X-men Forum Debate #7: "The X-men as a TEAM"

[javon]

-In the comics, the X-men has had tons of different counter-parts, which called for entirely different teams to be consisted of. Some of these teams were just "put together", and some were their because certaint writers felt that they would do justice for others on the team.

-In terms of X-men: The Last Stand, did the team in this movie "work"? Were the correct characters fit to be in the team? What do/did they offer? Which characters, in your opinion, should the team had been consisted of? And last, did this team have a good chance of stopping the "big bad" of the movie?

 

[javphonic]

I think the team is logical in terms of the trilogy, otherwise tons of new characters would have been added w/o using people who've cameoed in the 1st 2

So I think it worked logically

Only thing though Storm should have been in command instead of Logan and Rogue should've been there

 

[flavio_lebeau]

I don't quite like the X3 team. Especially how random Colossus seems in it. The entire trilogy lacks a good display of team work, and the "let's cure Magneto" strategy was kinda poor imo.

I think the best team as of yet has to be the one in the President Room in X2 (just add Jean Grey to that). The possibilites for team work using those characters were endless, but unfortunately they were never either fully or intelligently explored.

Given that, X3 does have the scenes that approch most closely to a good team work. The deleted scene of Logan and Storm helping each other, as goofy as it may be, shows a glimpse of what should be a common thing in these movies. X1 and X2 have barely any team work, although the lone displays of power are excelent.

This is a point in which not only X3, but the entire trilogy did not deliver.

 

[Obsidian]

The X-Men weren't much of a team as much as they were foot soldiers holding a line of defense. The only teamwork I saw in the last battle was when Colossus, Beast, and Wolverine came together and took out Magneto.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

-In the comics, the X-men has had tons of different counter-parts, which called for entirely different teams to be consisted of. Some of these teams were just "put together", and some were their because certaint writers felt that they would do justice for others on the team.

-In terms of X-men: The Last Stand, did the team in this movie "work"? Were the correct characters fit to be in the team? What do/did they offer? Which characters, in your opinion, should the team had been consisted of? And last, did this team have a good chance of stopping the "big bad" of the movie?

In terms of the characters chosen, yes, I believe it works, because the movies need the big guns, not the unrecognizable characters that only fans would know.

In terms of the movie-verse, as was said by a poster earlier, all the selections make sense. Wolverine and Storm for obvious reasons. Iceman has been developing into an X-Man the entire time, Xavier's quip to the President at the end of X2 about "let's just say I know a little girl who can walk through walls" indicates that he has Kitty Pryde already doing tasks for the team, and Colossus' actions in X2 to help save the children would definatley warrant him a shot at being part of the X-Men.

So my only problems with the team selection in X-Men: The Last Stand were how Nightcrawler disappeared, and Gambit never got included. That, and how Angel never became a part of the team going to Alcatraz.

 

[Abaddon]

Rogue was pretty useless, and I do not see why she was promoted to the team.

 

[Storm22]

I think Rogue and Kitty could have been a really effective team. Kitty could have kept Rogue in stealth mode allowing her to get close enough to mutants in Alcatraz and then Rogue could absorb their powers.

They should have had Rogue totally absord some random mutants power either accidentally or deliberately in X2 or X3 though, giving her strength and flight abilities.

 

[demitri_vampiro]

the team in x-3 was good. also the movie had best team work. the team however should have been bigger and more powers should have been used by both x-men and the brotherhood. also, pyro should have made some fireshapes and iceman should have done his ice slide when entering alcatraz instead just holding to kitty.
i just hope that for the next movie they will take their time to perfect the sript and do enough prep work and not just rush it.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

iceman should have done his ice slide when entering alcatraz instead just holding to kitty.

I agree, that would have been wicked.

 

[LastSunrise1981]

I agree, that would have been wicked.

Ashmore said they did film the Ice Slide. Obviously it never made the final cut.

 

[Angamb]

Ashmore said they did film the Ice Slide. Obviously it never made the final cut.

Really?? where he said that??

please, a link.

 

[X-Maniac]

Working as a team to me suggests discussion to plan a strategy in which each person has a role.

We saw that at the end of X1 when Rogue was in the machine and they decided to send Wolverine up there. It was on-the-spot strategy, but an attempt at showing teamwork to beat the enemy.

Jean and Storm obviously had a strategy to capture Nightcrawler in the church in X2, and the X-Men and Magneto/Mystique devised a strategy to get into the dam and when they got into the control room.

In X3, Storm berates Wolverine 'We work as a team' in the Danger Room though there isn't that much evidence of it. Storm saves Wolverine, Colossus protects Rogue, Kitty saves Iceman... not really strategy or teamwork, but they generally looked out for each other.

Teamwork between Wolverine and Storm in the cut scene at Jean's house when Wolverine asked Storm to conduct lightning through his claws to knock out Juggernaut.

Wolverine's 'hold this line' on Alcatraz implies teamwork, though we aren't made aware of any planned strategy. Storm separates Magneto's army from the soldiers with lightning blasts, which may or may not have been discussed beforehand as strategy.

Then, Storm, Beast, Colossus and Wolverine team up to defeat Magneto, also involving Iceman to distract and fight Pyro. Definite strategy and teamwork there.

 

[Angamb]

Deninetly, each film had its bits of teamwork, like xmaniac say, but wasn't teamwork at all, it was more moments with two x-men here, two x-men there, but not all the team together, with each one using his power, and without any star of the team, like Logan seems to be in all the trilogy.

The most teamwork was in X1, like xmaniac has said, at the end, was short, yes, but was the complete team. X2 and X3 hadn't an action momment with the full team.

I've hopes that X4 will show teamwork more than ever. We only can wait.

 

[BMM]

The finale of The Last Stand doesn't feature the correct characters. Characters like Beast, Colossus, and Kitty Pryde have zero interaction with each other and that's half the team. Colossus could have walked off the edge of Alcatraz and I'm pretty sure Storm wouldn't have even known she had lost a team member.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

Team work is more than just combining powers together for one special attack. Teamwork is each member working individually for a goal that benefits the whole.

There was teamwork in X2, it just wasn't blatant, in your face, side by side combining of powers. But each member had a role, that if not fulfilled, the team would have failed:

Magneto, Mystique, and Jean Grey needed to find Cerebro and shut it down. Storm and Nightcrawler needed to find the children and save them. Sure, Wolverine went off on his own, because he put his own interests ahead of the team and wasn't a team player.

If the entire team would have stuck together, then they would have only been able to accomplish 1 goal: either save the children, and leave Xavier, in which all the world's mutants would die anyways (along with the children they just saved), or all go after Xavier and allow the children to remain trapped in Stryker's prison.

But sometimes the best teamwork is to split off individually and work towards different goals that benefit the entire team.

I understand that many people wanted to see a specific type of teamwork (I.E. what we saw at the end of X-Men; all the mutants combining their powers for 1 goal - to save Rogue and stop Magneto), but that's not the only type of teamwork there is, and just because we didn't get it doesn't mean there wasn't teamwork.

 

[MoPlaYa]

I agree that best display of teamwork came when Colossus, Beast and Wolverine cured Magneto.

They should have shown more of the team working together during the last battle. Angel and Rogue should have been with the team for the last battle.
Once Fox figures out the X-Men are about teamwork and not star power...then and only then will they make a great X-Men movie

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

They really need to take a cue from the Fantastic Four films on how to manage superhero teamwork on screen.

 

[LastSunrise1981]

Really?? where he said that??

please, a link.

It was a long time ago. I don't have the link on me and I'm sure it's on this forum somewhere buried within the many threads.

Ashmore and Page were conducting an interview regarding the final battle sequence. Ashmore said they filmed the ice slide which in his words was "very expensive". Page also confirmed this and echoed his sentiments regarding the ice slide.

 

[Angamb]

ohhh, would love to see a behind the scenes of that, at least, or an animatic, like the DVD.

And where do you think they would have use it? arriving to Alcatraz? or in another momment of the final battle?

 

[Arkady Rossovich]

I dont think the X-Men were acting like a team in the third film.With Cyclops dead so early,and Phoenix being used(poorly) and Storm being forced to take a more leadership role..Wolverine also being the focus of the film.There was no united front.

 

[Goddessreicho]

The finale of The Last Stand doesn't feature the correct characters. Characters like Beast, Colossus, and Kitty Pryde have zero interaction with each other and that's half the team. Colossus could have walked off the edge of Alcatraz and I'm pretty sure Storm wouldn't have even known she had lost a team member.

Your forgetting that it wasn't Storm's team to begin with. Duh! If Colossus walked off the end of the island WOLVERINE wouldn't have noticed because the very last thing on his mind was the safety of everyone else. His priority was HIS "true" love.

Remember it was HIS team under HIS command.

 

[JP]

While they had awesome characters.. it all boiled down to Wolverine. They didn't feel like a team.

I agree with Lightning. They need to take a cue from FF. Sure, they only have 4 to work with, but looking at X3 they're only working with one. None of the younger members felt like they were part of a 'team'. Even Storm.. with as many new lines as she had, didn't feel as important as Wolverine.

 

[oneteen]

The individual screen time of each character was sort of split up into diff. segments. I just watched F4:Rise of SS and let me tell you that had team all over the movie.

 

[MoPlaYa]

F4:ROTSS learned from X3`s mistakes

 

[Storm22]

X2 and X1 didn't have much in the way of teamwork and neither did X3 but I don't think the movies suffer much as a result. The X-Men movies have much more depth/emotion and individual struggles than the Fantastic Four movies and are much better as a result imo.