Discussion in 'Captain America: Civil War' started by Drz, Apr 27, 2016.
4.5/5 from me.
My review on Civil War movie:
Revised score: 9/10. Needs more Paul Rudd.
Best superhero movie in history. I swear to God.
The plot is tight. Motivations are crystal clear. The Avengers all had something to do. Needed more Crossbones.
Zemo is a less annoying version of Lex Luthor.
Ant-Man delivers the best line in the movie. BP and Spidey is perfect. Parker has a bigger role than Ant-Man.
Russo bros balanced a TON of world building and so many character with amazing results.
Movie makes you feel for individual characters. Even Joss Whedon can't do that.
I feel like yelling "stop fighting!" In the end. My heart is shattered. Its like those times when you have a major fight with your best friend.
Going in as a Team Cap supporter, coming out with Team Iron Man. Rogers is in the wrong here.
I don't see how Avengers 3 can top this.
Aunt May is damn hot btw.
I guess it's a good thing the Russo brothers are directing the next two Avengers films after all!?
I probably need a second viewing before settling on a grade but the film is right up there with The Avengers, Iron Man and Captain America The Winter Soldier (in no particular order) as one of the best, if not the best MCU film ever made.
You don't get out of the movie with a big smile on your face like with The Avengers, a large portion of it, which includes the impressive finale, is completely and utterly heart shattering. The movie is extremely dense, filled with tension, guilt and remorse. If you were to take out the costumes and powers it would be an amazing movie about family, compromises and responsibility and although the setpieces are amazing from start to finish (that airport scene will exceed your highest expectations) the heart of the film lies within these two characters ending up beating each other up in a brutal fistfight stripped off all the bells and whistles usually associated with the genre. It's raw, beautiful, heart breaking and I know this isn't the culmination of the MCU just yet but if suddenly Feige decided to stop there (which is not gonna happen), I'd still be a happy camper. It's one of those rare sequels that don't just work on their own but also elevate the movies that came before and are also the promise of new and great things to come.
It's a great film within the MCU canon (still have to decide wether or not it's my favourite, time will tell), certainly one of the greatest CBMs in history and a great film all things considered. A nearly perfect balance of great entertainment (again the fight scenes are terrific, creative and really unlike anything we've seen before) and potent, smart storytelling.
Reposting this from the other thread.:
So I just got home from seeing it review as follows.
This film frankly, shouldn't work. It's underlying plot is strong and yet it has to contend with characters who really don't serve much of a purpose other than to fight each other, and yet it bloody works. All conventional wisdom of story telling says introducing a new character towards the end of the second act is bad writing, or that having a bunch of characters battle in what is essentially a useless fight does nothing but wastes screen time, but despite these glaringly obvious movie rules being broken the damn thing manages to stick together. In lesser hands this film is a complete and utter mess.
The title of the film belongs to Captain America but this is very much a co-lead film with him Iron Man. The gradual deterioration of their relationship over the coarse of the film is riveting, culminating in a finale that is somewhat sad to watch. In the end you know why they both end up at this point, but it kinda hurts to watch them just beat the hell out of one and other.
There's really little point going over the other actors other than Black Panther and Spider-Man. Everyone again brings their A-game. Black Panther whilst good really needs his own movie to fully flesh him out as a character, in some respects I kinda wish his solo film came out before this one. Spider-Man is going to be an instant favourite, this is probably the best representation of the character that's been seen on film.
The only thing I feel this film didn't do a good job of was giving proper motivation for each character as to why they chose to side with either Stark or Rogers. That comes into play due the hero fight at the airport when it becomes a tad confusing as to who is on which team. The fight is entertaining as hell, but it's easy to get lost trying to remember which character is on which team.
Overall, this film shares a lot of themes with BvS, so comparisons are going to be inevitable. Unlike that film though Civil War knows that a strong narrative core is required for something this ambitious to work. Without that core this film would have easily collapsed in on itself. This feels very much like the Empire Strikes Back of the MCU. It doesn't end on a particularly high note, there are wounds on both sides that are still fresh, and relationships that may be beyond repair. I don't know if I'd label it the best Marvel movie, I would have to watch Winter Soldier again to see where it stands, but it makes the path to Infinity War a hell of a lot more interesting.
Yeah Jmc, the airport fight could easily be removed, but it was just too much fun to look at, it was spectacle porn.
I also agree this movie was very similiar to Batman v Superman, with both how Zemo/Luthor and Iron man/Batman played their roles.
I give the Film a 9.
Winter Soldier is near a 10 for me still.
The more I think on it, Civil War may be my Favorite of the two, if that makes sense.
A horrible comparison here is:
Robocop (80s) is MY favorite movie of all time.
But for me to say it's a better film than, say, Citizen Kane would be highly dishonest of me.
My review on Civil War movie:
The movie was great. Not as great as everyone says but better than Age of Ultron. That movie was disappointing. I'm so happy that they got this right and good that that Russo brothers got to direct this. Spider-Man was great to see but there should have been more of him.
Sorry. My thumb wrongfully hit 4 when i tried to zoom it(using phone)
Any way i can change my vote?
Did see the movie yesterday...
I think it is difficult to rate, because it is pure overload
Think, it is a 9/10 ...
The Russos did a great job!
I think the main story is much to complex - unnecessary - but in general, it works anyway.
Black Panther is amazing...
Finally saw it! Now I don't have to browse the Internet with fear. It's late, so can't be as comprehensive as I'd have liked.
Not sure yet what to rate it against MCU's usual best, hence the multiple viewings I've already planned for the near future, but as much as I enjoyed CW, there seems to be no dislodging TWS from its current first and well-deserved place. That movie was just perfect from top to bottom.
Back to CW: real happy that everyone had their moment or more, but most surprising was how much I preferred that last fight to the airport one, as amazing as the latter one was. The former, though, had real emotional intensity.
The airport fight did feel a little much, at least within the context of the overall story (WS was great because every scene belonged), and it could've been trimmed down. Some of the fight scenes were a bit shaky, and the effects looked a bit wonky, but nothing too bad.
Black Panther was as great and regal as everyone has said, and Spider-Man was a total hoot every time he was on-screen. Ant-Man also had us rolling. Little past moments from the MCU paid off. Characters debated and at length, not quickly. Zemo worked. Can't wait to see it again (and again).
[BLACKOUT]Strange there wasn't a Strange stinger, though.[/BLACKOUT]
I'd buy that for a dollar!
Just back from the cinema watching CW. Fantastic movie. I'd give it 8.5 out of 10 from initial viewing. My thoughts:
- Fantastic action throughout. Some of the shaky cam stuff (esp. the beginning) could have been toned down.
- I thought Zemo was not nearly as bad as a lot of reviews are saying. It was nice to have a down to earth villain with personal issues driving their plot. I don't think that the plot was as coincidence based as some say.
- I didn't mind the ending, but it leaves a lot of questions.
- Great humour throughout. Would have like to seen more Bucky/Sam interaction.
Overall the movie worked on many levels, and the 2.5 hours zipped by. Didn't feel like they wasted much time at all.
I wonder why people give the movie 10/10? People can rate how they want but I'm just curious. Many times people give high scores too easily in my opinion. I rarely rate movies 10/10 or 5/5. Then it should be perfect.
Quick and short.
Civil War is definitely the most serious and mature film of Marvel. The tone is very different from it's other films and it works to it's advantage, considering the overall plot of the entire film. It doesn't take it's characters lightly and the gravity of the situation between them is very present. T'Challa was a great addition to the film and Chadwick played the part very well. As for Spider-man, nah. Still not a fan.
Action-wise, nothing groundbreaking, to be honest. The airport action sequence was fun, but the one that hit me the most was the last sequence between Steve James and Tony.
The only nitpick I would say is Zemo. I felt his development was not enough for him to make for a menacing enemy. But, if there's anything good about him, it's that he is just human. Neither did he have any masks, costumes nor super powered abilities that all superhero films just can't seem to get enough of. Removing him and just focusing on the conflict between Steve and Tony could've probably been a lot better. Oh, and Henry Jackman's score. Absolutely mediocre, if not that horrible. Wish composers could do as well as Tyler Bates with Guardians of the Galaxy. Oh (lastly), that shaky Crossbones vs Cap fight was too much for me, it ruined my excitement during the sequences itself.
I gave it a 10 because I thought it was amazing from beginning to end. The greatest comicbook film I've seen. It's a pain waiting to see it again, saw it at the advance screening and I still can't stop thinking and talking about it.
While I'm pretty restrictive with my grades I don't think it makes sense to demand perfection out of a scale that's so rough as only having 5 or 10 grades. Grades to movies is just to roughly categorize them into different levels and there will always be significant differences between movies that reach the same grade.
If one wants to describe a movie to the degree that "perfection" would be noticeable I'd say it's much better to do that using words in a review. The common scales are far to rough to justify giving a grade to perfection and finer scales are just annoying since that's not the added accuracy that's needed.
Functionality is the most important part of a grade scale.
Well you said the movie was great, 3.5/5 is like a C average. I think you can give something 5 stars and still feel there might be a few small flaws.
Movie grade and school grades aren't really equivalent on a 1-10 or even 4 or 5 star scale. Otherwise everything 6.5 and under would be just be a fail and under 8 a mediocrity leaving only three out of 10 grades to different how good to great it was.
3.5 or 7 out of 10 I think is more like a B.
Anyway, as for why I would grade it a 10? It thought it was spectacular entertainment and did everything a big blockbuster should and could do in terms of character, emotion, dialog, thrills, surprises and action.
Well Civil War was pretty much Marvel's the Dark Knight.
It's also in a way, just a "same old" sequel to Winter Soldier where it doesn't really do much new, but the quality is sharp and there's no bullcrap scapegoat villain that it all works.
Zemo wins, just like the Joker won in Dark Knight.
Just finished seeing civil war!
Best comic book movie ever! That's it. Simple.
The story, the action the emotional last 20 minutes. I can't even process adequately what I just watched.
This film was brutal and insanely entertaining. This is NOT Avengers 2.5. This is very much a captain America film and it was beyond glorious.
Black Widow's fight in Lagos was INSANE and surprised me how good it was, Cap and Iron Man went balls deep, Spider-Man was ****ing fantastic, easily the best cinematic incarnation of the character ever and my guy, King T'Challa/Black Panther...damn, he was bloody superb, he had that elevated sense of presence and monarchical authority and the way he fought...jeeeeez! Catching this again tomorrow!
Saw it today. Pretty sure it's my favorite superhero movie (previously it was Avengers followed closely by GOTG and Spider-Man 2). This movie just works, on all levels. It's funny, thrilling, gruesome and inspiring. What more can I say that hasn't been said before? All characters are great, but Spider-Man steals the show. It's easily the best Spidey put on film. By far. Black Panther is fantastic and I'm so hyped for his solo movie. Cap and Tony are perfect as always. The airport fight is my favorite action sequence in anything. Well, I know I said nothing new.t: I'd only like to add that I actually really liked Zemo. He might not be the Zemo some people were waiting for, but thought he was really solid for what he was. Possibly the best movie MCU (excluding Kingpin and Kilgrave) villain after Loki.
10/10 for me. I couldn't rate it any different and I'm not ashamed in the least to give it a perfect score. t:
Since the first user review thread appears defunct, I will go ahead and post mine here from the fan screen I went to 3-4 weeks ago.
Back from my fan screening in Tempe, AZ. Both Chris Evans and Sebastian Stan showed up. The movie was about 10mins late getting started and I was wondering what the hold up was - then they came out. They didn't stay (obviously) but it was still a cool surprise nonetheless. The whole crowd went nuts. Sorry for the poor quality, but it's a screenshot of the snapchat video I took:
Man, I don't think I've ever felt like this before after coming out of a movie. It marks the first time where honestly I have to let everything settle in my mind and then see it again. It's such a large and ambitious superhero film. That can be both a blessing and curse. I apologize ahead of time, but I will more than likely end up editing this after I post it.
The blessing is that there is enough superhero-ey goodness to last your comic book heart a long time. They really do an effective job tying all the strings and collateral damage within the MCU. We've grown to know and care for most of these heroes and the film does a great job servicing all of their various perspectives. Nearly everything that happens or is spoken actually matters, with very few throwaway moments - an amazing feat considered the size of this ensemble. The Russo's had some very interesting choices with their camera work too. There's a lot of intimate shots where you're up close near their faces - particularly with Steve Rogers.
- The critics were spot on about the airport fight in Germany. It's not quite a "brawl" so to speak, but honestly I kind of figured that going in. I knew it would be similar to when brothers are antagonizing each other and wrestling in the house. Spiderman and Ant-Man definitely shine in the fight. Spiderman fans are going to be verrrrrry happy when it comes to his power level, skill, and commentary.
- Tom Holland nails the role. Albeit I still think it's ironic that given Stark's new stance he would jeopardize bringing a teenager into the fight. Some of the sequence requires you not to over-analyze what you're watching. I can't even imagine how hard it was to put that together coherently. Scott Lang has one of the movie's most memorable lines when he shrinks and [BLACKOUT]gets in Iron Man's suit. When Stark becomes aware he's in there Lang remarks, "This is your conscience speaking. I know we haven't talked in a while, but ....."[/BLACKOUT] That got a great laugh from the crowd.
- Everyone really does have something to do in this movie and more importantly contribute to the narrative. Arcs are revisited for most of them from prior films. I gotta say Hawkeye returns in pretty badass form and at one point puts that to the test vs [BLACKOUT]Vision[/BLACKOUT] of all people. You can tell the Russos like Clint Barton a lot and I would watch a standalone movie with no questions asked if they directed it. I can't forget our boy Black Panther who's suit in the movie is just beautiful, not to mention his fighting abilities. He could almost be considered the 4th lead in this.
- Steve's story is definitely at the core of this movie. It was fun to watch the camaraderie between Steve, old friends, and new (i.e. Falcon, Bucky). In my mind though it's a three way for the "lead" of the movie between Steve, Tony, and Bucky. We finally get to see Winter Soldier speak and interact in other ways beyond fighting, not to mention getting a glimpse of more of his past.
- Speaking of fighting, there's plenty of it after the movie's first act. I'm so glad the Russo's understand how to show these guys in action - which is something I don't think Whedon ever quite got in the Avenger movies.
The curse is that there are fairly large segments of the film without Steve Rogers, as service is being paid to new characters being introduced. The fact that they go deeper into Tony's psyche and then let us into Winter Soldier's world a bit more - that's the price that was paid. In fact the story (I believe it was Vision) laments and I'm paraphrasing here - that all the meta humans and villains exist because of Tony Stark and the Iron Man suit. It's the kind of thing that nudges the movie's focus away from Steve.
- Daniel Bruhl was excellent as Zemo by the way. Verrrrrrrry sinister. [BLACKOUT]He's central to all the manipulation[/BLACKOUT] going on - which I'm sure many could have already guessed. His plan however is not very different from everyone else [BLACKOUT]i.e. break them apart from the inside[/BLACKOUT]. In some ways as fun as that has been to watch, it's also getting too feel a little bit too familiar. Thunderbolt Ross suffered the shortest end of the stick. He transitions really quickly from a guy who's acting as a voice of reason for the Accords to a guy who's almost hateful of the Avengers.
- Some of the CGI on Black Panther and Iron Man needed more work. There were also moments in the airport fight where the green screen was kind of evident.
- My largest complaint is that there is a handful of situations lacking proper segue/transition. Those things happen out of convenience in order to hit important plot points. Example, [BLACKOUT]I have no idea how Steve Rogers knew where Bucky lived, let alone that he was in Bucharest[/BLACKOUT]. There's a chance I may have missed something though.
EDIT: Adding another critique.
One of the things I keep coming back to when I think about what I saw at the fan screening is how it ended.
Tony finally finds out Cap knew about Bucky assassinating his parents. We get a knock down drag out fight where if it weren't for Cap's character - we might have seen Tony's death. Then we end up with it all being unwound. Cap mails a burner phone and letter to Tony that pledges he will always be there for him. This is followed up with mid-credit scene of Bucky going back into cryo - to which there's really no discussion. You'd think after all Cap has gone thru to finally have him back in his life he wouldn't be so easily to go along with it.
It's just kind of anti-climatic. I would have preferred they maintained their separate ways for a while. Seemed like The Russos were just trying to squeeze in another Cap speech. I understand movies shouldn't end on a crappy note. Seeing Stark helping to rehabilitate Rhodey would have been enough, along with Cap breaking some of the captured Avengers from the Raft would have done the job.
For now I'm giving this movie an 8.5. I never gives movies 10, so bare that in mind. That may bump another half point when I see it again. I think CA:TWS was a tighter film overall and pays more service to Steve Rogers. Then again it might be unfair to compare the two as this film is much larger in scale and more ambitious. I don't envy the Russo for taking on Infinity Wars, this had to have been hard enough as it was.
I'm putting you Marvel fanboys on notice.
As a hard-core DC fan and person who intensely dislikes Captain America, I wanted to Batman v Superman to be the better film. Sadly, I have reaped the reward I deserve for being such a hater by having Batman v Superman kind of suck - and from all accounts Civil War looks amazing. Hell, I can't stand Cap, but I'm actually excited about seeing a movie about him - and that says a lot.
So I'm putting you on notice that if I see this film and it it does live up to the hype then it will be Marvel's "Dark Knight" and take the superhero film to new heights.....
...... then I will utterly concede that Marvel is the superior cinematic universe (at least for the time being...and maybe the foreseeable future). I figured that a film with both Batman and Superman couldn't go wrong - man, was I wrong.
What Nolan did for Batman was totally right, and Snyder got it half right with Man of Steel, but Batman v Superman was pretty much all wrong ! On the other hand what the Russos did in TWS was amazing (hell, it made me enjoy a Captain America film) and by all accounts what they've done in CW is amazing.
I still might see CW and hate it, but I seriously doubt it. As such, right now I'm seriously Hulk-green envious - so bask in it, all the bragging about how great the MCU is, well looks like it's justified !
You lucky bastards, I wish Bats and Supes (my all-time favourite comic book heroes) got the same kind of treatment that Marvel gives its characters - I mean some fans say DC makes movies with deep themes that are dark and complex....... but let's face it we go and see superhero movies to be entertained, and B v S was not particularly entertaining - what does it matter if it's deep, dark and complex if it's also unwatchable dog-**** ? The Dark Knight was dark and complex but still super entertaining - so that excuse is just bollocks.
Anyway, hopefully by this time next week I'll have seen CW and will post my review in this thread, watch this space !