Batman Forever: Duality?

[Two-Face]

I translated this from German Batman web site:


“I stated that everyone has a double identity in the asking one universe. All evil authors haen either a second identity or were before somebody else. Therefore I meant that duality without question would be a topic for “Batman Forever”.” (Joel Schumacher, director)


http://translate.google.com/transla.../gotham_specials/chronologie/chronologie.html

How this movie was a duality? I don't get what Schumacher is trying to say.

 

[The Chairman]

It was duality in that it alternated between being an over the top, campy and just plain horrible interpretation of Batman and a serious attempt at making a dark Batman movie, which is what killed it.

 

[Two-Face]

Campy/ serious sametime? that would never work but hey BF is an proof.

 

[batmaluco]

I can see some duality but it's not very funny, not anymore.
I mean, all that scene where Batman has to choose Chase Meridian or Robin.
The public persona, the playboy Bruce Wayne and his girlfriend, or the obscure persona, with his "partner" hidden in the closet.

This movie just begs for all that crappy gay jokes regarding Batman and Robin.

 

[The Chairman]

Campy/ serious sametime? that would never work but hey BF is an proof.

Well, I was saying that as a joke. I'm fairly the sure the article (which is not working for me) wasn't getting at that.

 

[Two-Face]

Here is an original web site:

http://www.batmannews.de/gotham_specials/chronologie/chronologie.html


maybe you translate better.

 

[The Chairman]

Here is an original web site:

http://www.batmannews.de/gotham_specials/chronologie/chronologie.html


maybe you translate better.

The sight is in German.

 

[Kevin Roegele]

I translated this from German Batman web site:


“I stated that everyone has a double identity in the asking one universe. All evil authors haen either a second identity or were before somebody else. Therefore I meant that duality without question would be a topic for “Batman Forever”.” (Joel Schumacher, director)


http://translate.google.com/transla.../gotham_specials/chronologie/chronologie.html

How this movie was a duality? I don't get what Schumacher is trying to say.

Did you not watch the film?

Batman/Bruce Wayne, Dick Grayson/Robin, Two-Face (TWO-FACE!)/Harvey Dent, The Riddler/Edward Nygma.....

What do you think Chase Meridian means? PERSUE A DIVIDING LINE. It's what Bruce is trying to do the whole movie. Find a dividing line between his two identities.

Did you not see the climax? Batman has to decide between saving Bruce's love or Batman's partner?

In the end he announces he's both Bruce Wayne and Batman.

 

[E-Mack]

^^ LOL....thanks for saving me the time in writing the exact thing.

 

[The Sage]

Did you not watch the film?

Batman/Bruce Wayne, Dick Grayson/Robin, Two-Face (TWO-FACE!)/Harvey Dent, The Riddler/Edward Nygma.....

What do you think Chase Meridian means? PERSUE A DIVIDING LINE. It's what Bruce is trying to do the whole movie. Find a dividing line between his two identities.

Did you not see the climax? Batman has to decide between saving Bruce's love or Batman's partner?

In the end he announces he's both Bruce Wayne and Batman.

Dang, I never noticed the Chase Meridian part. Guess this means I need to pay Batman Forever along with B89 a visit this weekend.

 

[The Kid]

Did you not watch the film?

Batman/Bruce Wayne, Dick Grayson/Robin, Two-Face (TWO-FACE!)/Harvey Dent, The Riddler/Edward Nygma.....

What do you think Chase Meridian means? PERSUE A DIVIDING LINE. It's what Bruce is trying to do the whole movie. Find a dividing line between his two identities.

Did you not see the climax? Batman has to decide between saving Bruce's love or Batman's partner?

In the end he announces he's both Bruce Wayne and Batman.

thank you. Finally somoene on the internet who understood the meaning of this film. Despite the crap on the surface, there was something good underneath.

 

[batmaluco]

So, it's because people can't realize the greatness of Batman Forever, that it is perceived as a bad movie. No, but absolutely on the contrary.

Under the crappy mind stealing machine plot, there was a subplot, seeking in Batman's mind, in terms of attempt to give some consistency to the story, his motivations and all that kind of psychoanalysis they did by analyzing his dreams. And it is the best thing in Batman Forever, what makes it still watchable.
This and Jim Carrey's performance. Even if I dislike the way The Riddler was portrayed there.

But then, there's still another view, more subtle, a sub-textual message underneath, all the sexual allusions.
And Chase Meridian (PERSUE A DIVIDING LINE) can also represents (or it can also mean), not even so subtly, certain specific part of the feminine anatomy.
And there are less vulgar (less exploitation) ways to do this, if you take for instance "Arkham Asylum" and its obvious (or maybe not so obvious, after all) allusions to this same specific part when it showed the depiction of a "Tunnel of Love".

But also the psychoanalysis would take a look at the sexual allusions or connotations regarding the characters of this film.
"Chase Meridian" was depicted as a stereotyped super-female, almost like a walking vagina.
Robin, a young adult, still undecided about his sexual orientations, steals the Batmobile to get some chicks but what he really wants to be is Batman's "partner". "Not only friends, but partners."
Batman/Wayne has also a sexual ambivalence. His public persona was attracted and interested in Chase Meridian, but (Batman) his obscure persona was at the end interested about having a "partner" for some nocturnal activities.
The poor Two-Face, was depicted as a dumb super-male character, the stereotyped "Macho" gender. He had not only one, but two women at his service. Not to mention his thugs with all that BDSM paraphernalia masks.
And the unnecessary Batman's butt-shot and nipples are there only for to reinforce all this.

But then, Batman Forever is still watchable, mainly because Jim Carrey's performance and some attempt of making a consistent sub-plot, investigating Batman's mind.
And it can be funny if you watch as the 60's show. And then enters the sub-textual sexual connotations.
But then, there's still a problem, because it's like hearing the same joke all over again, it's not that funny anymore as it was for the first time.

 

[Kevin Roegele]

So, it's because people can't realize the greatness of Batman Forever, that it is perceived as a bad movie. No, but absolutely on the contrary.

Under the crappy mind stealing machine plot, there was a subplot, seeking in Batman's mind, in terms of attempt to give some consistency to the story, his motivations and all that kind of psychoanalysis they did by analyzing his dreams. And it is the best thing in Batman Forever, what makes it still watchable.
This and Jim Carrey's performance. Even if I dislike the way The Riddler was portrayed there.

But then, there's still another view, more subtle, a sub-textual message underneath, all the sexual allusions.
And Chase Meridian (PERSUE A DIVIDING LINE) can also represents (or it can also mean), not even so subtly, certain specific part of the feminine anatomy.
And there are less vulgar (less exploitation) ways to do this, if you take for instance "Arkham Asylum" and its obvious (or maybe not so obvious, after all) allusions to this same specific part when it showed the depiction of a "Tunnel of Love".

But also the psychoanalysis would take a look at the sexual allusions or connotations regarding the characters of this film.
"Chase Meridian" was depicted as a stereotyped super-female, almost like a walking vagina.
Robin, a young adult, still undecided about his sexual orientations, steals the Batmobile to get some chicks but what he really wants to be is Batman's "partner". "Not only friends, but partners."
Batman/Wayne has also a sexual ambivalence. His public persona was attracted and interested in Chase Meridian, but (Batman) his obscure persona was at the end interested about having a "partner" for some nocturnal activities.
The poor Two-Face, was depicted as a dumb super-male character, the stereotyped "Macho" gender. He had not only one, but two women at his service. Not to mention his thugs with all that BDSM paraphernalia masks.
And the unnecessary Batman's butt-shot and nipples are there only for to reinforce all this.

But then, Batman Forever is still watchable, mainly because Jim Carrey's performance and some attempt of making a consistent sub-plot, investigating Batman's mind.
And it can be funny if you watch as the 60's show. And then enters the sub-textual sexual connotations.
But then, there's still a problem, because it's like hearing the same joke all over again, it's not that funny anymore as it was for the first time.

Forever can certainly be read that way. At the end of the film, Bruce learns that he can be the stereotypical alpha male with the beautiful woman during the day, and have the fetishtic homosexual stuff after hours.

Having said that, Batman Forever's gay subtext is nothing compared to that of Highlander. Highlander is so gay, lol.

 

[batmaluco]

Forever can certainly be read that way. At the end of the film, Bruce learns that he can be the stereotypical alpha male with the beautiful woman during the day, and have the fetishtic homosexual stuff after hours.

Having said that, Batman Forever's gay subtext is nothing compared to that of Highlander. Highlander is so gay, lol.

^^
lol, yeah.
It is funny that you mentioned this film.
At least here in Brazil, there is a slang for this stereotypical alpha male, that is called "O Espada" (in Portuguese). That could be translated for "The Sword".