Gotham Victoria Cartagena / Andrew S. Jones as Renee Montoya & Crispus Allen Thread

[Breogan]

I had no idea they were regulars, so awesome!

Looks like they are borrowing more from Gotham P.D. which is great.

Although obviously a new timeline as they are more Gordon's contemporaries than his subordinates.
And they may be playing them more antagonistic.

Go to 2:37 Montoya & Allen
[YT]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oI_P4xGURY#t=173[/YT]

 

[Breogan]

Can a Specter Question spin-off be far behind?

 

[Breogan]

I'm steeling your specefic reply into this Montoya & Allen specific Thread.

Watched the show with some of the cast and a few hundred folks....

Without spoiling much I'm curious about the Renee Montoya & Crispus Allen characters?
Are they antagonists, sympathetic, unsympathetic, throw away characters, set up to be regulars, what's the deal?

It's hard to say where they will stand at the end, but from what I can see, they are unsympathetic, and almost antagonizing at certain scenes...but for a good purpose..it's hard to explain unless I spoil it for you. I can see them being regulars on the TV show. They did have some good screen time.

"unsympathetic, and almost antagonizing at certain scenes...but for a good purpose"

Well it could be worse, no surprise this is a new take on the characters, different universe, Gordon is the rookie so they are not working under him. They seem more the jaded vets, while it's all new to him maybe?
Hopefully they don't just end up dead , little more than character stepping stones for Gordon to play off, but actually end up as allies and regulars.
They seem to have been added as a bit of an afterthought, not featured prominently in the first round of cast promos.
Curious to see how they will be used.

 

[Breogan]

Great! Gotham TV Podcast Exclusive: - Interview with Victoria Cartagena and Andrew Stewart-Jones.

Read transcript - http://gothamtvpodcast.com/tag/interview/

Or listen to the interview @ about min. 14:05 - http://gothamtvpodcast.com/gotham-t...andrew-stewart-jones-interview-zero-year-e15/

I was pleasantly surprised by Andrew Stewart-Jones' accent as I knew nothing about the actor, only his scene from the trailer.

Some quotes...

Cartagena: I really love the story arc for Renee in Half a Life [issues 5 - 9] she went through a lot of highs and lows. So I really hope it makes it onto the show because what stood out to me was how strong the bond is between Montoya and Allen. During those really tough times (Crispus) Allen was the only one that really went to bat for her and he had her back without question. You could just see how fiercely loyal they are to one another. So they’re more than partners, they’re friends or…more like family actually. I hope that the audience get to see that bond and it was important for me to read that on paper to make sure we were getting the job done.

She's obviously a fan of the comics.

Stewart-Jones: If you ever end up being questioned by us, ....you will be wishing and praying to wake up from your bad dream! []… do not cross Allen and Montoya!

Awesome!

They also put up this pic. looks photshoped, but cool!

 

[Micromind]

Awesome!

They also put up this pic. looks photshoped, but cool!

Looks pre-fx shot which would be added later on to real world locations.

 

[SlamAdams]

They look good

 

[Young Superman]

I liked Renee in the pilot.

 

[Breogan]

I love this team up, Victoria Cartagena & Andrew S. Jones did them justice.

I really like how the two otherwise minor characters are used, they seem like two good cops (although not without their own demons) trying to stay afloat in an already corrupt system, who have nothing but each-other's backs.

Although that may be impossible, and nothing is black and white.
Obviously they don't see what we know and we see in Gordon yet, so from their POV he's already just part of the problem. Which makes them great antagonists.

Hopefully they eventually see he's the guy they should be backing, and equally he should eventually find a way to trust and use them as allies, to accomplish what he wants from within the system..

Although that may be impossible considering....
....The not so subtle reveal between Renee Montoya and Barbara Kean
Does Gordon even know?

 

[Breogan]

GOTHAM/Major Crimes Unit; featurette on Montoya & Allen -

GCPD? Like that, ....but honest.

"We're the good guys"

Although they may also have the furthest to fall.
[YT]Pkz3hJhrev4[/YT]
Montoya is pushing way to hard. And Gordon is gona push back, I like the tension being set up here.
They have an impossible task ahead of them. My guess they won't come out of it unscathed. To bad they can't see the truth about Gordon (Yet).

Ep.3 stills-

vs. Mooney, have we seen them together yet?

Hopefully Mooney chews them up t:

 

[DrMylesOBoogie]

Not crazy about Montoya. Could have introduced her as a rookie down the line and someone Gordon can mold into a good cop and ally in the PD.

 

[Breogan]

It's hard to say how long she and Allen have been at it?
MCU keeps being discussed as a new Unit in Gotham.

And although they read as somewhat hardened, there also seems to be some real rookie naivety about them, believing they can separate themselves from the corruption, keeping their own hands clean.
They seem naively hopeful about what they think they can achieve. which reads as not having been there long.

She's definitely not the rookie cop once being molded by grizzled Gordon from the cartoon and comics though. But in this continuity Gordon is to young and rookie himself to be grooming anyone, he might find allies though. They really had to introduce her(them) differently here. And once all the cards are played Gordon may still yet serve as inspiration for them.

 

[Breogan]

I get they had a past, but Montoya and Kean is coming off a bit stalkery x.

 

[regnak]

I get they had a past, but Montoya and Kean is coming off a bit stalkery x.

More than a bit I would say.

 

[Arrowshieldfan]

so Montoya trust the word of Fish that Gordon killed Cobblepot........without looking at the evidence more deeply? At some point they have to work together

 

[cronosred]

Can't stand these two. Everytime they show up it's either to harass Barbara or Gordon, the only clean cop in the city.

 

[Breogan]

LOL they are definitely playing them as unsympathetic antagonists, though Montoya & Allen have been knee deep in the corruption. Gordon's just got his big toe in.
White Knight or not, they have zero reason to trust him at this point. And vice versa.
He definitely doesn't need them pushing and questioning his motives or allegiance. With everyone playing everyone else against each other, it's set up so you can't trust anyone.
The way Montoya is leaning (and on his girl no less), is not helping, it's hard to imagine they will ever see eye to eye.

Now with Harvey Dent being recently cast, I wonder if they will work that relationship into her past?

 

[EssayM]

They're actually very sympathetic; they're the only decent cops in Gotham (they think) and are trying to bring to justice to two cops who are (they think) just as corrupt as the rest of the department and possibly guilty of murder. Aside from maybe being a little pushy, they are easily good guys who just don't have all the information yet.

The problem, as I see it, is that every time they're around, Gordon suddenly decides to be unusually defensive, angrily ask for evidence, and generally act exactly like a corrupt cop would in that situation. This is a plot hole that's been bothering me: he knows they're on the same side and has no reason not to trust them, so why doesn't he just ask to meet with them in private so he can explain what really happened? Or if he can't do that, why not just play innocent and try to divert suspicion for a while? Why does he have to go out of his way to act as guilty and suspicious as possible in front of them? If there's a reason for this, it wasn't explained very well.

 

[The Guard]

I think Gordon's not sure whether they're actually good cops or not.

There might be a bit of "Do they work for Falcone?" going on with him.

 

[Rowsdower!]

These two annoy the crap out of me. I guess they're supposed to, but still... every time they show up, I'm just like, "F*** off."

 

[Sawyer]

Eh. I don't hate them, but the sooner they see that Gordon's not the bad guy they think he is and step the f*** off/get on his team, the better.

 

[Rowsdower!]

Yeah. I guess what annoys me about them is that for a pair of "good" detectives, they don't seem to do much detective work. They immediately assume Gordon is dirty because he's been paired up with Bullock for what? A couple hours? And then they accuse him of murdering Oswald because a fine upstanding crime boss told them that's what happened. 'Cuz you know, she wouldn't lie or anything.

 

[SlamAdams]

The actors aren't the best, but the whole series is pretty rough around the edges

 

[chamber-music]

I didn't realize Andrew Stewart Jones (Crispus Allen) was British

 

[EssayM]

I still say Gordon is in the wrong. I mean, the few times he's met with Montoya and Allen, they've made it pretty obvious that they're against the corrupt cops, they don't work for Falcone, and that the only reason they're bothering Gordon is because they think he killed two men and manipulated evidence (which are kind of their job to investigate, as both of those would count as Major Crimes).

In response, Gordon avoids answering their questions, angrily demands evidence, tells them to leave him alone, fails to respond to accusations of being crooked...you know, just exactly the way a guilty man would act under questioning.

Yes, I know he can't tell them what happened with Cobblepot right in the middle of HQ, but there's a million other ways he could let them know without Falcone or the cops catching on. Just arrange a private meeting somewhere, swear them to secrecy, explain what really happened, and boom, two new allies to clean up the town with! Instead, he seems to be going out of his way to act suspicious. Basically, they've given Gordon every reason to trust them, while Gordon's given them every reason not to trust him.

Honestly, this just feels like that part in every romantic comedy, where the two leads end up pointlessly separating over some stupid misunderstanding that any real person could clear up in two seconds, just to keep the plot going. Enough with the tension-building, just put them on the same team already!

 

[The Guard]

And again, how does he know THEY don't work for Falcone?

What good is a private meeting with two people who might work for the person you don't want finding out you screwed over going to do?