The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 24

[Gamma Goliath]

I would hope marvel has a game plan to restructure a deal with Sony.

 

[Iceman]

I'm sure they do.

 

[Detective Conan]

No way in heck Sony is going to make a sustainable cinematic universe with just Venom alone, especially when you consider what’s in Sony’s character arsenal. Lest anyone forgot Ghost Rider was a box offfice success and got a sequel which bombed because of the bad taste left from the previous Ghost Rider film. Venom’s success(largely its opening weekend) was largely driven by the curiosity factor of the film as well as the popularity of the Venom character who sort of looks like a demented, evil version of Spider-Man. And here’s perhaps my strongest point: Sony is at a disadvantage because the rest of the characters that they can use for their cinematic universe come nowhere near the popularity/recognizability of Venom, so if they make a crappy movie about say Morbius or Jackpot then there’s zero chance those movies do well since unlike Venom they can’t bank on the popularity of those characters to sell tickets. Which means they have to do the Marvel Studios thing of making good movies out of B or C characters that gets the audience interested( i.e Guardians Of The Galaxy) which is something Sony has never shown the ability to do at all.

Plus, I bet you audiences will be like “fool me once shame on me, fool me twice shame on you” to the sequel(if it’s ever made) and the sequel will underperform significantly( like what happened with Ghost Rider with its sequel). Yes, I am aware a lot of folks liked the Venom film but even most people who saw the film wouldn’t exactly call it a great movie or a classic. They’d likely be more in the “that was fun” or “that was better than I expected it to be” camp which doesn’t immediately make that many people eager to see a sequel.

No matter what, I just can’t see Sony successfully building a shared universe like Marvel has. Which is why I still expect Spidey to be in the MCU for a long time to come.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

No way in heck Sony is going to make a sustainable cinematic universe with just Venom alone, especially when you consider what’s in Sony’s character arsenal. Lest anyone forgot Ghost Rider was a box offfice success and got a sequel which bombed because of the bad taste left from the previous Ghost Rider film. Venom’s success(largely its opening weekend) was largely driven curiosity factor of the film as well as the popularity of the Venom character who sort of looks like a demented, evil version of Spider-Man. And here’s perhaps my strongest point: Sony is at a disadvantage because the rest of the characters that they can use for their cinematic universe come nowhere near the popularity/recognizability of Venom, so if they make a crappy movie about say Morbius or Jackpot then there’s zero chance those movies do well since unlike Venom they can’t bank on the popularity of those characters to sell tickets. Which means they have to pull of the Marvel Studios thing of making good movies of B or C characters that gets the audience interested( i.e Guardians Of The Galaxy) which is something Sony has never shown the ability to do at all.

Plus, I bet you audiences will be like “fool me once shame on me, fool me twice shame on you” to the sequel(if it’s ever made) and the sequel will underperform significantly. Yes, I’m aware a lot of folks like the Venom film but even most people who saw the film wouldn’t exactly call it a great movie or a classic. They’d likely be more in the “that was fun” or “that was better than I expected it to be” camp which doesn’t immediately make that many people eager to see a sequel.

No matter what, I just can’t see Sony successfully building a shared universe like Marvel has.

On one hand, you are totally correct with what you say. On the other hand, Sony is run by idiots and will try anyways.

 

[Iceman]

I can't see Sony maintaining it for long either. There is no universe here, just Spidey and his supporting characters. It would be just as hard with any big single character. And most of the characters they have are villains. They aren't seriously going to turn them all into anti-heroes are they?

 

[Darkprime]

On one hand, you are totally correct with what you say. On the other hand, Sony is run by idiots and will try anyways.

Which is why Sony's Marvel division needs to merge with Marvel Studios and report to Feige so he can stop this madness. As Iger said. There shouldn't be two Marvel's.

 

[Darkprime]

I can't see Sony maintaining it for long either. There is no universe here, just Spidey and his supporting characters. It would be just as hard with any big single character. And most of the characters they have are villains. They aren't seriously going to turn them all into anti-heroes are they?

I think they probably know their time with the Spider-Man rights is coming to an end and theyre trying to making as much $$$ as possible by throwing ideas at the wall and seeing what sticks. Ive said it before I think we're a few years at away tops before we see marvel get the rights back in full. Depending on what happens next year after Far From Home when Disney/Marvel and Sony sitdown again it could be sooner.

 

[Iceman]

I think they probably know their time with the Spider-Man rights is coming to an end and theyre trying to making as much $$$ as possible by throwing ideas at the wall and seeing what sticks. Ive said it before I think we're a few years at away tops before we see marvel get the rights back in full. Depending on what happens next year after Far From Home when Disney/Marvel and Sony sitdown again it could be sooner.

Yeah, you're probably right. There's no way this Spider-verse lasts 15-20 years.

 

[Raiden]

Venom receives bad reviews and poor Cinemascore. The OW is driven by a lot of curiosity and I think the second week decline will tell us more about its long term outlook than the first week. I expect Venom to drop substantially once moviegoers had their fill.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Option #1 seems more likely to me, unfortunately.

When is Morbius supposed to come out?

I am not sure it has a release date. But I think they start filming in like, 4 weeks. I was dubious it would film if Venom failed, but Venom is looking strong so I don't see that happening now.

 

[Smurphftw]

Venom receives bad reviews and poor Cinemascore. The OW is driven by a lot of curiosity and I think the second week decline will tell us more about its long term outlook than the first week. I expect Venom to drop substantially once moviegoers had their fill.

Possibly. Maybe even probably. But I think the damage has already been done. It's highly likely to be a respectably profitable movie now.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

I am not sure it has a release date. But I think they start filming in like, 4 weeks. I was dubious it would film if Venom failed, but Venom is looking strong so I don't see that happening now.

Ok thanks. I think it is important because unlike Venom, who is a popular character that would get a certain size of audience for his first solo film due to his name alone, Morbius will have no such luxury and will have to depend primarily on the quality of the film itself. Morbius has a far greater chance of being an outright box office flop than Venom ever had.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Venom receives bad reviews and poor Cinemascore. The OW is driven by a lot of curiosity and I think the second week decline will tell us more about its long term outlook than the first week. I expect Venom to drop substantially once moviegoers had their fill.

We'll see. People predicted it would drop due to bad WOM after Thursday and would potentially even maybe lose to A Star is Born, and that is so far not seemingly happening. I think it will have a 60ish% drop, which is not uncommon for CBMs.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Ok thanks. I think it is important because unlike Venom, who is a popular character that would get a certain size of audience for his first solo film due to his name alone, Morbius will have no such luxury and will have to depend primarily on the quality of the film itself. Morbius has a far greater chance of being an outright box office flop than Venom ever had.

Agreed. If I am Sony, I am making sure Morbius is about the same budget level as the 1st Deadpool. Maybe even slightly less. I don't see it having enough of a ceiling to justify a budget any higher.

 

[Bach]

Our only hope would be if Disney used that asset they had (I think it was called Endemol) to trade with Sony.

 

[Shuri]

Some fans have been trying to kill Cap since AoU, LOL!!! Their lust for blood shall never die

They claim to love cap but I don't know why they would want him dead. Everyone wants Cap gone, I hope marvel disappoints them.

 

[Shuri]

A good reason to not do it is Star Wars. Star Wars was the biggest film franchise in the world. Even moreso than the MCU. Then they killed Luke Skywalker and the fanbase turned on them immediately. Now Solo bombed, a bunch of Star Wars films were cancelled, and the franchise overall is at a crossroads. I happened to rather like TLJ (moreso than TFA), but it clearly divided the fanbase and the overriding complaint by far is how they handled Luke. Marvel should not make the same mistake.

the people that want these iconic characters dead are always a loud minority. Majority of the audience love these characters and will be unhappy to loose them.

 

[Xeno]

They claim to love cap but I don't know why they would want him dead. Everyone wants Cap gone, I hope marvel disappoints them.

Too many people want Cap dead because: a) it happened in the comics; and b) they want Bucky to have the shield. It's like Steve Rogers exists only so he can die to make way for Bucky. That makes no sense to me but it's the way some "fans" think.

 

[Lilbaz]

Looks like Venom is going to be a success so I see two ways Spider-Man's situation could develop, one less likely than the other.

• Far From Home releases and Sony thinks they don't need Marvel Studios anymore so they refuse to renew the contract and Sony has total control over Spíder-Man again.
• Far From Home releases and Sony thinks they don't need Spider-Man to be successful so they see no reason to not renew the contract so Spider-Man stays in the MCU.

Option 3: Into the spiderverse is successful, sony launch miles morales into the sonyverse as their own spiderman. Marvel keep peter parker and can use all of spidermans enemies but creating their own versions of morbius, venom etc... if they want.

 

[HBarnill]

Somewhere, Avi Arad is popping some champagne.

 

[Lilbaz]

Somewhere, Avi Arad is popping some champagne.

Sonyverse is a thing. Guess everyone will have to accept it. Hopefully sony will think they can make enough movies there is no reason for spidey.

 

[Spider-Fan]

200 mil WW opening is a major success. Venom is getting a sequel unless it has like 65%+ drops everywhere. That is unlikely. Isn't this opening in China too?

 

[Iceman]

200 mil WW opening is a major success. Venom is getting a sequel unless it has like 65%+ drops everywhere. That is unlikely. Isn't this opening in China too?

Did it get a $200m opening? Wow.

 

[Detective Conan]

My main worry is the success of Venom might embolden Sony to use the integration of that version of that character into the MCU as a condition for renewing the contract between Marvel — a condition, by the way, that Marvel Studios would never agree to. That could be one of things that could make the talks of a deal renewal fall apart.

 

[Iceman]

Option 3: Into the spiderverse is successful, sony launch miles morales into the sonyverse as their own spiderman. Marvel keep peter parker and can use all of spidermans enemies but creating their own versions of morbius, venom etc... if they want.

Imagine how sick of Spidey those people who had fatigue after SM3 will be.

That said the above would work for me although I wouldn't have minded seeing Miles in the MCU a decade or so later.