BvS Do you think Batman is taking the heat away from Superman?

[WarriorDreamer]

What I mean is, do you think with the news of Batman and the obvious success of his franchise, do you think this is taking away the excitement for Superman and his cast of characters?

I mean I was all excited to see another villain introduced, preferably one we haven't seen yet and maybe explore a new Superman storyline we haven't yet seen on film. I think with Batman in it it is now becoming, 'Oooh, gee who do you want to play Robin? Who do you want to play Alfred? Who do you want to play Commissioner Gordon? etc.' We might as well set it in Gotham City while we're at it.

Who else agrees?

 

[Tra-El]

Tobias's wet-dream of a thread REVEALED!

Have at it

 

[FlawlessVictory]

What I mean is, do you think with the news of Batman and the obvious success of his franchise, do you think this is taking away the excitement for Superman and his cast of characters?

I mean I was all excited to see another villain introduced, preferably one we haven't seen yet and maybe explore a new Superman storyline we haven't yet seen on film. I think with Batman in it it is now becoming, 'Oooh, gee who do you want to play Robin? Who do you want to play Alfred? Who do you want to play Commissioner Gordon? etc.' We might as well set it in Gotham City while we're at it.

Who else agrees?

Good idea. Maybe Snyder will just stick Superman in an after credits scene.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

What I mean is, do you think with the news of Batman and the obvious success of his franchise, do you think this is taking away the excitement for Superman and his cast of characters?

I mean I was all excited to see another villain introduced, preferably one we haven't seen yet and maybe explore a new Superman storyline we haven't yet seen on film. I think with Batman in it it is now becoming, 'Oooh, gee who do you want to play Robin? Who do you want to play Alfred? Who do you want to play Commissioner Gordon? etc.' We might as well set it in Gotham City while we're at it.

Who else agrees?

It's inevitable.
BUT I think if this film does well AND IS GOOD, that guarantees more financial success for another Superman sequel. By way of Wonder Woman, of course.

 

[Tra-El]

Good idea. Maybe Snyder will just stick Superman in an after credits scene.

Yeah, even smiling at the camera! Critics would gush. "Best Superman performance since Christopher Reeve! All smiling and *****.."

 

[Tobias]

Its inevitable and expected.

Batman is the most popular fictional character out there. Ben Affleck is a very prominent actor/director. Put the two together and you the world takes note.

When this was announced the other day it made CNN, the mainstream news sources, took over Twitter, was all over FaceBook.

This didn't happen when Evans was cast as Cap or Hensworth as Thor or Cavill as Superman - or even Garfield as Spiderman.

Batman if coming off of a huge trilogy of films and two decades of TV shows, DVD animated films, award winning graphic novels.

Even after MOS, Cavill remains relatively unknown and especially compared to Affleck.

There is more talk of Batman on many Superman boards as regards this film than there is of Superman. A lot of that talk is negative, but its getting folks talking.

When the first shot of Affleck in the suit is released there will be another huge explosion of interest as there was with the casting. Same when the various Bat universe character castings are announced.

Don't be surprised if Batman is featured more in promoting the film prior to its release because of Batman's popularity and, overseas especially, because of the Nolan films.

Think of it as a football game. You are the second string quarter back and damn good but, in the championship game, who will the coach send in?

It hurts if you are a Superman fan but if you can think of the reasons behind it, at least you understand why it is happening. Or if it bothers you too mch then don't follow the film too closely. Check in every or 4 weeks instead of once a week or whatever.

So what do Superman fans do in this situation?

Hope that Cavill gets meaty stuff to work with in WF. More lines, the chance to show a much more nuanced Superman and Clark. And hope that Cavill rises to the occasion and nails it.

Because, though this film isn't likely to make Avengers 2 numbers, with Affleck in it, it could do TDKR numbers or better.

Superman will be seen by far by the largest audience he has ever been seen by on screen.This is Cavill's chance to make Superman popular again with audiences. If the reactions to his Superman in Batman vs Superman are very good that alone elevates the stature of the character.

So, despite having to sit through a lot of Bat talk and Bat focus in the next 23 months, once released Batman vs Superman can be a vehicle to elevate Superman's popularity to the point where WB may go ahead and try another solo film.

 

[ЯɘvlveR]

twas inevitable for better or worse.

 

[The Batman]

If MOS were a better movie, we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

 

[Matt.S99]

I really don't think it was about the movie itself, more about the money. The movie itself was just fine.

 

[Senator Pleasury]

Of course he is.

 

[Marvin]

If MOS were a better movie, we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

Because Bale was huge 2 months after begins?
even with his bigger than Cavill career before the fact.

I find it silly how people will never miss a beat when it comes to trying to justify their dislike for MOS.

Not sure how big reeve became after STM(I don't see him in all that many other films) but it was no doubt helped by the fact that, that was pretty much the first big modern cbm around.

 

[The Batman]

I find it silly how people will never miss a beat when it comes to trying to justify their dislike for MOS.

And I find it silly how people compare BB to MOS to justify their love for MOS. As if BB's situation was the same as MOS's.

I don't know about you, but I don't remember BB getting a massive marketing campaign, a boost from 3D ticket sales, and the "Let's mention that a popular director helped make this film" style promotion. Not to mention BB coming off of "Batman and Robin", one of most hated films of all time.

Continue making excuses for MOS all you wish. Reeve's career didn't exactly take off because typecasting was more prevalent in those days, not to mention that Reeve foolishly turned down some big roles. Even still, he was widely praised for his performance as Superman, which has more to do with being in a good movie than it does being "pretty much the first big modern cbm around". As mentioned before, its not as if Cavill's stock has risen since MOS. That's not his fault. He had a decent performance in a polarizing movie.

 

[Tra-El]

Ironic that the comparisons to BB is what ultimately HURT Superman as a character when it came to negativity. " Too dark for Superman; Copying off of BB" yaddayadda.

And I wouldn't lump Zack Snyder's name in there either as a "pro" for MOS, as Snyder is nothing but a fanboy whipping boy.

Though BB had Batman and Robin, MOS had that little movie called Superman Returns and instead of being 8 solid years out of the public from BaR to BB, SR only had 6 years out of the public's eye.

 

[The Batman]

I knew someone would come in acting like SR was as damaging as B&R.

SR was merely forgettable. B&R is memorably terrible. Only Superman fans act like those movies are on the same level.

 

[STARMAN]

We knew this was going to happen once they announced a Superman/Batman film. But I think Cavill is positioned well. Affleck is the bigger name but it's not like Affleck is an incredible scene-stealing actor who overshadows everyone in his presence. Like anything, it will depend on how both Superman and Batman are depicted in the movie. It could be a success for both characters.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

^ Yeah. If Superman:TM wasn't good, it wouldn't have the legacy it had on the genre and Reeve wouldn't have the impact he did.

Super Mario Bros. is the first US movie based on a video game, and I don't think it did that genre or Bob Hoskins any favors.

 

[Malcolm Reynold]

'Oooh, gee who do you want to play Robin? Who do you want to play Alfred? Who do you want to play Commissioner Gordon? etc.'

Well of course people are excited to cast the Batman side characters because guess what? The Superman side characters are already cast.

 

[The Batman]

^ Yeah. If Superman:TM wasn't good, it wouldn't have the legacy it had on the genre and Reeve wouldn't have the impact he did.

Super Mario Bros. is the first US movie based on a video game, and I don't think it did that genre or Bob Hoskins any favors.

Thank you.

It's become the cool thing to do, undermining STM's success to justify why MOS hasn't gotten the 2013 equivalent of STM's popularity.

 

[Tra-El]

*Checks to see if I said it was as damaging*

Nope, I didn't. Fact is, Batman and Robin WASN'T supposed to be a serious film. It was intended to be a kids movie with the Adam West style of "BOOM!, POW!, BAM!" version of Batman.

Superman Returns? Yeah, it was supposed to be a serious take on Superman that was to be a new beginning for the franchise.

No matter how you spin it or simply be a prick about things, MOS still had a bad movie that made the audience ill that indeed, stuck fresh inside their craniums when it came to the character.

 

[Tra-El]

We knew this was going to happen once they announced a Superman/Batman film. But I think Cavill is positioned well. Affleck is the bigger name but it's not like Affleck is an incredible scene-stealing actor who overshadows everyone in his presence. Like anything, it will depend on how both Superman and Batman are depicted in the movie. It could be a success for both characters.

The future of other solo films for both characters PLUS the Justice League and other solo-new-franchises are waiting in the balance and are in need of Superman/Batman to do huge. Both characters, IMHO, need to come out of this smelling like roses....

 

[slumcat]

Do you think Batman is taking the heat away from Superman?

Abso-****ing-lutely.

 

[Tra-El]

Do you think Batman is taking the heat away from Superman?

Abso-****ing-lutely.

Yeah, as Tobias said (Tobias, that makes 3 things we agree on, lol) : Obvious and expected.

 

[The Batman]

*Checks to see if I said it was as damaging*

You didn't have to. I can't help it if saying "Though BB had Batman and Robin, MOS had that little movie called Superman Returns" carries an implication that SR is the equivalent of B&R, which it isn't.

No matter how you spin it or simply be a prick about things, MOS still had a bad movie that made the audience ill that indeed, stuck fresh inside their craniums when it came to the character.

There is no spin. SR was an underperforming film that was relatively liked by critics, polarized fanboys, and was ultimately forgettable to the GA. B&R is a notorious flop disliked by a majority. It is not the same situation.

 

[STARMAN]

Since 1989, Batman has had 7 films. 6 of them being financially successful. He's had a bigger impact onscreen in the last 30 years. You would have to go back to 1978 for it to be otherwise.

 

[Tobias]

WB has put the Batman side of this together quickly. They could have just chucked MOS as they did SR and reboot in a decade and done a solo Batman. At least MOS is getting another chance to redeem himself which SR didn't..

This film is pivotal for JL and Superman especially but for Batman too.

Cavill needs to be given a script to really chew on and dialogue - not just good dialogue - but as in let him speak. He didn't get near enough speaking scenes in MOS.

Cavill was somewhat wooden in MOS IMO. It may largely have been what he had to work with. But he has to step up to the plate and knock it out of the park next time. If he does that as Superman in a billion plus film it will rectify the damage done to Superman by MOS. It will get WB maybe willing to try another solo Superman film.

An awful lot is riding on this film and both Cavill and Affleck need to make it happen.