The Rise of Skywalker Does Kathleen Kennedy get fired after ROS?

[harlequinade]

She should but it will be quietly and they will give some false reason for her 'moving onto different things' lol

ThnakYouRianJohnson hashtag is trending on twitter

 

[jmc]

Rebooting would be so so stupid. First post TFA Disney pissed of a lot of people. Second reboots always piss people of at least at first even if they end up being good. 3rd you could always do like a kinight of the old rebliuc trilogy or something and then go back to like a 10-12 just to kind of mix up what people are getting. You look at what Disney did i think a big mistake was doing spin offs between 8 and between 9 has it resulted in having a movie ever year. If they wanted to do like a RO movie and a solo movie i think it would have been better to do them after TFA. So for example have TFA, 2015, TLJ 2017, TROSW 2019. Then like 2022 do RO and then Solo in 2024. That way things are mixed up more and with more breaks inbetween ever thing. 4th well star wars has had a lot of damage has a result of the last 2 movies it dosnt take much to get people back all you really need is 1 great movie. Look at the PT it did a lot of damaged then 2015 TFA came out and just like that at the time star wars was in great shape again. TFA most people loved and it made a lot of people love star wars again that were like down with star wars after the PT and people were extremly hyped for TLJ.

I actually don’t think the PT did as much damage as you say. Star Wars still sold a boat load of ancillary material. The first thing Kennedy did was get rid of the EU. All of that material with characters and stories that fans built a love of tossed away. For instance Mara Jade was one character who I would see actually merchandise for. Because she is no longer cannon that’s god knows how much money that has been lost. Replaced with whom exactly from this ST? Rose Tico? Something tells me you’re not going to see an exclusive Sideshow Collectibles statue of her anytime soon. And that’s the problem. Disney created a bunch of characters that no-one is invested in. How many girls genuinely like Rey? I see nothing but love for Leia from women, and to a lesser extent Padme. But I’ve seen as many women disliking Rey as men. If you’re lead heroine is not even universally liked, then how the hell can Disney expect people into buy what it is they are selling? Where’s the incentive to keep supporting the series if no-one feels anything for your characters? Say what you will about the prequels in terms of execution, but there’s a lot of elements to those films that people have been willing to invest in. Whatever Disney produces about the sequel trilogy will never sell in the same way the PT or OT have. Not now.


BTW dude, hope you’re doing well for yourself.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Personally I would take Revenge of the Sith over either TLJ or TROS.

 

[Flint Marko]

OK if she's fired, who replaces her? I think this is a valid question. Fans who hated the sequels or Last Jedi want validation with her getting fired. But what if she gets replaced by someone even worse? I don't want a Tom Rothman situation here.

That’s a valid question and I don’t really have an answer for you. But somethings gotta give. If it’s not Kennedy then it’s someone up there.

People are overreacting again. It's nothing new. It's Star Wars. The fans always overreact. Cry. Complain. Rant. Hissy fit etc.
It happens with every new Star Wars film.
Last trilogy they attacked George Lucas and this trilogy it's Kathleen Kennedy.

We all know anything that's not the OT is trash to some people.

Not to say SW fans or fans in general aren’t overreactive babies. But in both of these instances there is some merit to what they’re saying. The first two prequels are some of the worst movies I’ve ever seen and while I’ve actually enjoyed the newer movies for the most part there’s a management issue that has led to diminishing returns and audience ambivalence.

This isn’t a nail in the coffin for the franchise by any stretch but they are at a turning point.

 

[superion]

People are overreacting again. It's nothing new. It's Star Wars. The fans always overreact. Cry. Complain. Rant. Hissy fit etc.
It happens with every new Star Wars film.
Last trilogy they attacked George Lucas and this trilogy it's Kathleen Kennedy.

Yeah but the prequels did suck. They were some of the most amateurishly directed, written and acted movies I have ever seen from a big time director and a mostly talented group of actors.

The new crop of movies are more professionally made but the characters are not interesting despite some strong actors in the main roles. The flip flop between Abrams vision and Johnson's didn't help.

Give the franchise to Feige. If you are only going to do a SW film once every 2 years it shouldn't be too much of an extra work load.

 

[TheVileOne]

I get that everyone worships Feige and Feige in control of Star Wars sounds good. But that sounds easier said than done.

 

[sycamore]

Personally I would take Revenge of the Sith over either TLJ or TROS.

All 3 are bad movies IMO. "I have the high ground". 'Nuff said.

 

[MadVillainy]

I get that everyone worships Feige and Feige in control of Star Wars sounds good. But that sounds easier said than done.

Again, who do you expect us all to say? I don't get this weirdo point you're trying to make in a somewhat condescending way. In fact all of the points you've made about Kennedy potential being fired hold no water at all. I'm actually not sure if you're not just saying this stuff for the sake of arguing and don't actually believe what you're saying

-"She has a hard job" So do a lot of people, not even just in Hollywood. Should we just not criticize other people because of this?
-Who should replace her?" How should we know? We aren't in Hollywood. We're nerds on the internet. Of course people are only going to name the limited amount of names they know.
-Making a movie a year was too much. How? As someone pointed out most of Disney subsidiaries/studios are able to pump out at least 1 film a year that is either commercially successful, a hit with critics, or both. So why for Star Wars is it too much? If they were saying make an Episode a year I'd get that. And it's not like SW is a concept that's so small that the well can just run dry if you do a movie a year. BSW is so vast and they have all these characters, storylines, and concepts that they can explore. And that's not even including any of the old Expanded Universe stuff that they can recanonize if they want to.

As I said in another post, SW isn't in a terrible place. But it had all the parts that it should be in a way better position.
Star Wars shouldn't be at a place where:
-They have to move a movie ideas from a theatrical release to a streaming release because they're worried about the box office
-Multiple directors have been fired or heavily overruled after or near the end of filming
-Anyone should be worrying about the latest movie underperforming at the box office
-Some potential directors are afraid to make a SW movie due to creative clashes. Remember what Taika Wahtiti said?
-Toy sales being down. Arguably due to the reception of some of the movies. Sales are down even considering the general downward trend of toys.
-Fans and movie goers are this divided over the movies. (And please don't come with that "Well SW fans are fickle" "SW fans are this" because that's just nonsense. Plus there are a good amount of SW related media post 2014 that have gotten good to great reviews)

This all boils down to mismanagement. Mismanagement of creative vision, mismanagement of hiring process, mismanagement of quality control, mismanagement of funds (allowing Ron Howard to reshoot like 80% of solo despite knowing the release date was gonna change). And was everything that comes with the films 100% Kennedy's fault? No very likely not. But when you're a manager/head of something you take the wins and the Ls. Star Wars, and I reiterate isn't in a bad place, but it should be in way better shape. She's had enough chances. She should go. You can't just say: "Well it could be worse" or "The next person could be worse" as a reason to keep someone who isn't bringing it like they should

 

[TheVileOne]

Again, who do you expect us all to say? I don't get this weirdo point you're trying to make in a somewhat condescending way. In fact all of the points you've made about Kennedy potential being fired hold no water at all. I'm actually not sure if you're not just saying this stuff for the sake of arguing and don't actually believe what you're saying

-"She has a hard job" So do a lot of people, not even just in Hollywood. Should we just not criticize other people because of this?
-Who should replace her?" How should we know? We aren't in Hollywood. We're nerds on the internet. Of course people are only going to name the limited amount of names they know.
-Making a movie a year was too much. How? As someone pointed out most of Disney subsidiaries/studios are able to pump out at least 1 film a year that is either commercially successful, a hit with critics, or both. So why for Star Wars is it too much? If they were saying make an Episode a year I'd get that. And it's not like SW is a concept that's so small that the well can just run dry if you do a movie a year. BSW is so vast and they have all these characters, storylines, and concepts that they can explore. And that's not even including any of the old Expanded Universe stuff that they can recanonize if they want to.

As I said in another post, SW isn't in a terrible place. But it had all the parts that it should be in a way better position.
Star Wars shouldn't be at a place where:
-They have to move a movie ideas from a theatrical release to a streaming release because they're worried about the box office
-Multiple directors have been fired or heavily overruled after or near the end of filming
-Anyone should be worrying about the latest movie underperforming at the box office
-Some potential directors are afraid to make a SW movie due to creative clashes. Remember what Taika Wahtiti said?
-Toy sales being down. Arguably due to the reception of some of the movies. Sales are down even considering the general downward trend of toys.
-Fans and movie goers are this divided over the movies. (And please don't come with that "Well SW fans are fickle" "SW fans are this" because that's just nonsense. Plus there are a good amount of SW related media post 2014 that have gotten good to great reviews)

This all boils down to mismanagement. Mismanagement of creative vision, mismanagement of hiring process, mismanagement of quality control, mismanagement of funds (allowing Ron Howard to reshoot like 80% of solo despite knowing the release date was gonna change). And was everything that comes with the films 100% Kennedy's fault? No very likely not. But when you're a manager/head of something you take the wins and the Ls. Star Wars, and I reiterate isn't in a bad place, but it should be in way better shape. She's had enough chances. She should go. You can't just say: "Well it could be worse" or "The next person could be worse" as a reason to keep someone who isn't bringing it like they should

I think the only realistic choice right now is Kathleen Kennedy until she grooms her replacement.

 

[MadVillainy]

I think the only realistic choice right now is Kathleen Kennedy until she grooms her replacement.

You don't have the person whose methods are driving down the business train the next person...

 

[Limonade]

You know--with first the DCEU and now SW. It's very apparent that if you don't have an inspiring story first and a solid trajectory for these movies... maybe it's not a good idea to propose releasing them every 1-2 years.

 

[jmc]

Who on earth would even want to take on the role as the head of Lucasfilm after this? Even if Kennedy is let go or simply sits out the remaining time left in her contract, I can't see anybody jumping at the chance to run Star Wars, not in its current state.

 

[Frodo]

Truthfully, I feel the issue is more about a creative vision and a creative head as opposed to being the head of Lucasfilm. At the end of the day Iger may end up keeping her as the head of Lucasfilm but will strip away alot of the creative say so which is where they keep running into issues with filmmakers.

The issues she seems to clash over filmmakers with seems to be nearly exclusively over creative control and vision which I'm skeptical is her strong suit with regards to SW.


I can't really speak to her judgement as to how Lucasfilm is run and her other duties outside of being a producer. Its clear though that she isn't a visionary in the vein of Lucas or someone like a Feige who knows the stuff well in addition to having the ability to plot out a course. She's alot more like the former Disney head Michael Eisner who was successful and could run the corporation but wasn't a creator or innovator like Walt Disney was.

So if you have someone who isn't all that steeped in the lore approving and disapproving of creative decisions by filmmakers/writers who want to do their own thing and put their own spins on SW, you're gonna get the conflicts we've gotten.

You kinda have the blind leading the blind.

 

[Frodo]

Not to say SW fans or fans in general aren’t overreactive babies. But in both of these instances there is some merit to what they’re saying. The first two prequels are some of the worst movies I’ve ever seen and while I’ve actually enjoyed the newer movies for the most part there’s a management issue that has led to diminishing returns and audience ambivalence.

This isn’t a nail in the coffin for the franchise by any stretch but they are at a turning point.

Yeah I would agree.

Of course their are fans who overreact . The overreact to casting, changes from source material, trailers etc. Fanboys are a hard to please bunch, no question.

At the end of the day though, if the studio see's the reactions are mixed to negative from the GA , they're going to respond regardless of how many fans do or don't want things to change.

At this point , whether fanboys are going overboard is moot, since Iger and Kennedy are slowing things down regardless, whether we like it or not.

As long as they(Disney/Lucasfilm) feel there's a problem, they're going to try to fix it. That may not please some fans ,but that's what's going to happen.

There's gonna be a change. That's inevitable, and that's not really debatable at this point.

The question is what changes they make and how they move forward.

 

[Zarex]

Give the franchise to Feige. If you are only going to do a SW film once every 2 years it shouldn't be too much of an extra work load.

I thought that was the direction Disney was heading toward. But Feige just recently took over Marvel Entertainment and has a large slate of TV shows to oversee along with a full film slate. I don't see Feige being the answer.

As we've seen, folks with the ability to successfully manage an interconnected cinematic fantasy universe are extremely rare. Maybe Filoni, if he's willing to add managerial duties as Docter and Lee did at Pixar and WDA, respectively. Perhaps one of Feige's lieutenants are ready to take over Star Wars. But there has to be a replacement. I don't think the Mouse can be confident launching the next series of SW films with Kennedy running the show.

 

[jmc]

From stuff I've read she hasn't exactly got control over the everyday running of Lucasfilm in general. Like, what happened with this much vaunted Story Group? What, of anything of worth, did this group of people actually do to help with this sequel trilogy? It appears given who directed Episodes 7,8 and 9, this Story Group did sweet **** all. So what was the point of hiring these people if their contribution was completely meaningless?

The other thing to note, and this may cause some level of push back, is Kennedy seemed determined to push for a more female driven franchise under the misguided idea this would somehow bring more women in. And I do think that desire lead to her allowing Rey to go unchallenged throughout the series. TLJ had the perfect opportunity to end with Rey turning to the Dark Side when Kylo Ren offered to train her. Any half decent creative person would have seen the potential in leaving the audience with the cliffhanger, but I'm willing to bet Kennedy never thought about that because it would have meant the heroine turning evil, and I'm doubtful she would have been ok with that. Whether Lucasfilm like it or not their audience is overwhelming male, and they don't want to see the female character be given a free pass whilst the male heroes in the series have had to struggle harder. That misjudgement also falls into Kennedy's hands.

 

[writer0327]

From stuff I've read she hasn't exactly got control over the everyday running of Lucasfilm in general. Like, what happened with this much vaunted Story Group? What, of anything of worth, did this group of people actually do to help with this sequel trilogy? It appears given who directed Episodes 7,8 and 9, this Story Group did sweet **** all. So what was the point of hiring these people if they contribution was completely meaningless?

The other thing to note, and this may cause some level of push back, is Kennedy seemed determined to push for a more female driven franchise under the misguided idea this would somehow bring more women in. And I do think that desire lead to her allowing Rey to go unchallenged throughout the series. TLJ had the perfect opportunity to end with Rey turning to the Dark Side when Kylo Ren offered to train her. Any half decent creative person would have seen the potential in leaving the audience with the cliffhanger, but I'm willing to bet Kennedy never thought about that because it would have meant the heroine turning evil, and I'm doubtful she would have been ok with that. Whether Lucasfilm like it or not their audience is overwhelming male, and they don't want to see the female character be given a free pass whilst the male heroes in the series have had to struggle harder. That misjudgement also falls into Kennedy's hands.

My understanding is the Story Group's main purpose is as keepers of the canon. So they determine what writers, directors, creators, etc., are allowed to introduce, explain the limitations of whatever they are writing about, basically they are allowed to use and get away with. So if some writer said "Hey I think I want to make all Ewoks force-sensitive..." he has to run that past the Story Group, who will (hopefully) shut that BS down right away.

As far as KK and the female agenda push, I don't know if that's the case or not, but what I do know is Rey going dark would have been WAAAAY more interesting than what they ended up doing.

 

[jmc]

Absolutely. You would have had a perfect set up for film 3. Rey abandoning the Resistance and Luke for the false promise offered by Kylo Ren. 3 film sees her realise the mistake she's made and try and make amends for that betrayal. Jesus christ, what a set up that would have been.

 

[Consona]

everyone worships Feige

No.

 

[Stark Bauer]

OK if she's fired, who replaces her? I think this is a valid question. Fans who hated the sequels or Last Jedi want validation with her getting fired. But what if she gets replaced by someone even worse? I don't want a Tom Rothman situation here.

actually it will be super easy barely an inconvenience - Jon Favreau and/or Dave Filoni. The Mandalorian has singlehandedly made Star Wars Great Again.

 

[Stark Bauer]

Of course it isn’t an easy job and of course she probably had the best intentions. Doesn’t really change where we’re at.

Not saying Star Wars is in a state of disaster, but Solo bombed and now RoS is going to underperform pretty significantly. That’s a clear sign that the general audience just isn’t super engaged with these new movies and that is ultimately on her.

Any franchise Or business would be in a state of disaster if they are no longer profitable but rather are financial liabilities. Disney is going to LOSE money because of ROS. Look at the X Men franchise. I am surprised she still has a job after the subpar and negative box office results of TLJ and Solo.

 

[TheVileOne]

actually it will be super easy barely an inconvenience - Jon Favreau and/or Dave Filoni. The Mandalorian has singlehandedly made Star Wars Great Again.

Sounds good in theory but what makes anyone think that either guy wants the job? Those guys are creative types. They might not want to be president of the studio. Not to mention they are friends with Kennedy and have worked with her probably for years at this point and would not want to replace her.

 

[TheVileOne]

Any franchise Or business would be in a state of disaster if they are no longer profitable but rather are financial liabilities. Disney is going to LOSE money because of ROS. Look at the X Men franchise. I am surprised she still has a job after the subpar and negative box office results of TLJ and Solo.

How are they going to lose money if Rise of Skywalker surpasses another $1 billion?

 

[ironman_rick]

This is my take.....i am not part of any fandom menance. Just a normal fan who grew up on the OGs.

1)JJA does TFA.
2)RJ seems to want to take his TLJ in another route and he does it.
3)JJA comes back to deconstruct RJ's take and the final product is messy (though i liked it more than TLJ).

Whats the constant here ? Its Kat Kennedy. She was OK with 1. She was apparently OK with 2 as RJ made those changes and released his version. And somehow she is OK with the revisions that JJA made on this movie.

Its a mess. A rookie producer would have done a better job. There was just no vision for these sequels under KK.

As far as i am concern JJA and RJ are not to be blamed. Directors will always do things their way if there is no guidance given to them.

 

[souloffire]

actually it will be super easy barely an inconvenience - Jon Favreau and/or Dave Filoni. The Mandalorian has singlehandedly made Star Wars Great Again.

The Mandalorian is tight!!!