Why did we align ourselves with Israel anyways?

[Spider-Bite]

I need to know. How did this alliance with Israel begin anyways? In 1953 we overthrew Iranian's democractically elected President, and became allies with Israel. I know that Israel was re-founded about 50 years ago. A lot of Christains in the middle east did it because of what the bible says. They believed, and many still believe that God promised Israel to them, and it's supposedly prohpecized that Israelites will destroy the muslim nations in a great war, and when it's over Jesus will return. That's why they named it Israel. In the past attempts were made at fullfilling the prophecy but it failied and Israel was destroyed, confirming for many muslims, their own prohecies about the muslim armies defeating Israel.

But 50 years ago the United States came to the aid of Israel, after they killed people and stole their land, and ever since we've been locked in horrible realtions with the rest of the middle east, including Iran.

I know many Americans support Israel because they hate the same people that hate the U.S., but how did this alliance happen anyways?

I'm no historical expert but I can't help but think it was two reasons.

1. We chose sides based on religous belief. We chose to protect Christains because they were Christains, and wage war on muslims, because they were muslims.

2. In an effort to make sure the middle eastern oil doesn't get blown up in a big war, we have to try and meddle everywhere, and allies are valuable, and it was easier to allign ourselves with people of the same religion.

Who here is angry about the rescent Israeli terrorist attacks on lebannon? Or Israel, just a few months ago, violating a treaty, and building and expanding into the neutral zone between them and Lebannon? I'm also furious that the weapons used by Israel in their terrorist attacks had the words "Made in the U.S.A" printed on them, and not only that, but after the terrorist attacks began the Bush admininstration sped up the sales of weapons to Israel.

In addition why do we allow Israel to sit on 200 nuclear bombs, while we threaten Iran with war over the mere possiblity that they might have them 10 years from now?

Also why didn't Bush denounce Israel's inventing and using a brand new weapon of mass destruction. It's a bomb that spread microscopic shratenel over miles, and when lodged in a human it's undetectable or treatable by doctors. After a few days your body starts melting alive.

Obviously there is some history I don't know from about 50 years ago, but I can't help but think that the United States is extremely unfair in our treatment of Israel and it's enemies. Somebody want to tell me something I'm missing? Did we have a justifiable reason for going to war with Iran 50 years ago, and did we have a good reason for alligning ourselves with Israel?

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

'Cause the Zionists pwn America.
The Bankers. The Jewish Bankers!

 

[Mr Sparkle]

this will not end well.

 

[Spider-Bite]

Well with my post I'm merely searching for answers. With what I know now, I'd have to say Israel is not the bad guys, but they certainly aren't the good guys either.

 

[Spider-Bite]

To be clear I do not support Iran's idiocy either. it just looks to me like two bad guys are trying to kill each other, and we got in the middle of it and took sides with a bad guy.

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

There are no "good guys" on the planet.

 

[Spider-Bite]

There are no "good guys" on the planet.

I was about so say "unfortantely agreed" but then I thought of the Buddhist monestarys and Buddhist temples. They are completely against killing, torture, oppression, and war. And according to their religion it's ignorant to fall for the "God wants you to do this, God wants you to do that" mindset.

According to Buddhism nobody knows if God even exists, let alone his or her or it's will.

 

[mightiest_mortal]

hmm... the Israel vs Palestine battle...

well as Palestine VOTED IN this woman into their government....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egwz25fW0Co

Il side with Israel. Even with Iran, I think we caused most of their problems so should probably help sort them out.

 

[bulok]

In the past attempts were made at fullfilling the prophecy but it failied and Israel was destroyed, confirming for many muslims, their own prohecies about the muslim armies defeating Israel.

I stopped reading after this. Ever hear of a thing called the Six Day War?

Israel WTFPWNED Egypt, Iraq and Jordan all at the same time.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six-Day_War

In addition why do we allow Israel to sit on 200 nuclear bombs, while we threaten Iran with war over the mere possiblity that they might have them 10 years from now?

Because Iran would have no qualms over using it on Israel to wipe them from existence (and their leader have publicly said so themselves) and then guess who's next?


Besides, you don't see a bunch of "Jewish Extremists" screaming burn America, Die America everytime you hear someone saying something bad about YhWhH. Say something about Allah and you better be watching your back cos you know those "Islamic extremists" will find you.


Oh and as to why, well at the time when there was the Arab-Israeli war, guess who was providing the Arabs with their weapons and aircrafts? The Russians.

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

I stopped reading after this.

LIAR!

 

[bulok]

Haha well I responded after that part I am reading it as we speak but most of it is the same BS religion blah blah blah. Like the government nowadays do anything for religion.

Religious leaning in Politics is just that, politics. They don't believe in anything they say religion wise. They just go for who they can get the most votes from.

 

[mightiest_mortal]

Because Iran would have no qualms over using it on Israel to wipe them from existence (and their leader have publicly said so themselves) and then guess who's next?

Besides, you don't see a bunch of "Jewish Extremists" screaming burn America, Die America everytime you hear someone saying something bad about YhWhH. Say something about Allah and you better be watching your back cos you know those "Islamic extremists" will find you.

Summed up my feelins on the matter pretty well there

 

[Mr Sparkle]

LIAR!

ROFLMAOWTFPWNED!!!!

 

[Spider-Bite]

I stopped reading after this. Ever hear of a thing called the Six Day War?

Israel WTFPWNED Egypt, Iraq and Jordan all at the same time.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six-Day_War

Yes but Jesus never returned. The prophecy was never fullfilled. And untill fifty years ago Israel was not on the map.

Because Iran would have no qualms over using it on Israel to wipe them from existence (and their leader have publicly said so themselves) and then guess who's next?

What efforts has Israel made to keep the peace? I believe that if American lives are going to be used to protect them, than they need to act responsible and try to solve the situation peacefully. Unfortantely that makes me look like a hypocrite since my president does the exact opposite.
In addition that is a good reason for not wanting Iran to have nuclear weapons, but it still doesn't answer the part about why we let Israel sit on 200 nuclear bombs. I could see them using it on another country as an effort to steal their land or fullfill their religous prophecies.

Besides, you don't see a bunch of "Jewish Extremists" screaming burn America, Die America everytime you hear someone saying something bad about YhWhH. Say something about Allah and you better be watching your back cos you know those "Islamic extremists" will find you.

Israel has committed acts of terrorism. Whether you murder muslims or Americans, it's still murder and equally wrong. I wouldn't expect Israel to say that about us, since we give them weapons and help them out a lot.

Oh and as to why, well at the time when there was the Arab-Israeli war, guess who was providing the Arabs with their weapons and aircrafts? The Russians.

That's the reason? I can't believe we went to war and destroyed a democracy, instated a dictatorship there, for such a stupid reason. That is ridiculous, and it makes me furious at my ancestors.

 

[Dark Vigilante]

We support Israel because of the Jewish population in the United States. They're all voters, and most are pretty well off. Not to mention most of the big shots in entertainment, media, and banking are Jewish. And it was right after the Holocaust, when it became apparent that the Jews needed a homeland where they could be free of oppression.

 

[bulok]

Yes but Jesus never returned. The prophecy was never fullfilled. And untill fifty years ago Israel was not on the map.

You're thinking about the Zionist Christians. ALL Jews have to return home before the prophesy is fulfilled.

What efforts has Israel made to keep the peace?

After the Six Day War, Israel gave back the land they obtained from Egypt. I'd say that was a fair deal considering they kicked their asses.

I believe that if American lives are going to be used to protect them, than they need to act responsible and try to solve the situation peacefully.

I don't see Hamas doing anything to improve peace talks.

Israel has committed acts of terrorism. Whether you murder muslims or Americans, it's still murder and equally wrong. I wouldn't expect Israel to say that about us, since we give them weapons and help them out a lot.

They haven't done anything to us recently. That's all i care about. Call me selfish but we don't spend billions of tax dollars on the military to ensure peace for other countries. **** that.

That's the reason? I can't believe we went to war and destroyed a democracy, instated a dictatorship there, for such a stupid reason. That is ridiculous, and it makes me furious at my ancestors.

The Arabs bet on the wrong team. Simple as that, too bad for them.

USA!

 

[Spider-Bite]

We support Israel because of the Jewish population in the United States. They're all voters, and most are pretty well off. Not to mention most of the big shots in entertainment, media, and banking are Jewish. And it was right after the Holocaust, when it became apparent that the Jews needed a homeland where they could be free of oppression.

Okay that's a good reason, but why did they have to name it Israel? That's just asking for trouble. And why do we continue to assist Israel while they do things they shouldn't do?

Was Israel really safer though by killing Arabs and stealing their land? Was that necessary? Where did they come from to get to the land now known as Israel, and were those countries not willing to protect their own jewish citizens? Why didn't we offer an alliance to the countries that protected them? Did they live in Iran? That was a democracy at the time.

 

[Darthphere]

All these questions and more, answered on WIKIPEDIA!

Also, its anyway, not anyways, thats annoying.

 

[Mr Sparkle]

They haven't done anything to us recently. That's all i care about. Call me selfish but we don't spend billions of tax dollars on the military to ensure peace for other countries. **** that.



The Arabs bet on the wrong team. Simple as that, too bad for them.

USA!

AHAHAHAHAHA! t:
you completely missed the point.
the US de-stabilized the region. it's the reason the situation is as it presents to you now.
because OF the US.

 

[Spider-Bite]

You're thinking about the Zionist Christians. ALL Jews have to return home before the prophesy is fulfilled.




After the Six Day War, Israel gave back the land they obtained from Egypt. I'd say that was a fair deal considering they kicked their asses.

Yes that is a very fair deal. I'll admit that. But I still believe that in rescent times Israel is not making intelligent foreign policy decisions, and we are being dragged along.

I don't see Hamas doing anything to improve peace talks.

Are we offering portecting for Hamas though? That was my point. If were going to risk lives and spend money protecting somebody they better at least not act war crazy.

They haven't done anything to us recently. That's all i care about. Call me selfish but we don't spend billions of tax dollars on the military to ensure peace for other countries. **** that.

I believe it depends on the situation, and in the case of the middle east, I believe we need to get the hell out. I don't say your selfish for what you just said, but it would be selfish and wrong to to assist somebody in terrorism.

The Arabs bet on the wrong team. Simple as that, too bad for them.

USA!

I think it came to bite us in the ass on 9/11.

 

[Mr Sparkle]

The USA bet on the wrong team!
WTFPWED!

 

[bulok]

You ask why do we align ourselves with Israel, here's the answer plain and simple. We allied with them because the Arabs were allied with Russia back in the day.

Americans tend to keep their alliance until they've done something against us. We previously were helping Afghanistan and we know how that ended. Again, Israel to date has not done anything to jeopardize that alliance.

 

[Mr Sparkle]

LOL, I love how the internet people talk as if they were part of the opinion "we tend to" " do something to us..." it's like they were personally responsible for history unfolding as it has.
it's the "home team" mentality "we're playing against Kansas" , no moron, you're not playing at all, other people are making the calls and you're not getting the full info.
ha!

 

[Spider-Bite]

You ask why do we align ourselves with Israel, here's the answer plain and simple. We allied with them because the Arabs were allied with Russia back in the day.

Americans tend to keep their alliance until they've done something against us. We previously were helping Afghanistan and we know how that ended. Again, Israel to date has not done anything to jeopardize that alliance.

I appreciate the conversation and it was informative. Your answer is probably pretty close to the truth, even though in my own opinion Israel's instigative foreign policy should count as jeopardizing our alliance.

 

[Dark Vigilante]

Okay that's a good reason, but why did they have to name it Israel? That's just asking for trouble. And why do we continue to assist Israel while they do things they shouldn't do?

It's their country, so I suppose they can name it whatever they want. It just so happens that Israel of ancient times was once the homeland of the Jews, so when they got that territory back, thats what they called it. And when it comes to what Israel is doing wrong nowadays, one must look at the history of these people and its easy to see the justification. Does that make it right? I don't personally think so, but I can see why the Israelis do, and if I were in their situation I probably would.

Was Israel really safer though by killing Arabs and stealing their land? Was that necessary? Where did they come from to get to the land now known as Israel, and were those countries not willing to protect their own jewish citizens? Why didn't we offer an alliance to the countries that protected them? Did they live in Iran? That was a democracy at the time.

When the United Nations gave the Zionists their own country in 1948, this was it's borders. The area in yellow is the Jewish State, and the areas in grey is the Arab State. Jerusalem was deemed as an "international city" due to its religous importance, and governed by the United Nations itself. One can also see the Arabs got all of Jerusalems suberbs, quite the concession. The Zionists quickly agreed to the borders, even though their original plans for the country was a bit more ambitous. It was right after the Holocaust, and many Jews were thankful that they could even have a sliver of some sort of safe homeland. That would not be the case. The Arabs angrily refused the border drawings from the United Nations, and infact didn't want to share any land with the Jews. So shortly after the Zionists agreed to the borders of their new country, the Arabs invaded. In a war that lasted roughly a year, the outnumbered, underequpped, untrained, but fiercly determined Zionists not only repelled the armies of Egypt, Iraq, Syra, Lebanon, and Jordan, but conquered new territories, including Jerusalem. It would be the first event in a pattern of events in which Arab aggression would be met with Israeli counter-aggression.

In 1967, Egypt had blockaded Isreali ships from using the Strait of Tiran, had expelled the United Nations Emergency Force from the Sinai Peninsula, and rapidlly accelerated military activity along it's Israeli border. Israeli recon planes had photographed scores of tanks right over its border, poised to strike. Fearing an iminent invasion from Egypt, Israel pre-emptively attacked and invaded. In response, the armies of Jordan, Syria, and Iraq attempted to invade Israel. Algeria, Saudi Arabia, and Kuwait also provided troops. The Israelis made short work of all their opponents, and within six days had tanks in Cairo's front yard. They had also captured the West Bank, Gaza Strip, Golan Heights, and all of the Sinai Peninsula. After the war ended, Israel gave the Sinai Peninsula back to the Egyptians, but kept all the other territories.

When you know the history of Israel and it's Arab neighbors, it's fairly obvious that Israel has been aggressive only when threatened. They did not kill the Arabs and take their land. The United Nations gave them the land, and the Arabs didn't want them to have it. Israel has only expanded it's borders in campaigns that were incited by Arab aggression. The Six-Day War of 1967 forced Isreal to adopt a much more aggressive stance with it's neighbors, which we are seeing today. One must understand that Israel is still surrounded by enemies. The war with Lebannon this past summer was incited and irritated by Hizbollah, who are supported by Syria and Iran. We can argue all day long about wheter or not the Israelis are right in their actions, but what we must understand that they are doing what is necesary to keep themselves safe.