Superman just seems to be cursed with "damned if you do damned if you don't." Try to embrace the wish fulfillment empowerment fantasy and people complain. Try to give him some realistic flaws and/or limitations to challenge him so an audience can more easily relate to him and people still complain. Sometimes it's hard not to get the feeling that people just want Superman to fail no matter how he's approached.
That's sort of the sneaking suspicion I've had at times too. It's a tricky balance to walk.
No one said that making Superman all out crazy sci fi is the only thing you have to do to make a good Superman film. It should go without saying that execution is just as, if not more important.
If Superman didn't have the same level of appeal as other heroes, he would've fallen by the wayside already. To say people only like the idea of Superman is strange to me. Superman has consistently been one of the biggest and most popular Superheroes of all time. You don't become or stay that popular by people merely liking the idea of you. The problem isn't Superman's appeal, its that there hasn't been a good Superman film since 1980 (IMO), there's yet to be a good Superman video game, and he doesn't have the constant media push that Batman gets.
Fair enough. Just to be clear, I know you guys weren't saying that sci-fi was the only thing needed in order to make a good Superman movie. I just thought it was kind of ironic that in many ways MoS really did have a very solid modern take on the mythos, on paper (for me at least). Sometimes I wonder if I'm being too harsh on the film when I reflect on the things I like about it on paper, but then every time I've tried to watch it I just find it hard to continue watching.
I should clarify that I'm specifically talking GA people that don't read the comics. Superman obviously has a very large and passionate fanbase, so I'm leaving them off the table. I just think Superman is a character that's tied up in nostalgia and childhood memories for a lot of casual folks. The "S" symbol is pervasive in pop culture and tends to function as a real life symbol of hope, optimism, perseverance, etc. Think of how many pop songs there are that reference Superman. That's kind of what I'm talking about. I think that legacy of Superman would always stick around even if they never made another movie or TV show. I think as of now, there seems to be this disconnect between the sentimentality that exists for Superman as a cultural artifact and the actual enthusiasm in the general moviegoing audience for Superman as a modern movie character. Leaving MoS's quality aside, the movie did 'solid' box office numbers but nothing outstanding. I don't think mixed reviews alone can account for that, otherwise how do you explain movies like the last three Transformers films cracking a billion? Even Superman Returns, with fairly good reviews and a less dark tone in the marketing, underperformed. Granted, its own inflated budget definitely was the nail in the coffin there. Whether you want to blame it solely on WB hiring the wrong filmmakers, the long dry spell with no Superman movies, times changing, or some combination of everything...Superman has underperformed in the modern era for such a massive, global IP.
I also have admit that I know I'm probably projecting a bit when I talk about people like the idea of Superman. Superman is a character I'll go through phases with, where I try get myself psyched about the character...but at the end of the day, I tend to settle on just being kinda lukewarm towards him. Even the Donner films, which I have a tremendous amount of respect for, don't really make me
love the character. Before MoS, I was in one of those phases (just like I was before SR) and totally went in thinking it was going to be the film that changes everything and converts me into a fan once and for all. I think a lot of people went into MoS with that mindset. Ironically it seems like BvS is going to be one big exercise in getting the audience to care about Superman. Cast him as the villain through Batman's eyes- the natural underdog and proven audience favorite, and then eventually get to a point where Batman gives Supes his seal of approval. Once he's on team-Batman, automatic audience brownie points. I'm not saying that's a good or bad thing- on paper that arc is true to both of their characters, but it's a smart strategy that might end up paying off for WB/DC.
