Does Batman need to get back to Gritty?

[Cain]

On your guys recomdation and one of my friends as well. I have been checking out streets of gotham and I do enjoy it...i am still not a big fan of dick grayson's batman. Something about robin being more hard core than batman is a little off.

that's one of the best charms of this whole "new era" it's not monotonous, in spite of it being a completely different Batman & Robin dynamic it also seems very natural and not shoehorned in anyway. It's borderline ingenius the way it's all being executed actually, the bat books haven't been this great in quite a long time IMO.

The only real duds are the new Batgirl title and Red Robin everything else is completely worth reading. Though I could understand how some may not like Sirens or Azrael I really do enjoy them. The last run on 'tec by Rucka and Williams III and Morrison's B&R especially have been some of the greatest examples of what this medium is capable of at it's best in quite a long time.

you honestly have no clue what you're talking about.

I mean none, whatsoever.

QFE

 

[Bruce Malone]

I was going to say I give that dynamic a plus for creativity. But I suppose to me personally bruce wayne is batman as much as clark kent is superman.

 

[CConn]

I wouldn't say Dick is more hard@ore. While he is intense...he's been that way for years as Nightwing.

Either way, Bruce will be back by the end of the year anyway, so it doesn't really matter.

 

[CConn]

It's like people only read "Batman" comic title and ignore what we're telling you guys. Check out Streets of Gotham and Detective Comics.

Actually, even Batman is a pretty gritty title. It's as if they only read Batman & Robin.

This is why I can sometimes be a prick on here; you tell someone (not you Malone, you actually listened), the same thing over and over...and they don't listen. How can you not get a little annoyed?

The other thing thattp gets me is, I've never heard a person who reads comics outside of just Batman titles complain about something being too light. Because that that sci-fi nature is a part of comics.

 

[CConn]

I was going to say I give that dynamic a plus for creativity. But I suppose to me personally bruce wayne is batman as much as clark kent is superman.

I don't think anyone would disagree with that...but isn't it worth it for Bruce to take a year or so off so we can get a fresh, new creative dynamic in the book.

I mean, youj need thatg element on change to keep things interesting.

 

[Mr. Earle]

I used to think that Bruce is irreplaceable, and in some ways he is, but Dick is a very worthy successor and his story is very interesting. And of course one of the best things is that he has his own Robin, Damian, who is one of my favourite characters.

The problem is that i really dont know where else they can take Bruce while Dick opens endless possibilities. It'll be a real shame that his story will be cut short when Bruce comes back. And the worst thing is that in a year and a half at the most, Morrison will leave the Bat books and god help us then. I just hope they dont take Batman and throw him down in grimdark and madness again because Morrison did a great job in balancing him.

 

[Dirt Like Me]

The problem is that i really dont know where else they can take Bruce while Dick opens endless possibilities. It'll be a real shame that his story will be cut short when Bruce comes back. And the worst thing is that in a year and a half at the most, Morrison will leave the Bat books and god help us then. I just hope they dont take Batman and throw him down in grimdark and madness again because Morrison did a great job in balancing him.

I think that you're both underestimating the potential of Bruce Wayne as a character and overestimating Grant Morrison's importance to the Batman books.

When Bruce gets back he will have been out of the loop for over a year. That could have a huge effect all his preparations and contingency plans. It could almost be like he's starting over as Batman in a new Gotham that has moved on without him. When you throw in a new Robin (I'm assuming that Damian will stay on for a while), and the new villains that Morrision introduced there's a lot of new ideas that are ready to be mined. For example, we've never seen Bruce fight Professor Pyg with Damian at his side.

As for Morrison, yeah, he's done some great things with Batman over the past few years but it's not as if he's the only great comics writer out there. I think there are a few writers with DC right now who could do some great things with Batman. (Johns and Simone would be my picks). I just hope the next writer is inspired by Morrision's idea to--as you pointed out--keep Batman balanced. I also hope the next writer decides to create new villains and situations, because that's been one of my favorite things about Batman & Robin.

 

[Mr. Earle]

As Morrison said, we've seen Batman capture the Joker about a million times so i agree with you, its good that he introduced new villains.

 

[IBRAH08]

I often wonder what the next series will be like. How long is B&R staying around???

 

[SixtyThree]

I dont mean to be offensive but "Dirt_like_me" you sound pretty ignorant to assume that the next (or post morrison) run on Batman is going to be "bruce starting over" in gotham and it being all new and fantastic. its going to be the same LAME A$$ rehash of the same crap they pushed over and over to us where bat-god had it all figured out from the word GO. and no, he'll just flick his finger at Pyg or Flamingo and they will bow before his might. Damian doesn't work with Bruce, because HE IS BRUCE. its going to be the same damn thing it has been for the years and years before morrison, only bat-god is going to be EVEN MORE OVERPOWERED THAN EVER BEFORE. all the bruce babies can put their bottles in their toothless mouths and curl up with more stories about Bruce pwning the Falcone's again. Daniel left you that one wide open. hell maybe we'll get a joker story again, wouldnt that be GREAT???

 

[SixtyThree]

truly, Earle, god help us when Grant leaves. Morrison made Citizen Kane when its all said and done. were gunna get the chronicles of riddick who ever steps up next. think about that.

 

[Mr. Earle]

I dont mean to be offensive but "Dirt_like_me" you sound pretty ignorant to assume that the next (or post morrison) run on Batman is going to be "bruce starting over" in gotham and it being all new and fantastic. its going to be the same LAME A$$ rehash of the same crap they pushed over and over to us where bat-god had it all figured out from the word GO. and no, he'll just flick his finger at Pyg or Flamingo and they will bow before his might. Damian doesn't work with Bruce, because HE IS BRUCE. its going to be the same damn thing it has been for the years and years before morrison, only bat-god is going to be EVEN MORE OVERPOWERED THAN EVER BEFORE. all the bruce babies can put their bottles in their toothless mouths and curl up with more stories about Bruce pwning the Falcone's again. Daniel left you that one wide open. hell maybe we'll get a joker story again, wouldnt that be GREAT???

I agree with this. If Morrison stays, he'll at least keep it interesting. If someone else comes in, it will be all like:
"Batman the Joker has escaped for the 10000th time!"
"Batman you dont get the Joke"
"Curse you joker!"

Also, as you said, Damian is Bruce and the Dynamic Duo need to be different characters to play off each other. That's why Damian works so well with Dick. But with Tim gone, and with Bruce wanting to connect with his son, it will obviously be Bruce and Damian. Maybe they'll add something to the mix to make it work?

truly, Earle, god help us when Grant leaves. Morrison made Citizen Kane when its all said and done. were gunna get the chronicles of riddick who ever steps up next. think about that.

Indeed. Just read this.
http://forums.superherohype.com/showpost.php?p=18096851&postcount=4399

Somewhere in the "Morrison's Batman & Robin series revealed" thread I have also posted a link that explains how every villain in B&R represents an aspect of the Joker (who is now rumoured to be that detective with the mask). Also, the members of the Club of Heroes represent aspects of Batman's personality. Here are the links:

http://www.4thletter.net/2009/11/bat...-of-the-joker/
and
http://www.4thletter.net/2007/11/bat...in-your-brain/

 

[SixtyThree]

I caught that Buddhism thing on the CBR boards a couple of days ago, someone put it up there. If Morrison really went that deep with all of this how in Gods name can whoever's sade fate it is to follow this up do so? lol BEWARE THE TWO-FACE and RIDDLER STRIKE AGAAINNNNN!!!! GASPPPPP!!!

 

[Cain]

I wouldn't say Dick is more hard@ore. While he is intense...he's been that way for years as Nightwing.

Either way, Bruce will be back by the end of the year anyway, so it doesn't really matter.

We're talking about Robin (Damian) being more hardcore here and not Batman (Dick). The only people that still refer to Dick as Robin are non comic book readers last I checked lol. Though I do have to say I am glad that this Batman is more than just Nightwing in a bat costume though. Dick is indeed progressing as a character without having to be changed extremely and that's nice to see considering he could've easily been morphed into a Bruce clone under hack writing.

 

[CConn]

We're talking about Robin (Damian) being more hardcore here and not Batman (Dick). The only people that still refer to Dick as Robin are non comic book readers last I checked lol. Though I do have to say I am glad that this Batman is more than just Nightwing in a bat costume though. Dick is indeed progressing as a character without having to be changed extremely and that's nice to see considering he could've easily been morphed into a Bruce clone under hack writing.

Oh, I miss read.

In any case, I think that dimension makes for an interesting change. I mean, after four Robins, there not a whole lot left to do... and let's remember that Damian would be more hardcore than even Bruce.

 

[Drz]

Spending 3 years for prep time is so god damn admirable.

 

[Mr. Earle]

I caught that Buddhism thing on the CBR boards a couple of days ago, someone put it up there. If Morrison really went that deep with all of this how in Gods name can whoever's sade fate it is to follow this up do so? lol BEWARE THE TWO-FACE and RIDDLER STRIKE AGAAINNNNN!!!! GASPPPPP!!!

Exactly!
Also, Comic Book Resources happens to form CBR? Hahahahah

We're talking about Robin (Damian) being more hardcore here and not Batman (Dick). The only people that still refer to Dick as Robin are non comic book readers last I checked lol. Though I do have to say I am glad that this Batman is more than just Nightwing in a bat costume though. Dick is indeed progressing as a character without having to be changed extremely and that's nice to see considering he could've easily been morphed into a Bruce clone under hack writing.

That's the best thing. That he isnt like Bruce. In the latest issue of B&R he admits that he isnt and that he doesnt prepare as much as Bruce.

 

[Dirt Like Me]

I dont mean to be offensive but "Dirt_like_me" you sound pretty ignorant to assume that the next (or post morrison) run on Batman is going to be "bruce starting over" in gotham and it being all new and fantastic. its going to be the same LAME A$$ rehash of the same crap they pushed over and over to us where bat-god had it all figured out from the word GO. and no, he'll just flick his finger at Pyg or Flamingo and they will bow before his might. Damian doesn't work with Bruce, because HE IS BRUCE. its going to be the same damn thing it has been for the years and years before morrison, only bat-god is going to be EVEN MORE OVERPOWERED THAN EVER BEFORE. all the bruce babies can put their bottles in their toothless mouths and curl up with more stories about Bruce pwning the Falcone's again. Daniel left you that one wide open. hell maybe we'll get a joker story again, wouldnt that be GREAT???

No offense taken at all SixtyThree. I just disagree. I think that it's still possible to tell good stories with Bruce Wayne as Batman. Maybe that's ignorace, maybe it's optimism, maybe it's delusion.

I also think you're being overly cynical. If that's how you approach comics then I can't imagine you enjoy them very much, which is too bad, because you're obviously a fan who knows and cares about these characters.

I agree with you in some respects and certainly hope we'll get away from Bat-God. I think that the time away from Gotham might be a way to just that. This RIP through Return story could be a way of resetting some of the more ridiculous super-prepared elements that have crept into the character. But the fact is, nobody knows what will come after Morrision leaves.

 

[SixtyThree]

any man that creates a back up personality (lemme say that again A BACK UP PERSONALITY) travels through 6 different time periods and transcends human existence IS NOT coming back to "reality" to be stumped by a riddler clue or lost on the trail of Mr.Freezes latest diamond heist.

 

[Mr. Earle]

Of course he is. He is going to be different psychologically, but he wont be god almighty. His journey through time is a spiritual one anyway.

 

[TruerToTheCore]

Years ago I was all alone in the wilderness of the Internet when I claimed that Batman comics have to be more about "fun" than "grim". The trend has changed.

 

[Dirt Like Me]

any man that creates a back up personality (lemme say that again A BACK UP PERSONALITY) travels through 6 different time periods and transcends human existence IS NOT coming back to "reality" to be stumped by a riddler clue or lost on the trail of Mr.Freezes latest diamond heist.

On the other hand, the fact that Bruce could create the backup personality and will soon be seen as a caveman, pilgrim, pirate, cowboy and 30's detective illustrates the fact that anything is truly possible in comics. Even a change of direction on the prep time Bat-god stuff.

I'm hoping that RIP serves to turn the page on super-prep time, with the Batman of Zurr en Arrh the crescendo of super prep. When Bruce comes back maybe he'll have to look for the answers instead of knowing them all ahead of time. I think that the new villains and time apart from Gotham could lead this direction.

 

[Drz]

I'm hoping that RIP serves to turn the page on super-prep time, with the Batman of Zurr en Arrh the crescendo of super prep. When Bruce comes back maybe he'll have to look for the answers instead of knowing them all ahead of time. I think that the new villains and time apart from Gotham could lead this direction.

I Agree. Now that Bruce is gone and Dr. Hurt is doing his new drug schemes and some mystery behind the Dominoes and the Domino Killer. Dick and Damian willl really get underwhelmed as they're not prepared whats coming. I hope it's the same for Bruce, that he needs to start building up things once again.

 

[CConn]

As long as Morrison writes Batman, I'm sure it won't.