Who thinks Sinister will make it?

Discussion in 'X-Men: Apocalypse' started by ciscostudent561, May 24, 2014.

  1. Ledlunar

    Ledlunar Well-Known Member

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    Be cool if they show Xavier recruiting his new students and he takes Scott from a Orphanage run by Nathaniel Essex show there is something not right/sinister ;) about him. Don't really need to show his tie to Apocalypse until maybe a mid credits scene. Otherwise I think it'll be a bit over crowded with Wolverine, New recruits Storm, Nightcrawler, Cyclops, Jean.... & Gambit being in there too. Beast.
    Mystique. Magneto... Quicksilver...
     
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  2. Ledlunar

    Ledlunar Well-Known Member

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    also if they did something like that they could introduce Gambit there too trading favors with Essex and Xavier can feel there is something shady going on and making a offer to help Gambit if he helps them similar to how Wolverine joined in x1
     
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  3. Loki882

    Loki882 Well-Known Member

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    I feel like trying to do Sinister and Apocalypse as major villains in the same movie, and carry on plot-threads from DOFP, and introduce younger versions of Cyclops, Jean, and Storm, and introduce the new Gambit, etc, would be too much. However, they could introduce Sinister in this movie and then make him the main threat in a future movie.
     
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  4. The Guard

    The Guard Well-Known Member

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    We'll definitely see Mr. Sinister in some capacity, probably in APOCALYPSE, and set up for future films. And if they make a solo GAMBIT film, my money's on Sinister as the main villain.

    Despite Fassbender, they can't use Magneto forever.
     
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  5. Legion

    Legion Well-Known Member

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    I realize that they made Apocalypse responsible for Sinister's origin in The Further Adventures of Cyclops and Phoenix, but I don't ever recall him being Apocalypse's "herald"...where has this come from?

    After years of films featuring Magneto and the Brotherhood, putting two big villains in one film seems like a bit much. But would Sinister really be able to follow The Sentinels and Apocalypse?
     
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  6. FeedOnATreeFrog

    FeedOnATreeFrog (A Metal Gear reference)

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    I'm hoping after Apocalypse (where Scott/Jean/Storm are introduced as minor characters) that we get a trilogy set in the 90's with these three as the lead characters (sporting them 90's Jim Lee costumes ;) ).

    So I think after Apocalypse would be the perfect time to do Sinister, a Cyclops-centric villain, and to take a break from Magneto, at least for the first film (especially since we don't know if Fassy/McAvoy/Lawrence will stick around).
     
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    Last edited: Jun 4, 2014
  7. psylockolussus

    psylockolussus Well-Known Mutant

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    Level of threat? Maybe not.

    But for the story, of course he can, its up to the writers to give him a compelling story even if the scale of the film isn't so big.
     
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  8. DOBSON10

    DOBSON10 Custom User Title

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    I really hope we get to see Sinister on the big screen soon, one of my favorite villains of the Marvel world. It's overdue IMO.
     
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  9. CyclopsWasRight

    CyclopsWasRight Well, he was.

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    Since they are showing Apocalypse in the ancient past I'd love if they followed him through the years even in a long montage and we see him meeting Essex in the 1800s
     
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  10. psylockolussus

    psylockolussus Well-Known Mutant

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    Hmm as much as I want to see Sinister now, I feel like he needs to be the main villain and in Apocalypse that won't be the case.
     
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  11. Hamill-Joker

    Hamill-Joker Well-Known Member

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    We may get Sinister in a post-credits thing to set up the next movie.
     
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  12. OroroDaGoddess

    OroroDaGoddess Whether Witch

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    This is honestly the best idea and it would work perfectly. In the animated series (90's version) the had Apocalypse in the Past timeline and the future timeline.
     
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  13. psylockolussus

    psylockolussus Well-Known Mutant

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    Don't forget Wolverine 3. From 2016 to 2018, it could be the Apocalypse trilogy. With Apocalypse serving as behind-the-scene type of villain in Wolverine 3.

    Actually Shuler Donner brought up Days of Future Past when she was asked if we were gonna see the original cast again, then she said X4 leads to X5. Who knows if DOFP was her idea to X5 that she presented to Fox.
     
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  14. x-er

    x-er Well-Known Member

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    ^ I think it was. DOFP was X4 and Apocalypse was supposed to be X5. It's more or less what happens at the end of Wolverine & The X-Men (the time travel which is also mental and not physical) rewrites the timeline except it awakens apocalypse and changes some of the X-Men's allegiances.
     
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  15. GuestStar2004

    GuestStar2004 Well-Known Member

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    Kinberg says it was his idea to make Days of future past during planning out the story for FC2 with Vaughn who liked it who then spoke about it to fox who loved it
     
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    Last edited: Mar 5, 2015
  16. psylockolussus

    psylockolussus Well-Known Mutant

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    Days of Future Past was probably brought up during story sessions even before someone was hired to write the First Class sequel, so yeah DOFP could be LSD's original idea for X4. I don't think its just a coincidence that DOFP became the 4th X-Men film with the OT cast together again after X3. Then I guess X5 is set in the new future, if we ever get another film with the original cast.
     
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  17. Dasher10

    Dasher10 I'm like Deadpool IRL

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    I'd rather Sinister be a cameo along the lines of, "Oh, that guy at the orphanage who put Cyclops into Xavier's foster care is named Dr. Essex." Only fans would get it and we'd get Sabretooth working for Sinister instead of Magneto in the new timeline. That or Sabretooth would be a spy working with magneto and Gambit would be a spy working with Xavier.

    Sinister needs to be a villain the films build up to. He works best when he's manipulated everyone for years.

    I'd set up his backstory like this. In the 19th Century, he came into contact with Apocalypse who provided him with his advanced technology with the promise of cutting age research but Sinister abandoned him after Apocalypse demanded he create a plague to wipe out humanity and leave only mutants behind. Doctor Essex later worked as a spy withing British intelligence who infiltrated Auschwitz and rescued Magneto from Sebastian Shaw because he believed he found another superior being like himself who had nearly unlimited power and could never be kept as a mere test subject to be used and discarded. He brought him to the UK where young Erich was raised to adopt Essex's mutant supremacist views. He still created a virus which would destroy mutant and human alike as a parting gift which he hoped to kill Apocalypse with that would turn flesh into steel. Sadly Apocalypse adapted to it and Essex fled underground for several decades hoping to avoid his former master's wrath.

    He later resurfaced in the 1960s as a British intelligence officer tracking Erich's progress hunting down Essex's list of escaped Nazis who saw dispatched Moira MacTaggart to the United States in the hope of creating a team of mutant super soldiers with which he could eventually use in rogue operations to conquer the world. Sadly his plan failed when Magneto broke up the X-Men shortly after their formation.

    Essex later was forced underground where he lived under the alias Robert Windsor after the Sentinel project was greenlit. But now with Bolivar Trask and William Stryker out of the picture and the Sentinels being scrapped, he's able to maintain his position within the intelligence community. Particularly with regards to Weapon X project involving most Western Bloc nations.

    Now with a mutant in charge of the project, Weapon X no longer seeks to merely weaponize mutants but to create a new super race to defeat the Soviet Union with and once the war is over, rebel against the western nations to create a world ruled by mutantkind. He is now the one who allowed Wolverine to bond with adamantium and used him as a brainwashed assassin with other members of Team X consisting of Sabretooth, Maverick (who's now German instead of Canadian), Deadpool, Silverfox, Fantomex and Kestrel. (X-Men: Origins was actually a series of implanted memories designed to make Wolverine believe in Silverfox's death and completely omit Fantomex which would be a brilliant way of finding a way to make it canon.)

    Within Weapon X, Essex cloned the corpse of Emma Frost to create a new version with all her old memories. Three previous failed prototype clones were renamed the Stepforc Cookoos. Essex then developed a foster home for orphaned mutants where he could use them for experiments. Upon learning that Charles Xavier had reached Jean Grey before him, he allowed Cyclops to leave his care in favor of Xavier's in the hope that the two of them could produce a powerful mutant bloodline.

    Doctor Essex then befriended a thief from New Orleans who was forced out of the criminal underworld named Remy LeBeau who he used as a spy to infiltrate the X-Men and report their activity to Weapon X. With three of his most prized endeavors (Cyclops, Wolverine and Magneto) all under one roof, there was every incentive to monitor Charles Xavier until his victory over the X-Men was assured.

    That's his backstory. I'd rather he be something the films build up to like Thanos in the MCU who may make a few cameos here and there but always with a hidden agenda. I also want Essex to deliver the, "God among insects" line to a young Magneto in a flashback to the 1940s.

    And I'd also build up to his master plan this way with these being the films after X-Men: Apocalypse

    Gambit: 2016. Sinister will hopefully appear after the credits.

    2017: Wolverine 2. Hopefully the storyline will be an adaptation of Wolverine 27-30 with Omega Red replacing Pinnochio and Omega Red's motivations taken from Cable 9-11. Spider-Woman would be replaced with Multiple Man and Ted would be replaced with Maverick, the latter of whom reveals that Wolverine's memories are flawed and then begins to question his own as he saw Wolverine die back during the 1980s. Think along the lines of this, "I thought you'd look more like the locals out here and sound... you know... Canadian." "I thought you were American, Logan, and I distinctly remember killing you." It's made even more apparent when Omega Red recognizes both of them but neither have a clue who he is. Clearly both Chrisoph and Logan have tampered memories.

    X-Force: Late 2017. Cable is introduced. Stryfe and the Dark Riders are villains. Stryfe mentions that the future wasn't worth saving and to prevent it from ever occurring, he must destroy the past while confirming that Apocalypse rules the future.

    Deadpool 2: Early 2018. Black Tom refers to Wade as, "Essex's failed experiment."

    X-Men: X-Cutioner's Song: Mid 2018. Stryfe infects young Nathan Summers with the techno organic virus and mentions something along the lines of, "I refuse to allow either of them to win, Apocalypse, or the man who created this terrible, terrible virus. I will not allow myself to live to become a weapon." That hints that somebody other than Apocalypse created the techno organic virus despite Stryfe stealing the virus from Ship. Cable would also appear here.

    Continued below.
     
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    Last edited: Mar 16, 2015
  18. x-er

    x-er Well-Known Member

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    ^ In the original timeline, did they ever explain why the Sentinels were not present from X1 through X3 ?

    I'm thinking that, originally, X4 was DOFP leading into X5, Apocalypse.

    At that point, they probably wanted Singer & the OT cast back to full throttle, not knowing how successful the new cast would be. They decided to run "X4" as an "inbetweequel" and combine both casts to boost each other, but, because the newer cast is now in higher demand, rather than using the second treatment as "X5" it is being developped as FC3 (X-Men: Apocalypse).

    That's my guess anyway.
     
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    Last edited: Mar 16, 2015
  19. Smilodon

    Smilodon Well-Known Member

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    They were being built in the background. Xavier says it took them 50 years to develop the Mark X that we see in DOFP.
     
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  20. Dasher10

    Dasher10 I'm like Deadpool IRL

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    Silver Surfer: Late 2018. Not connected. Silver Surfer fights The Fallen One, preserves his home planet and becomes the new herald of Galactus.

    Wolverine: Enemy of the State: Early 2019. Logan goes in search of his memories by following the name Maverick gave him. A woman connected to Weapon X named Yuriko Oyama. Unfortunately, she's working for Donald Pierce who kidnaps Logan, brainwashes him and programs him to kill Col. Valerie Cooper. Kayla Silverfox (now a mercenary) finds Logan and undoes Pierce's brainwashing. This leads Logan to hunt down Pierce, Deathstrike and the other Reavers so he can get his revenge... and hopefully a few answers or two. (And yes, Silverfox is substituting for Elektra, Val Cooper is replacing Nick Fury and Donald Pierce and the Reavers are replacing Gorgon and The Hand due to rights issues.) Pierce would also mention something about the leader of Weapon X being a, "degenerate" which implies that he's a mutant.

    Fantastic Four 2: Mid 2019. Not connected unless it's a crossover. Galactus is here.

    X-Force: Assault on Weapon Plus: Late 2019. Sinister is finally the main villain alongside John Sublime and Malcolm Colcord. X-Force (with new addition Siryn) attack the Weapon X facility at Alkelai Lake, do battle with Ultomaton, Free Emma Frost and the Stepford Cookoos and recruit new members X-23 and Fantomex. Also appearing are the Marauders but they survive the film along with Sinister. Siryn also gets a chance to mourn over her father's frozen corpse.

    Deadpool 3: Early 2020. Deadpool fights T-Ray.

    X-Men: Messiah Complex: Mid 2020. Sinister finally reveals his hand in everything from the above post. Sinister's plan is to kidnap a small Morlock child who was born with nearly unlimited power. Sinister dispatches the Marauders to kidnap the child and leave no survivors. The X-Men enter the subway tunnels, evacuate the injured and battle the Marauders with Wolverine believing Sabretooth to be his brother yet Sabretooth believes he's Wolverine's father. Gambit betrays Sinister when he's outed as a spy and the audience expects him to betray the X-Men. Oh, but Bishop does betray the X-Men because the future he comes from was ruled by Sinister who took the child as his protege only for her to grow up to be his ultimate weapon. Cyclops begs to differ and the third act introduces Cable who does battle with Bishop while raising the child across time and space while Bishop hunts him.
     
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  21. dax

    dax Well-Known Member

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    In X1, the existence of mutants was made public recently as shown in the Capitol Hill scene (instead of 30 years earlier in DOFP). Even though Magneto and Mystique are the only mutants known to the government, as William Stryker pointed out, "Nobody really knows how many more mutants even exist or where and how to find them except for Xavier". It took the cerebro attack in X2 to expose the entire mutant population which led Warren Worthington Jr. (Angel's father) to create a cure for all mutants. After the attack on Alcatraz in X3 and the discovery that the cure was only temporary, the government decided that it was time to activate the Sentinels. Even though the Sentinels were not present in the original timeline, the X-men seem to be aware of its existence since the danger room sequence in X3 indicates that they've dealt with these machines before.
     
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  22. Sithborg

    Sithborg Oooh, plot twist!

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    As Stryker's files shows, that is clearly not the case. He had plenty of files of mutants, probably also gotten from his time working with Xavier. I'm also not sure how recent the public awareness of mutants is in X1. I think it is mainly that mutants are becoming more public, as their numbers increase.
     
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  23. GuestStar2004

    GuestStar2004 Well-Known Member

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    Kinberg has said in the past it was him who Came up with the idea of doing DOFP when he and Vaughn were planning out the story because they didn't fully know where to go with FC2 apart from have it be about a depressed charles, and donner has said in an interview they didn't wanna just make a sequel just for the sake of making a sequel it needed to be a cool idea

    thing about scripts like this talked about X4 and X5 is that it may not have even been fox's idea to do them, many scripts get written and then put forth to studios and they either buy them or reject them

    And fox most likely always wanted to make 3 films, infact it's hard to determine what fox wanted from it since bryan said in an interview there were plans for a first class movie even before he came onboard to direct it but it was gonna be about a young cyclops,Jean, beast and storm and bryan felt it wouldn't work unless you told the story of charles and eric first and that become FC
     
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  24. marvelrobbins

    marvelrobbins Well-Known Member

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    Thing Is they are likely BSing people.Kinberg saying the outline for DOFP was done memorial day 2012 says to me FC2 was going to be something else but after Avengers opened big Fox wanted something to involve both FC and OT casts.

    Donner had been wanting to do DOFP for years so who knows whose idea It truly was to do DOFP.

    FC was originally going to be about teenage Cyclops,Jean,sotrm,beast,and others.That was entire purpose for teenage cyclops and others found by Xavier in Origins.Singer wanted to do film on back story of Xavier and Magneto.

    as for the X4/X5 comments Donner made back In 2011 it may had been the early ideas of DOFP and Apocalypse she was talking about.
     
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  25. Super Jim

    Super Jim Well-Known Member

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    My hope is that Sinister is a secondary character in this movie. I would like to see him be the one that is working for Apocalypse and has created his present day Horsemen. Maybe it would only be one Horseman to replace one that is killed during an early scene. Of course that Horseman, Death, would be either Wolverine or Archangel (using my baby Angel being aged/transformed into Archangel).

    This introduces us to Sinister and sets him up for future movies and to be a future main villain.

    We could actually see Mystique bringing the body of Logan to Sinister early in the movie, in trade for something. What would Mystique be willing to trade the body of Logan for? How about information as to the location of a precog mutant named Destiny? She would be so important as to the mission that Mystique lives her life for (saving mutantkind) that giving one mutant (Wolverine) to Sinister in trade would be acceptible. It's a needs to the many outweigh the needs of the few concept. This could also lead to Mystique going to Xavier later in the movie to fix this mistake.

    I would use Gambit in this movie and first introduce him in Cairo where a young street theif with white hair steals his wallet. This would be comical since it would be a street thief attempting to steal from a master thief. A chase would ensue and Gambit would expose his powers to Storm in the process. This would get Storm to follow Gambit later that evening, now in uniform, to the Great Pyramid of Giza where he enters a secret entrance and goes to the inner sanctum, which is where Apocalypse (and possibly his Horsemen) are slumbering. He goes to do something at the controls, or whatever, which is when Storm enters the room and mistakenly sets off some alarm. This alarm awakens Apocalypse (and his Horsemen). When the Horseman Death goes to attack Storm Gambit's hand is forced and he uses his power to create a cave-in thus killing that Horseman. He then escapes with Storm and the pair are saved/picked up by the X-Men (who happened to be in Germany meeting/recruiting Nightcrawler). The awakening of Apocalypse created a disturbance on the mental plane enabling Xavier (and Jean?) to guide Beast to fly to Egypt in time to save Storm and Gambit.

    A lot of this matches with canon.

    It is after all of this when Apocalypse, who obviously knows Sinister, appears at Sinister's mansion/lab and his new Horseman Death is unveiled.

    That would be the last we see of Sinister until after the final battle. At this point we would see Sinister (or it could be Oxymandius - if he is in the movie) place the body of Apocalypse back into the regeneration chamber.

    Anyway, during a mid or post credit's scene we would get to see Gambit entering Sinister's mansion and giving to him the thing (could just be a computer information drive type device - or it could be the Techno-Organic Virus) that he stole from Apocalypse's inner sanctum at the beginning of the movie. This could set up a future X-Men movie, or a Gambit solo flick, or better yet, a Cable movie that takes place in the future (Adventures of Cyclops and Jean Grey)!
     
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