I kinda feel bad for Brett Ratner

[Iphus04]

Context: I don't have the negativatity towards Brett that quite a lot of people seem to have; he's a solid, competant director who's made some good movies. Bottom line - he's exactly the sort of person you want to have making a superhero movie.

The fact that X-Men 3 was at best an overcooked muddle and at worst a downright stinker should not be laid at his doorstep.

As much as I hate to agree with Harry Knowles, he has a real point in his review - this does feel like three good movies jammed together and chopped right back. There's a great movie in here about a cure for mutation, a great movie about the Phoenix, and a great movie about Magneto's last stand rolled into here. The problem was that Brett simply couldn't do them justice, and that's not a slurr on him. I wouldn't want to be parachuted in to direct a movie in a ridiculously short amount of time with virtually no prep time and no time to work on the script.

In short - I think Brett could have made a great X-Men movie. I respect the fact that his style was pretty much the same as Bryan Singers, he gave the movies a real context.

As a professional script editor, I was cringing right the way through that movie. It fell into the trap too many screenplays do - that of too many characters not having enough to do. Joss Whedon had the right idea - instead of throwing as many characters into the thing as they could, what you need to do is pare it down, chose a small team of integral characters and focus on what makes those characters so loved. And then really mess with them.

That said, I can't even really find it in my heart to blame the writers, given the demands placed upon them by the studio. They probably did the best that could given the demands they had to work with.

Who's to blame for X-Men 3? 20th Century Fox. By forcing the hands of everyone involved, wanting this movie made in a rush to beat Bryan's Superman movie into cinemas across the world, they ended up with something half-baked.

And the worst part of the thing is that Brett Ratner, who did the best job he could with what he had to work with, will probably be the one to get roasted by the 'fans' for this. And that's just plain not fair.

 

[FieryBalrog]

I agree, but Ratner takes some of the blame. The man doesnt have a creative vision he's willing to defend. He's not Peter Jackson or even Sam Raimi. Hes a yes-man.

 

[Spider-X]

Context: I don't have the negativatity towards Brett that quite a lot of people seem to have; he's a solid, competant director who's made some good movies. Bottom line - he's exactly the sort of person you want to have making a superhero movie.

The fact that X-Men 3 was at best an overcooked muddle and at worst a downright stinker should not be laid at his doorstep.

As much as I hate to agree with Harry Knowles, he has a real point in his review - this does feel like three good movies jammed together and chopped right back. There's a great movie in here about a cure for mutation, a great movie about the Phoenix, and a great movie about Magneto's last stand rolled into here. The problem was that Brett simply couldn't do them justice, and that's not a slurr on him. I wouldn't want to be parachuted in to direct a movie in a ridiculously short amount of time with virtually no prep time and no time to work on the script.

In short - I think Brett could have made a great X-Men movie. I respect the fact that his style was pretty much the same as Bryan Singers, he gave the movies a real context.

As a professional script editor, I was cringing right the way through that movie. It fell into the trap too many screenplays do - that of too many characters not having enough to do. Joss Whedon had the right idea - instead of throwing as many characters into the thing as they could, what you need to do is pare it down, chose a small team of integral characters and focus on what makes those characters so loved. And then really mess with them.

That said, I can't even really find it in my heart to blame the writers, given the demands placed upon them by the studio. They probably did the best that could given the demands they had to work with.

Who's to blame for X-Men 3? 20th Century Fox. By forcing the hands of everyone involved, wanting this movie made in a rush to beat Bryan's Superman movie into cinemas across the world, they ended up with something half-baked.

And the worst part of the thing is that Brett Ratner, who did the best job he could with what he had to work with, will probably be the one to get roasted by the 'fans' for this. And that's just plain not fair.

you completely beat me to making this thread...i 100% agree with you.

we're lucky we got a movie this well done...by all means due to the development hell it has no right to be as good as it is.

I enjoyed the hell out of it...sure the deaths and what not...but asides from Cyclops...the other deaths fit well with the story.

I'd like to say thanks to Brett Ratner for doing as well as he did with what he was handed.

 

[taintedFB]

The studio isn't responsible for the bad dialogue and corny speeches and one-liners. According to the writers, no length was dictated to them, their script simply came in that short and just poor.

I think Ratner did a great job and with a better screenplay this movie could have been phenomenal. It really showed the potential of the franchise, but also showed its inability to meet that potential.

 

[Flame on!]

he's a solid, competant director who's made some good movies. Bottom line - he's exactly the sort of person you want to have making a superhero movie.

Whilst I agree with the overall sentiment, this is a massive error.

 

[DonnyLebeau]

Ratner dropped the ball, plain and simple.

He didn't develop the characters well, didn't stay on pace to the previous films or even use the comics as a reference.

Just made an action flick with a lousy ending...

 

[Spider-X]

Ratner dropped the ball, plain and simple.

He didn't develop the characters well, didn't stay on pace to the previous films or even use the comics as a reference.

Just made an action flick with a lousy ending...

didn't even use the comics as a reference?!?!? you think Singer did? he didn't even really like X-men before he made the first movie...there were waaaaay more comic book references in X3 than in the previous 2 combined.

 

[Flame on!]

didn't even use the comics as a reference?!?!? you think Singer did? he didn't even really like X-men before he made the first movie...there were waaaaay more comic book references in X3 than in the previous 2 combined.

Because comic book references define how good a film is...

 

[DonnyLebeau]

didn't even use the comics as a reference?!?!? you think Singer did? he didn't even really like X-men before he made the first movie...there were waaaaay more comic book references in X3 than in the previous 2 combined.

However, Singer did form a plausible story and had continuity in the first 2 films.

The fastball special was the only REAL comic book reference and like Ratner's other attempts it was all done for a "good action shot"

 

[Spider-X]

Because comic book references define how good a film is...

did i ever say that it did

 

[Spider-X]

However, Singer did form a plausible story and had continuity in the first 2 films.

The fastball special was the only REAL comic book reference and like Ratner's other attempts it was all done for a "good action shot"

how about

Beast: "oh my stars and garders"

or maybe Iceman Icing up...or Pyro haveing flame throwers...the list goes on...i just can't think of any others right now.

 

[pyromaniac]

I agree, but Ratner takes some of the blame. The man doesnt have a creative vision he's willing to defend. He's not Peter Jackson or even Sam Raimi. Hes a yes-man.

If they brought anyone else in considering the circumstances, they would have been the 'yes-men' too.

Ratner just happened to be available.

Considering overall however - the bigger picture is, and always will be, the 20th Century Fox.

They had wanted to sabotage the franchise from the start, and misused Singer's allotment of time and resources.

It doesn't exactly invoke trust when a corporation like Fox writes it off as a failed investment from the start. What a miracle when Xmen suddenly changed minds...

X2 was the only anomaly where it had more time and budget but still...

 

[thev01]

I Agree that Ratner is a solid and competent director. The problem is he just isn't a Great director. He puts more emphasis on pacing over charater development. It gave the movie a rushed feel to it that made it feel incomplete. I said it over a dozen times in ths forum "X3 was just 10-20 minutes to short from greatness".

 

[DonnyLebeau]

how about

Beast: "oh my stars and garders"

or maybe Iceman Icing up...or Pyro haveing flame throwers...the list goes on...i just can't think of any others right now.

And all of those fall under the "good action shots"

He could have used some family relationship references ie: Juggy and Chuck or had Angel and Mystique be deceived into slavery with "the cure"

Something more plausible then... there's a "cure" for mutancy, 3 X-men are dead, 1 is in the white house and everyone is happy again!

 

[Spider-X]

And all of those fall under the "good action shots"

He could have used some family relationship references ie: Juggy and Chuck or had Angel and Mystique be deceived into slavery with "the cure"

Something more plausible then... there's a "cure" for mutancy, 3 X-men are dead, 1 is in the white house and everyone is happy again!

sure...there could be endless ties to the comics like that...but you didn't get that much from X1 or X2 either.

my main point is that "not even enough comic book references" is a poor attempt at downplaying this movie.

 

[invincible mann]

his movie is going to make at least 100 million in 5 days
i dont feel sorry for him at all

 

[ZombieONE]

hes the ratman

 

[Spider-X]

his movie is going to make at least 100 million in 5 days
i dont feel sorry for him at all

just because the movie is gonna make alot doesn't mean that he couldn't have done better given better resources.

 

[stryfe]

I dont feel sorry for him at all. The commercial success of this film with open doors for him quite like it did for singer. Then we get to flame even ****tier movies that he makes that dont involve awsome characters from a comic book.

 

[Mike059jig]

Why should I feel sorry for a yes-man...he should of known what was coming...

 

[Spider-X]

i'm starting to love all these blanket statements. i believe people are just starting to love the smell of their own farts around here.

 

[GhostPoet]

Context: I don't have the negativatity towards Brett that quite a lot of people seem to have; he's a solid, competant director who's made some good movies. Bottom line - he's exactly the sort of person you want to have making a superhero movie.

The fact that X-Men 3 was at best an overcooked muddle and at worst a downright stinker should not be laid at his doorstep.

As much as I hate to agree with Harry Knowles, he has a real point in his review - this does feel like three good movies jammed together and chopped right back. There's a great movie in here about a cure for mutation, a great movie about the Phoenix, and a great movie about Magneto's last stand rolled into here. The problem was that Brett simply couldn't do them justice, and that's not a slurr on him. I wouldn't want to be parachuted in to direct a movie in a ridiculously short amount of time with virtually no prep time and no time to work on the script.

In short - I think Brett could have made a great X-Men movie. I respect the fact that his style was pretty much the same as Bryan Singers, he gave the movies a real context.

As a professional script editor, I was cringing right the way through that movie. It fell into the trap too many screenplays do - that of too many characters not having enough to do. Joss Whedon had the right idea - instead of throwing as many characters into the thing as they could, what you need to do is pare it down, chose a small team of integral characters and focus on what makes those characters so loved. And then really mess with them.

That said, I can't even really find it in my heart to blame the writers, given the demands placed upon them by the studio. They probably did the best that could given the demands they had to work with.

Who's to blame for X-Men 3? 20th Century Fox. By forcing the hands of everyone involved, wanting this movie made in a rush to beat Bryan's Superman movie into cinemas across the world, they ended up with something half-baked.

And the worst part of the thing is that Brett Ratner, who did the best job he could with what he had to work with, will probably be the one to get roasted by the 'fans' for this. And that's just plain not fair.

What the heck are you talking about dude? What blame for X3? It was freakin awesome. EXACTLY what I was wanting...a big battle, X-men kicking butt like never before and a lot of emotional depth. I got sucked in right away.

 

[Spider-X]

i enjoyed the hell out of this movie too but i don't think it's as good as it could have been...i just think given more time they could have done better.

but i still loved it...i'm seeing it again on Saturday

 

[TheVileOne]

Singer and his crew chose QUALITY OVER QUANTITY!

All you guys talk about all the **** and characters in this, and it did NOT pay off.

Why? Because they tried to cram it all into a 96 minute running time! WTF!

Pirates of the Carribbean was 2 hours 25 minutes, and it made $305 million.

Return of the King was 3 hours 20 minutes and made like $377 million.

Fox does NOT understand anything.

 

[taintedFB]

What do you people believe a director's job is in movies?

The director is not responsible for character development, dialogue, or missing scenes....

They're called writers and they are responsible for all of these problems. They wrote a corny action movie and Brett did a great job directing it. It's not his fault he was given crap to work with just weeks before shooting...

And length is not so much the issue as the use of time. Did we really need to see the President and Trask all those times? Did we need to see the military gearing up? Did we need to see Juggs asking Magneto how to get to Alcatraz, or Xavier handing the school to Storm, before Scott is even dead?

It's all in the writing and, I'm sorry, cheesy dialogue. Scott's premature and unmourned death, all writers! I think if Ratner had been given a good script like X2's he would have made the perfect X-Men movie.