Your opinion when people say the Netflix villains are the best villains in the MCU?

[Kahran Ramsus]

Great point.

Wesley was great and he truly did have a limited role on the series with not much screen-time.

His final scene is probably my favorite scene of the entire first season.

 

[TheVileOne]

I was fine with Ultron quipping. It fits with his character as the 'son' of Tony Stark. The problem I had with Ultron was that he failed pretty much every step of the way and wasn't much of a threat. A Killer Robot that makes quips isn't a real problem. A Killer Robot that spends two hours getting his tail kicked is.

Daredevil made a 73 year old accountant with no powers more threatening.

Here is what I didn't get. Why even attempt the pretense of a deal with Klaw in Age of Ultron? Klaw posed no threat to Ultron at all. He had what Ultron needed and he could've easily taken it. Why even direct funds to his private accounts? I mean he was just planning to blow up the earth anyway. even if he didn't want the twins to know what he was doing, they still didn't have to make an actual deal with Klaw.

 

[Guard82]

Here is what I didn't get. Why even attempt the pretense of a deal with Klaw in Age of Ultron? Klaw posed no threat to Ultron at all. He had what Ultron needed and he could've easily taken it. Why even direct funds to his private accounts? I mean he was just planning to blow up the earth anyway. even if he didn't want the twins to know what he was doing, they still didn't have to make an actual deal with Klaw.

My interpretation of Ultron's reasons here was that he was trying (not very successfully) to appear like a somewhat benign, civilized person because he sees himself that way. Because Ultron was created to be a benevolent peacemaker to protect humanity, Ultron still felt the need to at least try to put on a benign exterior in order to fulfill his supposed "purpose" as a savior. And I think he also wanted to prove that he's a more "civilized" or "genteel" person than a common criminal like Klaw.

The problem, of course, is that Ultron's not very good at this, and the façade of benevolence doesn't last long. No matter how much he tries to seem benign, his temper and his ax-crazy tendencies soon get the better of him.

 

[Drz]

They speak the truth.

 

[kedrell]

Here is what I didn't get. Why even attempt the pretense of a deal with Klaw in Age of Ultron? Klaw posed no threat to Ultron at all. He had what Ultron needed and he could've easily taken it. Why even direct funds to his private accounts? I mean he was just planning to blow up the earth anyway. even if he didn't want the twins to know what he was doing, they still didn't have to make an actual deal with Klaw.

I interpreted it as his taking the path of least resistance. It was literally as easy to do one as to do the other for him and he had no concept of greed to give the money any meaning or worth to him. It was just computer code to him, easily manipulated in the blink of an eye. He could just as easily have gone the other way and killed Klaue. Also his keeping up appearances in front of the twins was still important to his plan and if he'd just gone straight to 10 and murdered the guy for his wares then that would have caused doubt of his trustworthiness to spring to mind in the heads of the twins who he still wanted on his side.

 

[marvellover]

I was fine with Ultron quipping. It fits with his character as the 'son' of Tony Stark. The problem I had with Ultron was that he failed pretty much every step of the way and wasn't much of a threat. A Killer Robot that makes quips isn't a real problem. A Killer Robot that spends two hours getting his tail kicked is.

Daredevil made a 73 year old accountant with no powers more threatening.

Exactly,Ultron had so much potential to be one of the best CBM villains but now he's wasted and not going to come back again as a big villain unless MCU reboot the whole thing

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Exactly,Ultron had so much potential to be one of the best CBM villains but now he's wasted and not going to come back again as a big villain unless MCU reboot the whole thing

Agree with both you and Kahran, Ultron was just such a damn waste.

 

[Mjölnir]

Agree with both you and Kahran, Ultron was just such a damn waste.

Are you sure? Doesn't sound like something you'd write.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Are you sure? Doesn't sound like something you'd write.

Not like you to disagree with a criticism of the MCU .

 

[Mjölnir]

Not like you to disagree with a criticism of the MCU .

Exactly. What kind of Hydra mischief is this?

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Exactly. What kind of Hydra mischief is this?

Is it Hydra? Or Shield?

 

[Mjölnir]

Is it Hydra? Or Shield?

I see what you're doing there. You're clearly trying to put the spotlight away from the Hand, but I see him! Trying to ally yourself with the TV villains against the movie villains again!

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

I see what you're doing there. You're clearly trying to put the spotlight away from the Hand, but I see him! Trying to ally yourself with the TV villains against the movie villains again!

t:

 

[Mr. Forest]

I can't say they're wrong because I agree with them.

 

[Solaire]

Hard to compare them. I thought Fisk and Kilgrave were great but I also enjoyed many of the villains in the films. Hell, I liked Darren Cross even though the majority didn't like him.

Winter Soldier in Cap 2 is probably my favorite villain in the MCU followed by Loki.

 

[Doctor Octopus]

I liked Darren Cross but he not that memorable compared to Loki.

 

[DieSmiling]

IMO Loki is easily the best MCU villain -- I don't even think it's close.

 

[Rocky89]

Loki is a bad ass.

 

[Steamteck]

IMO Loki is easily the best MCU villain -- I don't even think it's close.

I completely agree. I really don't see the love for Kingpin myself. Honestly if I had no comics knowledge, I would have thought his 2nd in command was the real boss through most of the show.

 

[Mjölnir]

I completely agree. I really don't see the love for Kingpin myself. Honestly if I had no comics knowledge, I would have thought his 2nd in command was the real boss through most of the show.

All by intent as he does try to seem weaker and dumber than he is to his business partners, so he can more easily set them up. Madame Gao saw through that and knew that he spoke Mandarin the entire time, etc, but the rest thought they were in more control than they were.

And despite all that he did have actual weaknesses as well, which was pretty much just known by a couple of people in the show. He's the best fleshed out character in any superhero property in my view.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

For me Killian improved even on the Kingpin, some of his scenes were down right creepy, and he was a threat to the hero from the off.

That police station scene lasted 10 mins and was really the first time we properly met him and saw how deranged he was. He gave off more menace during those 10 mins than most MCU villains give in 5 times that amount of screen time.

 

[Mjölnir]

For me Killian improved even on the Kingpin, some of his scenes were down right creepy, and he was a threat to the hero from the off.

That police station scene lasted 10 mins and was really the first time we properly met him and saw how deranged he was. He gave off more menace during those 10 mins than most MCU villains give in 5 times that amount of screen time.

I assume you mean Kilgrave and not the villain in IM3.

Kilgrave was great but I think Kingpin was a notch higher still. In terms of being menacing he's really high up though (not the end all, be all trait for me though). No one affects their counterpart hero like him in any superhero movie.

 

[Endeavor]

I think the longer runtime format definitely contributes to the perception that the villains are "better". It just means they've had more development, whereas the movies have a harder time balancing run time with character spotlight.
Overall I believe the running commentary about Marvel having a problem with it's villains is mostly unfair. Marvel has had plenty of good villains.

Stane was an excellent villain.

Killian was also a good villain, and this is coming from someone who didn't like the twist.

About the only 2 I can think of that were disappointments to me were Whiplash and Malekith, with the latter being the biggest letdown.

I wish they would stop killing them as quickly as they've been doing.
Maybe with repeated appearances the perception that they're weak characters will start to dissipate.

 

[Mjölnir]

Yes, the longer format is definitely crucial to getting really deep into a character. I'd say that the biggest way the Netflix villains stand out is through that I think they are much better than all other TV show super villains.

I don't have an issue with the Marvel villains in relation to other superhero movies either. They serve their roles well for me and that there's more focus on the heroes is something I'm fine with since I think the superhero movies that have done that have generally been the ones getting the heroes the most right.

I think that the criticism for many people tend to be mixed in with other opinions. One thing that leads me to think that way is how many liked Mad Max: Fury Road so much, and I can't think of a superhero movie where the villains were as small of a deal as the villain in that movie.

 

[DACrowe]

The more time to develop argument feels mostly invalid, because there are so many great villains in cinema that only appear in one film (or they were amazing in their first film). Consider Hans Landa in Inglourious Basterds, Hannibal Lecter in Silence of the Lambs, or even Darth Vader in the original Star Wars.

Just in the realm of comic book movies, however, Heath Ledger's Joker is only onscreen for about 30 minutes in a 2.5 hour superhero movie, yet he is inarguably the best superhero in the genre's history. I do not even think the MCU has had a villain as good as Tom Hardy's Bane on the big screen (though I prefer Kilgrave if we count TV).

Even Ian McKellen in the flawed X-Men (2000) left a huge impression in a very under budgeted 100-minute movie, so did Rebecca Romjin. For that matter, Michael Fassbender is only a villain for like two scenes in X-Men: First Class and those sequences are stunners for him.

No, I feel like this is more just a problem with the Marvel template of being light, peppy, and playing to a certain formula where the heroes are amazing and the villains are increasingly looking like dominos to knock down like a Saturday morning cartoon.

They better be able to turn this around with Thanos. Otherwise, there will be massive problems with the next two Avengers movies after all these years.