What can the DCEU learn from Wonder Woman?

[ganon51]

What can the DCEU learn from its 4th movie?

 

[Ita-KalEl]

That a hero can be a bright and positive character

 

[Vlyse]

You can have an extended universe and a great standalone film at the same time.

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

Let the filmmaker do their thing.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Apparently to not let WB and the creative around there make decisions. They didn't want to do the No Man's Land scene, it didn't make sense to them.

 

[WBwins]

Apparently to not let WB and the creative around there make decisions. They didn't want to do the No Man's Land scene, it didn't make sense to them.

For Real?

 

[TheComicbookKid]

Get wreaking comic writers as consultants.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

For Real?

http://io9.gizmodo.com/wonder-womans-most-fantastic-scene-nearly-didnt-get-mad-1795811939

 

[Wanda Detroit]

A conherent storyline with a beginning, middle, and end. That every character shouldn't be written like Batman. Let daylight look like daylight. Enough of the rain and the 90% night scenes. Superman isn't a brooding, angsty, uncertain man. Color is okay. Small characters like Jimmy Olsen are important too(see Etta Candy).

I could be here all day.

 

[jamesb]

That they rushed it. Should have done standalones for all there major characters first. And trust the appeal these characters have as individuals.

 

[Mike Murdock]

Have a story with a point. Mix fun, style, adventure, and humor. It doesn't have to be done equally, but don't abandon any particular moment. Understand the character and make sure the themes of the story match the character. Pace things so no moment is too long or too short. Don't cut the movie for the purpose of getting more screenings in a day. Have faith in directors who can make good material, let them make their movie once you've all decided what movie to tell.

 

[samsnee]

Don't center your whole plot around getting the main characters to fight for 5 minutes.

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

Understand the character and make sure the themes of the story match the character.

 

[Dark Raven]

Five things future DC films should borrow from Wonder Woman

https://www.theverge.com/2017/6/5/15740524/wonder-woman-five-lessons-dc-extended-universe-movies

Spoilers in the link.

 

[Skies]

"Don't hire Zack Snyder to direct movies if you want them to be critically acclaimed on Rotten Tomatoes."

 

[jmc]

• Let the hero be the hero
• Give your character well defined values
• If it's a dark story add levity
• Try not to make out your film is smarter than it actually is

 

[storyteller]

Clearly the hate for BVS here is strong. I loved that film and it's one of my favorite films. I'll accept this is something ill have to defend until the end.

Now what the DCEU can learn?

First and foremost, the hero comes first. For Aquaman and Flash, they shouldn't be trying to sell Justice League 2.

Now as to doing solo's first. I think solo's worked for Marvel to allow them to build up street cred and see what did and didn't work. They also got to better work out a narrative. I do not believe we needed another solo Batman movie. I do think Superman and Wonder Woman with hints of Batman should have followed up MOS. Now personally I would have made BVS a Superman vehicle with Batman being more in a Diana type role. Or better yet American Alien is a good example.

But back to solos, worked for Marvel. I think WB studio interference hurt more then lack of solos.

Bright and positive? I feel this is where I think fans of BVS differ from non fans. I feel bright and positive needs to be earned and it can't be blind. It needs to be tested and a true hero break through it. Now the biggest thing is people don't understand that Batman is the villain in BVS until his heel turn.

Now that being said, Flash and Aquaman I think should not be Batman. Especially with Flash they need be put hope and courage above negative traits. Aquaman looks like he's having fun and Barry's zen like attitude may be the way to go(especially against the tv series depiction).


Simplify the plot, some folks it all just goes over their head. To reach the masses, dumb it down.



Now across the damn board(Marvel included). Brighten up the damn movie with bright colors. John Wicks is a dark movie and yet it's pretty damn bright. Not everything needs to look pitch black.

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

Clearly the hate for BVS here is strong. I loved that film and it's one of my favorite films. I'll accept this is something ill have to defend until the end.

Never to me! I really liked the movie.

Simplify the plot, some folks it all just goes over their head. To reach the masses, dumb it down.

Not sure about this one. Maybe make the plot clearer. Complex plots can work IMO, it's how they're portrayed.

 

[NealKenneth]

That it's best to let your tone suit your character. Characters like Batman, Daredevil and Wolverine work well being gloomy and gritty...it should have been obvious that Superman does not.

 

[Dark Raven]

Why Wonder Woman Is the Superman the DCEU Needed

http://collider.com/wonder-woman-superman/

Spoiler

A righteous and supernaturally powerful hero emerges to help save mankind from evil, selflessly throwing themselves into the fray and inspiring others with love and courage to be bold and fearless. Though that has historically described Superman, in the recent DECU movies, it has instead been Wonder Woman. In her solo film, Diana Prince (Gal Gadot) becomes the kind of Messianic figure Superman has been in the past, yet one who does not come off as a cold god, but someone who embraces her humanity.

That is the beautiful simplicity at the core of Wonder Woman. Unlike Clark Kent (Henry Cavill) in Man of Steel, Diana wholeheartedly embraces her fate as the savior of Earth. She leaves her island paradise willingly and with purpose, with her constant refrain for Steve Trevor (Chris Pine) to take her to the war, to the front, to where things are at their worst. She seeks out the darkness so that she can bring hope and light to it. Diana is not burdened by her purpose and doesn’t shun her abilities — she relishes in both, creating an unapologetically focused and determined heroine.

There’s a certain balance that’s essential for these characters to be at their most successful — a vulnerability that has to exist in order for us to feel a kinship even as we stand in awe. Diana Prince has otherworldly looks and abilities, but there’s a purity to her as she enters the world of men, one that allows her to have an unshakable focus in her mission to destroy the film’s villain, Ares. And yet, she still stops to listen to the story of a woman in the trenches who cries out for help, and without hesitation heroically shields the Allied troops as she takes fire from the German trenches. She helps to save a village, never pausing to consider the tactics of it (as Steve Trevor is forever trying to get her to do), but going full-throttle, motivated by a righteous indignation. Diana does the right thing because it is right.

But Diana is not just a war tank. Her powers are great, yes, but she also has a very strict moral compass, and she takes that boldness with her into the highest chambers of government as well. As Steve makes his case to his superiors about destroying the factory where the deadly gas he discovered is being mass-produced, he’s interrupted and shut down. He accepts it not because he isn’t a strong person (he may be the strongest in the movie, as he sacrifices himself for the greater good), but it’s because he knows that this is the process, the way of things. Diana doesn’t accept that, and as Steve tries to (somewhat hilariously) quiet her when she could easily fling him across the room, she tells the general to be ashamed. She’s right. But it’s just one of several occasions where Steve tries to temper her by explaining protocol (“you can’t just walk into a gala and kill a man!”), and it’s a great partnership dynamic. The movie doesn’t have the time to explore it much further, but Steve doesn’t require Diana to rescue him, or vice versa. He is not taken over the role of a damsel in distress. These two, with their team of sundries, work together for a greater purpose with affinity and friendship. It’s unique and heartening.

Last fall, when Supergirl introduced Superman, long-time fan Craig Byrne wrote about how Tyler Hoechlin might be the best live-action version of the character yet. In a criticism of the filmic Superman of late, he writes:

“Henry Cavill, for the most part, has the look. I still wish there was more red in his suit, and I still feel his version of the character is a bit of an ‘untouchable god,’ whereas Superman should be someone we can relate to and aspire to be like. Superman saves kittens from trees. He’d save people he loves in tornadoes. And he’d always stop to say hello to admiring children. I’ve seen pictures and behind-the-scenes footage of Cavill being exactly that kind of Superman, but in the movies, I have yet to feel it.”

Byrne goes on to say how Clark Kent is also, traditionally, a bit of a charming goober. He’s strong and heroic, but he’s also a kind, Midwestern guy. Similarly, Diana Prince in Wonder Woman is someone who may inspire awe, but she’s quick to put people at ease. She tries to calm Ewen Bremner’s Charlie from his nightmares, and she runs over in delight when she sees a baby (and loves ice cream). She spends a lot of time impressing upon those around her the importance of protecting those who cannot protect themselves, and genuinely, emotionally laments when innocent lives are lost.

It’s this emotional trauma that builds up to a crescendo in the third act, when Diana finally comes up against Ares (David Thewlis). She uses her frustration at the cruel acts of man — however aided by Ares’ whispers — and transfers it into a way to claim her cosmic power and destroy him.

In those scenes, the film makes a strong case for a subtextual Christian narrative. Despite the story being about Greek gods (and changing much of that tale as well), Ares is presented as a Fallen Angel / Lucifer figure, jealous of his father’s attention on his creations. As such, he acts as a malevolent force of evil, pushing them to their worst tendencies. Diana, meanwhile, is the Messiah figure — also the child of the creator god — and the one chosen to defeat this pervasive evil. When Ares tells Diana that they could use their powers to rule and restore Earth to, essentially, Eden, it was reminiscent of Satan tempting Christ. But like Jesus, Diana does not waver, and instead relies on the power of love and grace, as she forgives human weakness and defeats evil.

The analogy isn’t a 1:1, as Steve is the one who sacrifices himself, there’s no resurrection, and Diana must forever leave her home rather than triumphantly returning there. But the point is that there is just enough to paint her as that familiar Messianic figure — a character more typically embodied by Superman.

Ultimately, it doesn’t matter who carries that torch in the DCEU, just that someone does. Wonder Woman is an extraordinarily uplifting film, and one that creates the right balance of humor, heroism, and heart. Her motivations are elemental, and her aim is pure. There’s nothing easy about her journey or the task she must face, nor the life of isolation she seems to live in the present day. But drama doesn’t always have to come from pain and violence — it can also come from triumph and joy. In our cynical age, there may be a desire to tend towards darker, grittier superheroes and conflicted origins, but what we really need is Diana there to cut through that darkness with a powerful light.

 

[JeetKuneDo]

That a hero can be a bright and positive character

Ditto. Mostly future writers and directors creating Superman on film should be required to watch this movie. He's not Batman in a different costume. Dark is not automatically superior.

 

[JeetKuneDo]

Five things future DC films should borrow from Wonder Woman

https://www.theverge.com/2017/6/5/15740524/wonder-woman-five-lessons-dc-extended-universe-movies

Spoilers in the link.

After reading that article, another thing WW got right....no political agenda.

Many on the left were hoping they could watch a movie directed by a female and immediately know it was directed by a female. Luckily, Jenkins was too smart to fall in that trap and made a movie that fits right in the genre with ease and doesn't bash anyone over the head with politics. Since some on the left are actually complaining about WW, that means she struck a perfect balance.

 

[StormC]

"Don't hire Zack Snyder to direct movies if you want them to be critically acclaimed on Rotten Tomatoes."

That didn't help David Ayer.

 

[Boom]

That every character shouldn't be written like Batman.

There you go.

 

[MydnightPhoenix]

" players gonna play, play, play, play, play
And the haters gonna hate, hate, hate, hate, hate
Baby, I'm just gonna shake, shake, shake, shake, shake
I shake it off, I shake it off"