Thor's box office competition - Part 1

[Raiden]

I actually like IM2, but I do think it suffered in that they tried to improvise way too much like they did on the first movie, and it worked. Alot of people blame the Avengers tie-ins, and other things, but I think you hit the nail on the head the problem was the script. Still a great movie IMO, but not as good as the 1st.

In no. 3, the villian had better be Mandarin, because it's likely Downey's last go round in the suit, at least as a solo franchise. Usually where most superhero film franchises burn out at the 3rd film, IM has a real advantage in that they saved the best for last.

Yeah, I think Mandarin should be in the last IM movie as well, although I heard a rumor about RDJ and the new director for IM3 (who also did KKBB with RDJ) wanted it to be kind of a spy movie, and I'm not sure if Mandarin can factor into that. Mandarin works better behind the scene, though, so I think they'll need another villain to help build up Mandarin's final battle. Maybe Titanium Man would be a great choice.

 

[Vartha]

I think Thor proves that if you spend time improving the script, and have a competent director running things, the movie can turn out to be a winner. I still think the biggest problem with IM2 was the screenplay, and if they weren't rushing it out to meet the deadline, they could've addressed some of the problems inherent in the movie. Faverau did not say it but I think he was disappointed with the movie, hence his decision to bow out instead of doing IM3. Hopefully after the Avengers they will make sure the 3rd movie in the IM trilogy will have a strong script to shoot.

I think Thor had the advantage of SEVERAL writers tho, and I do mean SEVERAL.
When Marvel realized they had a hero that would cover several genres they stopped and approached Thor differently than they would have with Iron-Man.

 

[Son of Coul]

Yeah despite my love for IM2 I think the script is its biggest flaw. I mean it seems like they nailed production, post, and all encompassed within. But they just had to interweave everything a little better. I don't think too many characters is an issue at all. ****, Thor had plenty more than IM2, IM2 just had to utilize them better and weave everything together tighter.

I just feel bad for Justin Theroux, guy got a great shot and took it while under very stressful and rushed conditions and he's the one getting blamed for something that's really not that bad.

 

[CaptainCraig]

I'm hoping that when the actuals come out we see a slight uptick in THOR. It had such a jump on Saturday that if that continued through Sunday afternoon/night then the 34.5m estimate might see a bump upwards. Be awesome to see that!

 

[Vartha]

I can't believe and I'm quite HAPPY Thor's topped the B.O. for two weeks.

 

[zeptron]

Greed is at the root of poor movie making sometimes.

Yep just look at the previous two X-men movies(hell just about any movie Fox makes) and Spider-man 3.

 

[MadVillainy]

how were the last 2 X-Men movies or Spider-Man 3 motivated by greed

 

[TheCorpulent1]

More to the point, how were the first X-Men movie and the first two Spider-Man movies NOT motivated by greed? The movie industry is a business first and foremost. These movies aren't getting greenlit because a couple of the productions' big names love the characters...

 

[MadVillainy]

More to the point, how were the first X-Men movie and the first two Spider-Man movies NOT motivated by greed? The movie industry is a business first and foremost. These movies aren't getting greenlit because a couple of the productions' big names love the characters...

yup

 

[Spider-Fan]

More to the point, how were the first X-Men movie and the first two Spider-Man movies NOT motivated by greed? The movie industry is a business first and foremost. These movies aren't getting greenlit because a couple of the productions' big names love the characters...

All major franchises are motivated by greed, be it Spider-Man or the great Nolan's Batman.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

It's always good to have people who genuinely love and respect the original comics involved in the productions, don't get me wrong. But the guys behind Thor, Iron Man, et al. were in it just as much to make money as the guys behind Catwoman and all the other crappy comic movies were. The difference is that the former group recognized that s***ting all over the source material is a much less reliable way of making lots of money than respecting the source material and pleasing the fans is.

 

[Arach Knight]

Yeah, but Thor's looking like it can top out at around 490-500 million, remember, Thor's only been out for 2 weeks in the US and 3 weeks internationally.

I am pleased with Thor's performance, as it means that we can expect a sequel. But $500 million seems just a little too lofty. This film seems rather front loaded. I will be excited if it does hit the $500 million mark. Maybe it will be incentive for Disney to buy back the rights to Spider-Man and the X-Men, so we can get better films from those franchises (though I am excited about Amazing Spider-Man).

 

[Chewy]

The franchise I want Marvel to focus on getting back is Fantastic Four. That way we can have Doctor Doom in the Avengers sequel.

Ghost Rider and Daredevil they will probably get back soon too. X-Men and Spider-Man, they may never get back.

 

[Raiden]

The franchise I want Marvel to focus on getting back is Fantastic Four. That way we can have Doctor Doom in the Avengers sequel.

Ghost Rider and Daredevil they will probably get back soon too. X-Men and Spider-Man, they may never get back.

Yeah, Dr. Doom would be amazing, but if Fox ever get their devious plan of rebooting F4 in motion, Marvel might not get F4 back in a very long time.

 

[Arach Knight]

The franchise I want Marvel to focus on getting back is Fantastic Four. That way we can have Doctor Doom in the Avengers sequel.

Ghost Rider and Daredevil they will probably get back soon too. X-Men and Spider-Man, they may never get back.

They would get them back whenever the rights expire. For instance, Sony lost the television rights to Spider-Man, which is why Spectacular Spider-Man was canceled. After the rights reverted to Disney/Marvel, they decided to create their own series (Ultimate Spider-Man) rather than to continue with Sony's existing series (which would have likely meant complex contract negotiations and profit sharing).

These companies won't hold on to the rights forever. And as with the case of the Hulk, they may just sell them back after realizing that they are too incompetent/cowardly to handle the franchise. Marvel has no problem with taking risks with their properties. Movie studios seem to be far more cautious. It may prove to be more profitable for many of them to sell back the rights and make a distribution deal (like Paramount did), than to hold onto a property. In fact, that is a common practice in Hollywood. You buy rights, sit on them for a while and sell them to the highest bidder.

 

[Chewy]

Sony sold back the Spider-Man TV rights in exchange for something, I forget what exactly. They did not lose them. Different situation.

The Spider-Man film license is essentially a license to print hundreds of millions of dollars. Same goes for the X-Men film license. There is no incentive for Sony or Fox to give them up.

 

[zeptron]

how were the last 2 X-Men movies or Spider-Man 3 motivated by greed

Because studio interference is mainly what caused the downfall of those movies.

In SM3's case, it was the studio not wanting to wait until Raimi was done with the goblin storyline and cramming in Venom a character he didn't understand and had no place in the established storyline. The story arc had been set up for two films was for Harry to be come the big bad, not some alien symbiote who hadn't even had any foreshadowing. (except for that line in SM1 about "Eddie's" pictures, which seems to have been ignored). Venom overshadowed Harry and was put in to get symbiote fanboys in theaters.

In X3's case it's when Singer went to do Superman Returns, instead of waiting for him Fox decided to rush production so that it would come out in Summer 2006. They didn't have a director until weeks before filming was to begin. And when a director is finally on board, it's Brett Ratner who had grown a reputation for being a hack, *****bag, MTV music video, action director.

They also didn't wanna wait for several actors to take care of prior engagements before filming.(Marsden, Romijn, and Paquin) As a result several characters were either "killed off" or had very little screentime.

In both X3 and Wolverine's cases it was cramming in a bunch of characters and having them be under two hours. I believe Hugh Jackman wanted Wolverine to be longer, but Rothman trimmed it down so it could have more showtimes.

Similar situtation with Daredevil. It was shot as an R-rated movie, but Fox editted parts out so they could have more showtimes and so that 10 year olds could see it.

 

[Arach Knight]

Sony sold back the Spider-Man TV rights in exchange for something, I forget what exactly. They did not lose them. Different situation.

The Spider-Man film license is essentially a license to print hundreds of millions of dollars. Same goes for the X-Men film license. There is no incentive for Sony or Fox to give them up.

Looks like you are correct. After some quick research, it turns out that Sony may have given them up in exchange for something relating to the film franchise rights (perhaps an extension of the license?). Even still, there is the possibility that studios would barter or surrender the rights for some concession or outright payment. Disney has deep pockets, and with that in mind, they are Disney. Who knows what kind of deals they could offer based on the wide array of things they own (Mirimax, ESPN, Disney, Marvel etc). Of course I am being fanboyishly optimistic (yep, I just made up a word, fanboyishly), but I can dream a dream, can't I?

 

[MadVillainy]

Because studio interference is mainly what caused the downfall of those movies.

In SM3's case, it was the studio not wanting to wait until Raimi was done with the goblin storyline and cramming in Venom a character he didn't understand and had no place in the established storyline. The story arc had been set up for two films was for Harry to be come the big bad, not some alien symbiote who hadn't even had any foreshadowing. (except for that line in SM1 about "Eddie's" pictures, which seems to have been ignored). Venom overshadowed Harry and was put in to get symbiote fanboys in theaters.

In X3's case it's when Singer went to do Superman Returns, instead of waiting for him Fox decided to rush production so that it would come out in Summer 2006. They didn't have a director until weeks before filming was to begin. And when a director is finally on board, it's Brett Ratner who had grown a reputation for being a hack, *****bag, MTV music video, action director.

They also didn't wanna wait for several actors to take care of prior engagements before filming.(Marsden, Romijn, and Paquin) As a result several characters were either "killed off" or had very little screentime.

In both X3 and Wolverine's cases it was cramming in a bunch of characters and having them be under two hours. I believe Hugh Jackman wanted Wolverine to be longer, but Rothman trimmed it down so it could have more showtimes.

Similar situtation with Daredevil. It was shot as an R-rated movie, but Fox editted parts out so they could have more showtimes and so that 10 year olds could see it.

but that still doesnt explain why it's motivated by greed any more than other movies
It explains why they werent good movies

 

[zeptron]

but that still doesnt explain why it's motivated by greed any more than other movies
It explains why they werent good movies

If Sony forcing in a villain just to get people in theaters and Fox trimming down movies to just to get more showings isn't them being greedy then I don't know what is. It showed that they cared about quanity over quality.

 

[Tony Stark]

On the BOM forums they're reporting 34.7 actuals for Thor! Not official until they update the site, but if true that's awesome!

 

[hatebox]

It needed to have a good weekend, and it did. Very interested to see how Pirates affects it. Maybe it won't be so bad.

 

[Tony Stark]

The only way Pirates effects it, is Thor will lose some 3D screens, but I have a feeling the effects will be minimal. I think the lack of 2D hurt the film in it's opening weekend, and now that it will pickup more 2D screens, it will actually be good.

 

[The Morningstar]

So it didn't even drop 50% from it's OW? Impressive.

 

[DieSmiling]

Yep and Thor's most likely going gross more than any of the X-Men films, even X-Men Last Stand.

I know inflation, 3D, & Imax helped, but I still thought I'd never see the day that a Thor film would gross more than the highest grossing X-Men film.

Helped? It's the only reason you could possibly claim it topped them. That and the continued emergence of foreign markets.

In terms on tickets sold Thor isn't even in the same ballpark. Not trying to diminish it's accomplishments, but domestic gross five years later and Thor still won't sniff TLS.