The Defenders [spoilers] Question about the finale

[dmcreif]

Did Matt really need to stay behind to deal with Elektra at Midland Circle? Honestly, something tells me we could've had a much better ending if Matt had returned to the surface with the other three, or the other three went back for him after the building fell. Like a, "no one gets left behind" thing.

Of course, I know Matt would never have left that pit of his own free will because he'd never willingly abandon Elektra to die. But Jessica could easily have just knocked him out and carried him. And after the cables were cut, Jessica, Luke and Danny, between the three of them, could have hauled Matt the rest of the way up the shaft. Matt would have felt guilty about leaving Elektra behind, once he woke up, but it wouldn't have been anything new. If that climactic fight was supposed to give him some sort of closure with Elektra, well, honestly, he really should have found his closure already by that point. Once Elektra killed Stick right in front of him, that should have told Matt that she was never going to be the person he kept trying to convince her to be.


If anything, the real reason Matt had to stay down there and “die” was to set up Born Again material for season 3 of Daredevil. But The Defenders was supposed to be about all four of them equally, not just Matt. The show's finale is structured around the narrative needs for Daredevil and that's kinda unfair to everyone else. It makes it look like Matt was the real hero of the show, and the others were just along for the ride.

 

[Mike Murdock]

The other three got to be heroes while Matt succumbed to his demons. The whole Elektra plot is Matt's story, it made sense he reacted differently.

 

[dmcreif]

The other three got to be heroes while Matt succumbed to his demons. The whole Elektra plot is Matt's story, it made sense he reacted differently.

I don’t mind that Matt feels compelled to try and bring Elektra’s memories back. That's actually a pretty noble thing to do: he’s trying to give her back her own identity, her own life, by undoing the Hand’s brainwashing. But sadly for him, her own identity is not what he wants so desperately for it to be. She has no interest in going along with his tidy little redemption narrative, and she doesn't care what he thinks of her anymore. Which I actually kind of love. My favorite part of their fight down in the pit is her basically telling him, “This is who I am, take it or leave it!”

But if only he had accepted that fact sooner, and hadn’t insisted on trying to take responsibility for her death, there would have been no need for him to stay down there with her in the first place. The show tries to frame it as a sacrifice to save the city, but honestly, I think Matt was down there for personal reasons.

Saving the city only required that none of the Hand manage to get on board the elevator while the heroes made their escape, so they’d be stuck down there when the building collapsed. Despite being the Black Sky, Elektra never demonstrates any major supernatural abilities—she’s just a really good fighter with a little superstrength courtesy of the substance. And if she were trying to board a rising elevator from below, Matt, Jessica, Luke and Danny would have had the advantage of height. All four of them working together could have fended off Elektra. In fact, that’s exactly what would have happened, if Matt didn’t have a personal connection to her. If Elektra were just the Hand’s strongest fighter, and Matt had never met her before, he would have been getting on that elevator with the others.

Instead, he chooses death, turning his back on everyone who loves him. And he is expecting to die even before the elevator cable gets cut and he’s trapped, otherwise he wouldn’t have told Danny to protect the city. And honestly, it’s such a hurtful thing to do. Foggy and Karen are heartbroken, and the others must feel pretty rotten, too, even though they’ve only known him for a few days. And he does it for such messed up reasons. I would be less angry if I were convinced that Matt's staying behind was necessary to save the city, or if he had truly intended to escape but couldn’t. He hurts all of his friends, as well as refuses until the last possible moment to acknowledge Elektra for who she really is, out of a misplaced sense of responsibility. And now the others are left with their pain, and their grief, for however much time passes in-show unti Daredevil season 3.

 

[Random490]

I see it as him standing by the people who he cares about. It would be the same if it was Karen or Foggy in that hole. He'd stay with them till the end.

 

[athena1541]

I don’t mind that Matt feels compelled to try and bring Elektra’s memories back. That's actually a pretty noble thing to do: he’s trying to give her back her own identity, her own life, by undoing the Hand’s brainwashing. But sadly for him, her own identity is not what he wants so desperately for it to be. She has no interest in going along with his tidy little redemption narrative, and she doesn't care what he thinks of her anymore. Which I actually kind of love. My favorite part of their fight down in the pit is her basically telling him, “This is who I am, take it or leave it!”

But if only he had accepted that fact sooner, and hadn’t insisted on trying to take responsibility for her death, there would have been no need for him to stay down there with her in the first place. The show tries to frame it as a sacrifice to save the city, but honestly, I think Matt was down there for personal reasons.

Saving the city only required that none of the Hand manage to get on board the elevator while the heroes made their escape, so they’d be stuck down there when the building collapsed. Despite being the Black Sky, Elektra never demonstrates any major supernatural abilities—she’s just a really good fighter with a little superstrength courtesy of the substance. And if she were trying to board a rising elevator from below, Matt, Jessica, Luke and Danny would have had the advantage of height. All four of them working together could have fended off Elektra. In fact, that’s exactly what would have happened, if Matt didn’t have a personal connection to her. If Elektra were just the Hand’s strongest fighter, and Matt had never met her before, he would have been getting on that elevator with the others.

Instead, he chooses death, turning his back on everyone who loves him. And he is expecting to die even before the elevator cable gets cut and he’s trapped, otherwise he wouldn’t have told Danny to protect the city. And honestly, it’s such a hurtful thing to do. Foggy and Karen are heartbroken, and the others must feel pretty rotten, too, even though they’ve only known him for a few days. And he does it for such messed up reasons. I would be less angry if I were convinced that Matt's staying behind was necessary to save the city, or if he had truly intended to escape but couldn’t. He hurts all of his friends, as well as refuses until the last possible moment to acknowledge Elektra for who she really is, out of a misplaced sense of responsibility. And now the others are left with their pain, and their grief, for however much time passes in-show until Daredevil season 3.

Well said. It was infuriating to see Matt (apparently) sacrifice himself for no good reason. I recall seeing an interview in which Charlie Cox said Matt was “deluded” when it came to Elektra. He definitely got that right.

On the other hand, I’m not convinced the show was trying to sell the viewers on the story that Matt “died to save the city.” We the viewers know that wasn’t the case. We – along with Jessica, Luke, and Danny – heard Matt say he was staying behind to try to reach Elektra. So I think the “he died to save the city” story was more for the survivors, to allow them to believe Matt’s (apparent) death had some purpose and meaning. And maybe it was for Matt, too. After all, “he died to save the city” sounds a lot better than “he died trying to save his crazy, homicidal, formerly dead, ex-girlfriend from herself, after she told him she didn’t want to be saved.” Imagine how much worse it would be for Foggy and Karen – and Claire, too – to learn Matt had basically thrown his life away for nothing. And if Matt had been thinking (which he wasn’t), he would have wanted his legacy to be that he died to save the city. So I see the “he died to save the city” story as a kindness to the survivors – and perhaps a parting gift to Matt.