Will Zak Penn ruin Marvels future?

[Figs]

DACrowe, thanks for the info on Penn.

Never bothered to read too much into his background.

So basically, what I get from it is...he can write a fairly good plot outline and action scenes but definitely needs someone to go over and polish it with better dialogue.

The fact that he wrote Elektra and the FF movies is pretty sad.

 

[Raiden]

I still don't understand why Marvel keeps giving Penn the writing duties of their movies, even though his Elektra and FF turned out to be underwhelming and performed below expectation at the BO. Does Penn have some discriminating photos of Marvel's CEO or something?

 

[GNR]

okay seriously,why are people still insisting that Penn is writing Captain America?

several news outlets updated that story with Penn's reps stating that he IS NOT involved with Captain America

 

[Isildur´s Heir]

IMO, the one thing that can ruin Marvels future is Marvel Productions, and bet that, if things don´t change, it will.
The Incredible Hulk is a lousy movie, and Iron Man works well because it as a good script and an AMAZING cast (Downey Jr, Bridges and Paltrow are simple amazing), both are hardly great movies.
And that´s the problem, Marvel Productions main interest is in making the movies equal to the comics, not about making it equal AND good, and there is where it fails.

Of course that fanboys will love it death, because with all the winks and action sequences, it´s a wet dream come true....

 

[Isildur´s Heir]

BTW, when i say "equal" to the comics, i say about the all comic book feel, characters, action and whatnot, not because the characters are equal to their comic book counterpart, because in that department, they can´t get it more wrong.

 

[Chewy]

IMO, the one thing that can ruin Marvels future is Marvel Productions, and bet that, if things don´t change, it will.
The Incredible Hulk is a lousy movie, and Iron Man works well because it as a good script and an AMAZING cast (Downey Jr, Bridges and Paltrow are simple amazing), both are hardly great movies.
And that´s the problem, Marvel Productions main interest is in making the movies equal to the comics, not about making it equal AND good, and there is where it fails.

Of course that fanboys will love it death, because with all the winks and action sequences, it´s a wet dream come true....

Nice. Come into a thread about Zak Penn to bash TIH because you disliked it. TIH was far from a lousy movie. It wasn't perfect, but it was far from lousy. I just find it funny that the 15 or so people who disliked TIH (according to the Rate & Review thread) feel the need to go into any and every thread to state how "stupid" it was. It's one thing to bring it up in a relevant thread, for instance one about the Hulk, but to do it here - in a thread about what possible reason there is for Zak Penn to be attached to Avengers - is borderline ridiculous.

Christ, I dislike trolls.

 

[Isildur´s Heir]

Do you feel inferior or something because you like TIH, to the point of actually making a reply defending it, when there was no point on doing so?
I talked about both movies, not TIH alone, and that was to explain why i think Marvel Productions might ruin Marvel movies.

But i understand what´s you problem.....

but to do it here - in a thread about what possible reason there is for Zak Penn to be attached to Avengers

....you clearly can´t read

Not only did i stated, right at the begining of my post, that it´s my opinion (hence the IMO), the thread is about Penn ruining Marvels future, not about him attached to Avengers alone (hence the title: Will Zak Penn ruin Marvels future? )

 

[Chewy]

Do you feel inferior or something because you like TIH, to the point of actually making a reply defending it, when there was no point on doing so?

I don't even know how to respond to that. I can't see the relation between stating TIH wasn't lousy and me feeling inferior. Maybe the problem is that you feel superior, hmm?

But i understand what´s you problem.....


....you clearly can´t read

Not only did i stated, right at the begining of my post, that it´s my opinion (hence the IMO), the thread is about Penn ruining Marvels future, not about him attached to Avengers alone (hence the title: Will Zak Penn ruin Marvels future? )

???

And how would Penn ruin Marvel's future? By being attached to Avengers. I realize I'm bringing in outside information that (gasp!) isn't in the thread's title, I'm sorry.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

well to be fair... his X3 script was actually good... it's just Fox that messed it up and i guarantee they did the same with FF

 

[DACrowe]

Killing off Cyclops? Curing Rogue and having her turn her back on her mutanthood after the centerpiece of the first movie (and thus a main plotline of the trilogy) was her embracing her powers? Having Magneto turn his back on Mystique after five seconds without a moment's hesitation, so as to write her out? Having all supporting bad guy mutants have no personality, thoughtsw or free will of their own (including Juggernaut)? Giving Angel about five lines the whole movie and regulating all dialogue between characters into nothing more than interchangable cliches?

I think we can thank Penn and Kinberg for those.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Killing off Cyclops? Curing Rogue and having her turn her back on her mutanthood after the centerpiece of the first movie (and thus a main plotline of the trilogy) was her embracing her powers? Having Magneto turn his back on Mystique after five seconds without a moment's hesitation, so as to write her out? Having all supporting bad guy mutants have no personality, thoughtsw or free will of their own (including Juggernaut)? Giving Angel about five lines the whole movie and regulating all dialogue between characters into nothing more than interchangable cliches?

I think we can thank Penn and Kinberg for those.

Penn is a hack and idiot, who seems to think all his movies are perfect when he couldnt be more wrong, i liked TIH, but it obvious Norton made plenty of change's to the dialoogue.

If Marvel is smart they will remove Penn from ALL future projects.

 

[Rac]

well to be fair... his X3 script was actually good... it's just Fox that messed it up and i guarantee they did the same with FF

Have you actually read it?

 

[jaymes_e06]

Lets just say I'm so glad he was taken off the Young X-Men movie and replaced with Josh Schwartz he great on all his shows.

 

[BloodyWolverine]

My guess is we have no idea who the Director will be for the Avengers just yet so lets wait and see our judegments first. Iron Man was done by Marvel and it was great. Its funny TIH gets the hate and IM gets love. I think both films are in pefect sink and it Was Ang Lees Hulk that hurt this film not Zak Penn's writing for The Incredible Hulk. And to be honest X-Men 3 was good and it made most money of the 3 x-men films.

 

[BloodyWolverine]

I think people are leaving off x-men 2 to his reseme and X2 is one of the best comic book movies out there. The Avengers needs David Koepp if ask me.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Where did this Penn on Cap thing come from? I have also seen this put down. Last person we know was on Cap (still might be) is Self.

As for him doing Avengers, that is a whatever thing to me cause it isn't due out until 2011 (maybe later if delayed). Penn will at least give us a story outline for the movie to follow, and the people rewriting it will improve the dialogue and such. It is not that big of a deal. I want the Iron Man people to focus on IM2, not the Avengers. So, I say bring in an new writer for Avengers (someone who has not worked for Marvel prior) to rewrite it once Penn has laid the outline of events. Penn will give us the outline, future rewriters will give the movie its soul. That's what happened with TIH (which I loved), so I am confident it will happen again. He is a fast worker, and to get Avengers out in 2011, we need at least a basic story FAST. No way around that. That makes it easier on any future writer Avengers to get a final script done.

And again, Penn has been said not to be on Cap, so stop saying he is.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

My guess is we have no idea who the Director will be for the Avengers just yet so lets wait and see our judegments first. Iron Man was done by Marvel and it was great. Its funny TIH gets the hate and IM gets love. I think both films are in pefect sink and it Was Ang Lees Hulk that hurt this film not Zak Penn's writing for The Incredible Hulk. And to be honest X-Men 3 was good and it made most money of the 3 x-men films.

Oh it must be good then . Bad movies never make money do they?

I think people are leaving off x-men 2 to his reseme and X2 is one of the best comic book movies out there. The Avengers needs David Koepp if ask me.

His X2 script was VASTLY different to the finished product.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Killing off Cyclops? Curing Rogue and having her turn her back on her mutanthood after the centerpiece of the first movie (and thus a main plotline of the trilogy) was her embracing her powers? Having Magneto turn his back on Mystique after five seconds without a moment's hesitation, so as to write her out? Having all supporting bad guy mutants have no personality, thoughtsw or free will of their own (including Juggernaut)? Giving Angel about five lines the whole movie and regulating all dialogue between characters into nothing more than interchangable cliches?

I think we can thank Penn and Kinberg for those.

actually.... Killing off cyclops (off screen, which means possible come back in comic world) was probably the best option rather then just not having him in it at all. You can blame fox for the cyclops non inclusion. Penn did the best he could to get around that road block. Rogue cure was written 2 ways. It was up to the director to pick which he liked best. her taking or not taking the cure. He (and or the studio) chose curing herself. I felt the magneto turning his back on mystique, was very in character for him imo... writing her out not the best, but i felt it was very moving.

 

[BloodyWolverine]

Oh it must be good then . Bad movies never make money do they?



His X2 script was VASTLY different to the finished product.

I just sayin i liked X-3 fine and it was amazing some scenes. If no one likes the Xavier death scene or bridge sequence then thats sad for that was wicked cool.
Also Avengers are differant from captain america. Also there are usually alot of writers on one movie.
So Penn should get all the bad credit.

 

[DACrowe]

I think people are leaving off x-men 2 to his reseme and X2 is one of the best comic book movies out there. The Avengers needs David Koepp if ask me.

As I said there were over a dozen drafts for X2. I've heard anywhere between 15-25. Penn wrote ONE early draft that introduced characters to the story (Lady Deathstrike, I believe) and maybe the tornado airplane sequence. There may have been more, but I hear they only took ideas he had and used them, but he had almost nothing to do with the finished film.

His past team film works where he wasn't heavily rewritten or discarded are Fantastic Four, Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer and X3. Not a strong resume. But he also wrote Elektra and Inspector Gadget to be fair.

 

[DACrowe]

actually.... Killing off cyclops (off screen, which means possible come back in comic world) was probably the best option rather then just not having him in it at all. You can blame fox for the cyclops non inclusion. Penn did the best he could to get around that road block. Rogue cure was written 2 ways. It was up to the director to pick which he liked best. her taking or not taking the cure. He (and or the studio) chose curing herself. I felt the magneto turning his back on mystique, was very in character for him imo... writing her out not the best, but i felt it was very moving.

First, killing off Cyclops was a terrible decision. He could have been in X3, but Fox didn't want Mardsen back and wanted to punish him for doing SR. Look what else came that summer, Ian McKellan managed to be in X3 and The DaVinci Code because X3 was shot so late, most filming for the other pictures had finished. They could have accomdated Mardsen like McKellan but chose not to, so we get the character killed off. Fox also wanted Wolverine (Hugh Jackman) more center and wanted to write out "the other man," even though technically Logan was the other man.

Curing off Rogue was a terrible decision that all agreed upon. It should NEVER have been an option. As for Mystique. That was just shoddy writing. If they wanted to write her character out of the movie, fine. But they could have done it in a moving way. Have her cured and Magneto try to care for her, but she is extremely sad and Magneto kills her and uses her death to galvanize her supporters, etc. The relationship Singer built up between the two in X2 was a great one and for him to walk away from her in the same breath he says "You saved me!" was ridiculous. It was shoddy writing and unemotional because it rang out of character and hollow. Just as that whole scene where all the "bad mutants" join Magneto without asking questions or having any personalities or motivations of their own. They were there for SFX and the movie was blunt about as the writers didn't even try to explain them. Nor did they explain Magneto's actions well because it was out of character...like Wolverine becoming a team leader, Xavier talking like an ******* to his proteges, Rogue deciding to cure herself, etc.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

First, killing off Cyclops was a terrible decision. He could have been in X3, but Fox didn't want Mardsen back and wanted to punish him for doing SR. Look what else came that summer, Ian McKellan managed to be in X3 and The DaVinci Code because X3 was shot so late, most filming for the other pictures had finished. They could have accomdated Mardsen like McKellan but chose not to, so we get the character killed off. Fox also wanted Wolverine (Hugh Jackman) more center and wanted to write out "the other man," even though technically Logan was the other man.

Curing off Rogue was a terrible decision that all agreed upon. It should NEVER have been an option. As for Mystique. That was just shoddy writing. If they wanted to write her character out of the movie, fine. But they could have done it in a moving way. Have her cured and Magneto try to care for her, but she is extremely sad and Magneto kills her and uses her death to galvanize her supporters, etc. The relationship Singer built up between the two in X2 was a great one and for him to walk away from her in the same breath he says "You saved me!" was ridiculous. It was shoddy writing and unemotional because it rang out of character and hollow. Just as that whole scene where all the "bad mutants" join Magneto without asking questions or having any personalities or motivations of their own. They were there for SFX and the movie was blunt about as the writers didn't even try to explain them. Nor did they explain Magneto's actions well because it was out of character...like Wolverine becoming a team leader, Xavier talking like an ******* to his proteges, Rogue deciding to cure herself, etc.

There was alot of selfish movie politics involved on both fox and singers parts... but penn (as most of us agreed) cyclops needed it be in X3, he's admitted he wanted cyclops to be a big part of it, but fox wouldnt let marsden. james (from what i understand) even filmed his parts for free which is why he was able to be in the little bit he was. Very Very little of that had to do with penn.

i dont find mystiques shoddy writing at all.. mystique has always been more of a lone wolf.. doing what she pleases. and personally if there was ever to be another movie that would include mystique, penn wrote a great way to expand on her character. Mystique is not Magneto's ***** in the comics. and by magneto turning on her, and her then turning on him is the perfect "woman scorned" motif. Especially because from the end of X3 we clearly see the cure is not permanent, which means when mystiques powers kick back in she now can be the vengeful lone wolf she has always been.

I think Penn wrote X3 setting up alot for future installments. but the 2 biggest faults with X3 were Fox and Ratner... those were it's top downfalls. Fox wanted to much and not enough at the same time. and Ratner and character development alone suck, as well as his movie ADD.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

All you need is a good script... and we know that Penn can not deliver and that's all there is too it. I mean look at this guy... Elecktra??? TLS??? FF??? Is this supposed to be an impressive resume? We all know what the deal was with TIH. The fact that this guy is coming anywhere near Cap AND AVengers blows my freaking mind.

Same here.

 

[Rac]

As I said there were over a dozen drafts for X2. I've heard anywhere between 15-25. Penn wrote ONE early draft that introduced characters to the story (Lady Deathstrike, I believe) and maybe the tornado airplane sequence. There may have been more, but I hear they only took ideas he had and used them, but he had almost nothing to do with the finished film.

And that's what angered Penn, because Singer only liked on or two of his ideas. Then he went all cry baby to the WGA (just like with TIH) and got the story credit.

 

[kedrell]

I don't think any of his scripts were good(yes, even TIH) and Marvel should ditch him fast as they can. But I've lost all faith in Marvel so I don't think they'll do that.