The Dark Knight Rises You Have My Permission To Lounge - Part 8

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[shauner111]

Dude I'm right there with you. I loved Logan and I'll see Deadpool 2 and Guardians 2 because I had such a good time with the first installments. But the Guardians trailers don't show the story at all and I'm worried it's going to be a repeat of the first, just with baby groot and Kurt Russell tossed in there. Same with Deadpool.

I don't care about Ragnarok, Homecoming, Justice League, another Dr Strange movie, Aquaman, Shazam, Green Lantern, new X-Men movies or Wonder Woman (thanks to Gadot and Snyder producing).

I'm interested in Matt Reeves directing Batman. I'm interested in Ryan Coogler directing Black Panther. But that's about it at this point.

Unless Marvel/Sony can create an awesome one-two punch with a Spidey vs Venom, and then Carnage set of films...I don't think I'll give a damn about the future of the MCU. Even Avengers 3 and 4 gives me a bad feeling, like they're going to be a HUGE mess, with a laughable villain in both movies.

So maybe I'm jaded too.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

I read lots of comic books and watch cartoons, for me to say I'm tired of the superhero genre when it comes to movies feel like disjointed thinking on my end, so personally I'll try to not say that.

One good thing I'll say for Homecoming though; Batman in a heavy hitting flying armor taking out Spider-Man I can take more seriously than a pudgy middle aged man with bionic tentacles attached to his spine.

 

[shauner111]

Sure but I'm just sick of seeing a villain with powers, powered suit, whatever...going after the hero and city just because. They didn't sell me on the Vulture just like the comics never sold me on the Vulture. He was the silliest villain to me as a kid along with Rhino. And now these two are rogues featured in the two most recent Spider-Man movies.

I'm also absolutely sick and tired of directors NOT shooting scenes in camera, when they can do so. Like Snyder's outdoor shots, batmobile scenes. Or the new Spidey trailer. I HATE it. That kind of crap immediately takes me out of a movie. It's beyond distracting.

 

[DACrowe]

Honestly, I just find myself caring less and less about this genre with each passing day. It's really run its course, IMO. I'm not saying it should (or could) go away forever, but it needs a few years off to recharge its batteries. Problem is we all still compulsively go out and see these movies because they've become such a ubiquitous part of our pop culture, so Hollywood has no choice but to keep churning them out. I've been slowly waning myself off (still haven't seen Doctor Strange, skipped Apocalypse in theaters...recently watched the first half on HBO though- WOW is it terrible).

Logan was a nice exception to the rule, but if I'm brutally honest I really don't care much about Homecoming OR Justice League, and the trailers did nothing to change that. I totally agree with Shika that Civil War seemed better at first than it probably was, and I've had no desire to go rewatch it because like most Marvel films, it has little lasting emotional impact. I'm still rooting for Wonder Woman because the character deserves something iconic (that's probably asking for too much but we'll see). The Guardians 2 trailers didn't even do much for me, it feels like all the novelty is gone and it did nothing to sell me on the story. I really don't know if it's just me becoming a jaded old grump, or if these movies just aren't cutting the mustard anymore, but I can't ignore the overwhelming sense of MEH I feel towards all of it. It's been that way for a while, but this latest crop of trailers really have taken it to a new level to where I'm starting to consider putting my money where my mouth is and skipping all of these movies.

Dude I'm right there with you. I loved Logan and I'll see Deadpool 2 and Guardians 2 because I had such a good time with the first installments. But the Guardians trailers don't show the story at all and I'm worried it's going to be a repeat of the first, just with baby groot and Kurt Russell tossed in there. Same with Deadpool.

I don't care about Ragnarok, Homecoming, Justice League, another Dr Strange movie, Aquaman, Shazam, Green Lantern, new X-Men movies or Wonder Woman (thanks to Gadot and Snyder producing).

I'm interested in Matt Reeves directing Batman. I'm interested in Ryan Coogler directing Black Panther. But that's about it at this point.

Unless Marvel/Sony can create an awesome one-two punch with a Spidey vs Venom, and then Carnage set of films...I don't think I'll give a damn about the future of the MCU. Even Avengers 3 and 4 gives me a bad feeling, like they're going to be a HUGE mess, with a laughable villain in both movies.

So maybe I'm jaded too.

But actually yes, I know where y'all are coming from. I feel nothing looking at the trailers for Spidey and Justice League. But that is because unless you do something radically different with the Spidey character (a film like Kraven's Last Hunt, or explore the Spider-Marriage, something like that), it is just retreading itself and VERY familiar ground, even if Marvel and Tom Holland are giving us the best representation of that character.

And Justice League is a Zack Snyder movie, so....

But I think Logan proves you can do different things with the genre--even familiar characters--and make great, startling movies with them. The problem is Marvel and WB are refusing to even try. Nolan did, and in his absence it feels like the genre has stalled and is mostly chasing Marvel Studios "shared universe" energy, which I suspect will feel quite played out after Infinity War and most of the cast that started this thing--particularly Downey--will be out the door.

But you can do new things with it. I remain curious about Guardians 2, because I like the first one and it feels like Gunn has more latitude this time to do something really original with it. I am happy we are finally getting a Wonder Woman movie, so by default I am rooting for it. As you guys mentioned, Deadpool 2 offers a chance to further deconstruct and subvert the genre.

At this point, just treat each one on a case by case basis. We are well past the point of feeling compelled to see something in order to support a genre or concept that has reached its saturation point.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

Sure but I'm just sick of seeing a villain with powers, powered suit, whatever...going after the hero and city just because. They didn't sell me on the Vulture just like the comics never sold me on the Vulture. He was the silliest villain to me as a kid along with Rhino. And now these two are rogues featured in the two most recent Spider-Man movies.

At least we didn't get more than two scenes with Rhino, looking at how they made him a character from a 60s cartoon for the movie he was featured in.

I'm also absolutely sick and tired of directors NOT shooting scenes in camera, when they can do so. Like Snyder's outdoor shots, batmobile scenes. Or the new Spidey trailer. I HATE it. That kind of crap immediately takes me out of a movie. It's beyond distracting.

You mean the more use of green screen for shots that could've been done filming outdoors?

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Some of you seem to be going through the phase I went through a few years ago. Now I learned to just watch what interests me and ignore the rest. I never saw Ant-man or Doctor Strange. Not interested.

I will check out all the superhero films this year though. Already seen Logan. Loved it. Spider-man looks pedestrian, but he is Spidey, so I will always have an interest. Thor 3 just seems intriguing. I can't wait to see what Taika might cook up. Not terribly interested in Wonder Woman, but am hoping for it to do well as the first major Superhero movie.

Justice League I am interested in the same way you would be interested in a slow motion car crash. just how terrible can Snyder make it.

So I am now at a point where I skip the ones that doesn't interest me. Watch the really good and really bad ones.

 

[shauner111]

Yup that's exactly what I mean Aziz.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

About the CGI, in the Justice League trailer, there is a scene (much lauded by brainless fanboys) where Batman summersaults in and throws what seems to be an explosive at a parademon (or whatever it was).

The loose, rubbery movement tells me it was CGI. Why?

It's just a summersault. You couldn't do it for real? Even in TDK (the hong kong sequence) you see a real stunt person crash and summersault through a window.

In BVS, you have the iconic TDKR lightning shot and that was tainted by CGI. It was just swinging from one ledge to another. How dependent on CGI must you be to leave that up to animators.

Same with homecoming. The CGI suit looks so glaringly bad.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

Some of you seem to be going through the phase I went through a few years ago. Now I learned to just watch what interests me and ignore the rest. I never saw Ant-man or Doctor Strange. Not interested.

To me, these two films are examples of the pleasant surprise.
A movie about a shrinking man talking to ants doesn't grab me as an idea, the execution is not only better than Man of Steel, it's a lot of joy.

 

[shauner111]

I'm really not a fan of that suit. The Maguire suit was perfection. Even the suit in Amazing Spider-Man 2 looks better.

Am I the only one who hates how Iron Man helps Spidey in that scene? I thought Tony was going to have a few scenes in the film, nothing more. As just TONY STARK. I don't like Peter worshipping Tony. And I don't want another crossover. I'm here for a Spider-Man movie. Get Iron Man out of there!

This shared universe trend is the worst. Can't wait for it to end.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

No, I am fine with that. Spider-man is going through an arc. He got his fancy new toys and suit from Iron Man and thinks that is what defines him. He gets crashed back down to Earth once he fails spectacularly and has to talked sense into by Stark, a man who himself once thought the same (IM3).

He then dons his old duds without any of the upgrades and manages to save the day this time. Proving what makes Peter a hero is not the suit, but his heroism and bravery.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

To me, these two films are examples of the pleasant surprise.
A movie about a shrinking man talking to ants doesn't grab me as an idea, the execution is not only better than Man of Steel, it's a lot of joy.

The commonality between the two films is that they are formulaic origin pictures. I can't muster enough excitement for those anymore. Heck, I got bored by origin stories during phase 1 of MCU.

 

[DACrowe]

Some of you seem to be going through the phase I went through a few years ago. Now I learned to just watch what interests me and ignore the rest. I never saw Ant-man or Doctor Strange. Not interested.

I will check out all the superhero films this year though. Already seen Logan. Loved it. Spider-man looks pedestrian, but he is Spidey, so I will always have an interest. Thor 3 just seems intriguing. I can't wait to see what Taika might cook up. Not terribly interested in Wonder Woman, but am hoping for it to do well as the first major Superhero movie.

Justice League I am interested in the same way you would be interested in a slow motion car crash. just how terrible can Snyder make it.

So I am now at a point where I skip the ones that doesn't interest me. Watch the really good and really bad ones.

You did not miss anything in regards to Ant-Man or Doctor Strange. The third act of Doctor Strange actually was surprisingly clever, but other than that, yep exactly what you would expect.

 

[DACrowe]

About the CGI, in the Justice League trailer, there is a scene (much lauded by brainless fanboys) where Batman summersaults in and throws what seems to be an explosive at a parademon (or whatever it was).

The loose, rubbery movement tells me it was CGI. Why?

It's just a summersault. You couldn't do it for real? Even in TDK (the hong kong sequence) you see a real stunt person crash and summersault through a window.

In BVS, you have the iconic TDKR lightning shot and that was tainted by CGI. It was just swinging from one ledge to another. How dependent on CGI must you be to leave that up to animators.

Same with homecoming. The CGI suit looks so glaringly bad.

It is almost ridiculous we have gone from Man of Steel to this. I am not saying MOS is particularly good, but it really strived to make you believe it was real and happening in some approximation of our world. Now Snyder has gone full-on cartoon mode. That last scene with Aquaman jumping into the 1990s GoldenEye video game graphics to fight parademons was the worst offender for me.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

It seems modern filmmakers have forgotten that CGI is meant to supplement the live action. Now, everytime there is an action scene or even just a moment of action, it's an automatic license for the filmmakers to peel back live action fillmaking in lieu of digital fakeness. I hate it. Simple things that the stuntman can accomplish should be live action. What happened to reserving CGI for the impossible?

 

[Greens]

The TDKR lightning shot is the perfect example of Snyder creating a visual that looks cool in a still image but terrible in motion. If the homage is going to have an obviously CG Batdouble in it, you might as well not do it.

 

[Ivan Drago]

It's funny, I am experiencing superhero fatigue, but I still enjoy watching the movies in theaters and the build-up to them. I'm still glad their being made, even if only a few are truly special.

On a superficial level at least, I enjoy seeing comicbook characters on the big screen.

 

[shauner111]

No, I am fine with that. Spider-man is going through an arc. He got his fancy new toys and suit from Iron Man and thinks that is what defines him. He gets crashed back down to Earth once he fails spectacularly and has to talked sense into by Stark, a man who himself once thought the same (IM3).

He then dons his old duds without any of the upgrades and manages to save the day this time. Proving what makes Peter a hero is not the suit, but his heroism and bravery.

That's good, but I don't need to see Downey in action as Iron Man, in a Spidey movie to feel like they can pull off that arc.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

From one of my least favorite Disney animated movies of the 90s.

​

 

[Chip Chipperson]

Amy Kaufman @AmyKinLA

I just had 10 minutes with Christopher Nolan, and at the end I asked him about the new "Batman" movies. He didn't want to talk about them.

 

[titansupes]

Either this will fly under the radar or become another ****-storm. No in-between.

 

[Shikamaru]

While I didn't enjoy it as much as the first, I thought the Homecoming trailer looked fine. Then again, Spidey is one of those characters I don't think I can ever get tired of (for a long period of time, at least), so I may be biased. Plus I'm excited to finally see Spidey in the MCU, so there's that.

In my case, however, I do want to know a bit more about the plot going in. I thought he felt like too much like a Bucky/Robin-esque sidekick in Civil War, so the more I know of his relationship with Tony ahead of time the better. As far as Tony goes, I surprisingly find myself more on board with the idea with each new trailer.

First, I like how they're showing more and more friction between them. It's what I would expect given their different worldviews.

Second, I love Tony's line about wanting Peter to be better than him. If you think about it, Spider-Man's entire life is the antithesis to Iron Man 1. In IM1 Tony's all about trying to balance his public life with his Iron Man persona, but by the end just says "**** it" and unmasks himself. Peter doesn't get that luxury. Peter has to live with that burden his whole life. So if there's anything Peter can learn from Tony in the superhero department, it's to succeed where he failed. IM1 is also the only MCU film to date that tackled the issues of a secret identity. Therefore when looked at from that perspective, Tony's integration into the story might be natural.

Finally, this is actually new ground for Spidey. In most of the high school versions, Peter feels like he's (one of) the only people in New York who can stop a threat. This is because in most MUs, there aren't many heroes around when Peter starts out - and in some versions there's no other heroes period. In this he has to deal with the thought that Spidey might be superfluous. I mean, there's already like 30 successful superheroes operating in the MCU. Where exactly is his place in all this? They might also be going for some sort of cultural commentary, since that's exactly where Spidey stands now relative to Marvel Studios.

Anyways, I hope this is all in the film and that I'm not just writing fanfiction.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

I unintentionally took Ivan Drago's recommendation.