've been frustrated over the debt and the fact we've lost out on multiple top players as well as the inexplicable refusal to sort midfield out, but we've never been told "4th place is as good as a trophy, you're ungrateful." That to me was a disgrace to the long time fans the club was built on, it was an open admittance of limited ambition while still charging top dollar for the privilege.

Agreed. It was a real insult and kick in the nuts to those that have supported the club throughout the years, good and bad, to be almost literally smacked in the face when asking questions about what the clubs intentions and direction for the forseeable future were. The outgoing chairman may have done many good things for the club, but I just can't bring myself to acknowledge it or him after that massive lack of respect he showed.
Even if we just attempted to show the same kind of intent and will that Fergie breeded into his players to aspire and achieve despite the shortcomings, I think most of the consensus would have been more than happy and content.

Out of curiosity, what would they need to do this summer to fully convince you change was indeed here? I mean no one can guarantee a trophy but what would make you feel like everything had been done to give Arsenal the best shot at winning something?

Just show some intent to improve and make a real go at trying to aspire to be the best. None of this 4th place is a trophy crap, while trying to justify it by extorting the very people who pretty much keep them employed and pampered in their jobs.

Get rid of the deadwood leeches, don't let our better players go and bring in top proven quality rather than a few bargain buys to just make up the numbers. They also need to sort out the wage structure and get tough on the underachievers. Some of the crod within the squad have it too easy and are on ridiculous wages for what they're worth. Wenger also needs to let Bould have access to sorting the defence out too. It's already proven that he has had an effect on them.

 

[Hunter Rider]

UK sports pages hit a new low this weekend with stories about Torres to Arsenal, Fred and Cardozo to City and best of all, Messi to United.

Can United pleaaaaase sign him up?

At 29 I think it's too late for us to be considering him. Looks like we will miss out on Thiago as well.

Does De Rossi get his shirts custom made with the one long sleeve or does he do that himself?

I was wondering what the deal was with that myself.

Agreed. It was a real insult and kick in the nuts to those that have supported the club throughout the years, good and bad, to be almost literally smacked in the face when asking questions about what the clubs intentions and direction for the forseeable future were. The outgoing chairman may have done many good things for the club, but I just can't bring myself to acknowledge it or him after that massive lack of respect he showed.
Even if we just attempted to show the same kind of intent and will that Fergie breeded into his players to aspire and achieve despite the shortcomings, I think most of the consensus would have been more than happy and content.

I agree, for real fans it's about the intent even if things don't quite pan out, but when the people running the club, a club with a great hsitory and successful one to boot, comes out and tells fans to be grateful with 4th place because of a stadium they chose to build and then charge fans the earth to get into, it's arguably the worst PR move in the history of the game.

Just show some intent to improve and make a real go at trying to aspire to be the best. None of this 4th place is a trophy crap, while trying to justify it by extorting the very people who pretty much keep them employed and pampered in their jobs.

Get rid of the deadwood leeches, don't let our better players go and bring in top proven quality rather than a few bargain buys to just make up the numbers. They also need to sort out the wage structure and get tough on the underachievers. Some of the crod within the squad have it too easy and are on ridiculous wages for what they're worth. Wenger also needs to let Bould have access to sorting the defence out too. It's already proven that he has had an effect on them.

I agree with you on this, Arsenal really are like a backed up bowel when it comes to some of the players you have stockpiled that are no good, a summer enema should sort that out and free up the wages for the better signings.

When you say sort out the wage structure do you mean start paying by a player to player basis instead of missing out on quality because of a ceiling cap? I think Wenger has shown intent by going for Higuain amidst the insane prices Falcao and Cavani are going for.

 

[Two-Face]

Messi to Man Utd? Get the **** out here... Lol

 

[Darthphere]

It's Richard Padwick Messi.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Link? I got to see this.

 

[Darthphere]

Ok, maybe I'm going to be called crazy but at this point, even with a great showing in the Confederations Cup, I'm still not convinced with Neymar. Having said that, watch him score a hat trick in the final now.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Well Neymar played well tonight to cap off a good tournament, but the big test is next year, specifically in the CL. I'm not convinced he'll gel with Messi on the ego front.

Brazil used the crowd support tonight and they played out of their skins, Luiz and Thiago Silva were great in defense and Paulinho and Gustavo mopped up the midfield while Neymar and Fred did the business in front of goal. Their weakest link is Hulk and I think Scholari will be hoping Lucas Moura has a good season at PSG to get him ready for the World Cup.

 

[Hunter Rider]

 

[B]

I'm still not convinced of Neymar either despite having a decent Confederations Cup. No denying he is talented that's for sure, however I don't think he has the star power to carry a team & drag them across the finish line when they aren't playing well..

Robinho came out of Brazil & Santos with a very similar reputation when he went to Madrid & he didn't have half the impact he was expected to have. He wasn't poor by any means, but he was expected to be the next Brazilian Ronaldo.

 

[chamber-music]

I think someone should tell Wenger instead of taking spending the odd 4 or 5 million on average players he should save that money he might spend on 4 of those players and buy one quality player for 15 million +. A smaller squad made up of some higher priced top quality players and some of the young up and coming talent that Wenger likes.

The up and coming younger players will gain experience and learn from the more established players and eventually replace them when the established players get to the end of their time at the club if the younger players are good enough.

This is something similar to what Wenger used to do but stopped doing a while ago now.

 

[Two-Face]

David Moyes arrives at Manchester United as club appoints new coaches

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/jul/01/david-moyes-starts-work-manchester-united-manager

 

[kit1982]

Jesus Christ, we've spent £1 million on a player for the first time since 2006, I'm in complete shock!

I thought Neymar has been fantastic this tournament, but I'm about as willing to put him up there with Messi after a few good games as I was to say he was overated after 2 cack games against England.
Vialli was class again on the Beeb coverage, one thing I've noticed with the beeb pundits, if they're an English 9/10 they will laud over Shearer. However whenever they get a Seedorf, Vialli or another foreigner they laud over Lineker. Just interesting how highly rated Lineker is on the continent as on MOTD he's usually the butt of jokes.

 

[Darthphere]

Alexi Lalas was embarrassing last night on ESPN's coverage of this game. He kept going on and on about how Brazil would've benefited more if they lost because "adversity" or whatever. Alexi Lalas is an embarrassment to soccer analysis. Keep him away from international tournaments please. Steve McManaman has to be thinking "How the hell do I get stuck with this idiot."

 

[Hunter Rider]

David Moyes arrives at Manchester United as club appoints new coaches

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/jul/01/david-moyes-starts-work-manchester-united-manager

And so it truly begins........

Jesus Christ, we've spent £1 million on a player for the first time since 2006, I'm in complete shock!

I thought Neymar has been fantastic this tournament, but I'm about as willing to put him up there with Messi after a few good games as I was to say he was overated after 2 cack games against England.
Vialli was class again on the Beeb coverage, one thing I've noticed with the beeb pundits, if they're an English 9/10 they will laud over Shearer. However whenever they get a Seedorf, Vialli or another foreigner they laud over Lineker. Just interesting how highly rated Lineker is on the continent as on MOTD he's usually the butt of jokes.

Who have you bought mate?

I love Vialli, he's a total class act, easily one of the most likable guys in football. He was also the only one who had any actual understanding of how Brazil had shut Spain down. The two Alan's just sat there looking bemused, repeating the same stuff about Spain not passing it well.

 

[Darthphere]

Bayern and Brazil showed the world how you beat Spain (and Barcelona). You press them. You suffocate them into giving up possession and then you run at them. Spain's defense is pretty terrible and I think I've been vocal about how overrated I think Casillas is. Brazil 3-0 against Spain and Bayern 4-0 and 3-0 against Barcelona. You press them, stick to them like white on rice they don't know what to do, especially since they have no center forward that they could hoof the ball up to hold up the play when under pressure. Too many teams come out and try to park the bus against Spain and Barca and while that has been successful at times, its not very effective.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Bayern and Brazil showed the world how you beat Spain (and Barcelona). You press them. You suffocate them into giving up possession and then you run at them. Spain's defense is pretty terrible and I think I've been vocal about how overrated I think Casillas is. Brazil 3-0 against Spain and Bayern 4-0 and 3-0 against Barcelona. You press them, stick to them like white on rice they don't know what to do, especially since they have no center forward that they could hoof the ball up to hold up the play when under pressure. Too many teams come out and try to park the bus against Spain and Barca and while that has been successful at times, its not very effective.

Agreed, the key elements to building a team to do this is two powerful but mobile and technically good CM's, and at least 2 players that can break at speed and do the damage when the CM's hound Xavi and Busquets off the ball.

 

[Two-Face]

And so it truly begins........

It's gonna hit me hard in August when we play Wigan at Wembley when I'm expecting SAF near the touchline.

 

[kit1982]

Luke Murphy from Crewe, after Nick Powell and Westwood he's been their highest rated player for a while. Really exciting stuff, Blackburn offered £1 million and £30,000 a week but McDermott's worked his magic and he's decided to come here.

Totally agree on Vialli, lovely bloke and he new his stuff. TBH the usual pundits on the BBC are so clueless they seem to have no concept of football outside the PL, they desperately need new blood. Some good younger pundits like Le Saux, Dixon and Gavin Peacock (who actually knew his ****) have all been moved on to pander the egos of Lawro and Hansen. I always find it telling how much guys like Seedorf and Leonardo really show them up whenever they're on it. Hell 'Arry was made to sound like a genius during the euro's.

 

[Van Petrol]

I agree, for real fans it's about the intent even if things don't quite pan out, but when the people running the club, a club with a great hsitory and successful one to boot, comes out and tells fans to be grateful with 4th place because of a stadium they chose to build and then charge fans the earth to get into, it's arguably the worst PR move in the history of the game.

Agreed, it's a real slap in the face.

I agree with you on this, Arsenal really are like a backed up bowel when it comes to some of the players you have stockpiled that are no good, a summer enema should sort that out and free up the wages for the better signings.

When you say sort out the wage structure do you mean start paying by a player to player basis instead of missing out on quality because of a ceiling cap? I think Wenger has shown intent by going for Higuain amidst the insane prices Falcao and Cavani are going for.

A summer enema has been long overdue, but they've shot themselves in the foot by putting the wasters on ridiculous wages, and thus are unable to move them on as potential new suitors aren't prepared to pay those wages, and the mercenaries are more than happy to sit it out just to get their paychecks. Yeah, it's a socialist wage structure to try and put everyone on a level to even playing firled, but that often means paying someone more than what they are worthy of, and then paying someone who is worth more nothing compared to what they'd get elsewhere.

Until he's hoilding a shirt on the main site, I'm not buying it. We seem to be dragging our feet, and we've seen this before where a player seemed nailed on to join us, we've dragged it out, and then someone else has come along and snapped them up (i.e. Juan Mata).