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Interesting constitution rights dillema

Yea you are right. I do agree.

I just don't want to see skill at a certain job sacrificed just to please the PC brigade. You have to understand that right?

I'd agree.....we can make sure that all have a fair shake, but we also need to find the best qualified person, whatever color or sex they may be....in some cases a black police officer has a tougher hill to climb due to internal racism and being seen as a "sellout" or an "Uncle Tom" by the communities he is trying to help....that aspect can discourage some
 
When the suspect is black, how is it stupid to actually look for black men who fits the description? Is it stupid to look for a white man who fits a given description? Or an Asian woman who fits a description?

I'm saying the complete opposite of that. I agree with you. I was saying that the law that treats people differently is stupid. If you're looking for a black man, well lol, then you're looking for a black man.

And you notice that the description in the example wasn't a black man. It was a black man, driving a certain type of vehicle, in a certain location. Had the cops pulled over a black guy in a completely different type of car, then yeah, that would be crap. Because that's not who they're supposed to be looking for.
I agree with this too.

If the description was a white man driving a certain type of vehicle, then the cops better be pulling over any white guys in that area driving that type of car. And pulling over any white males in other types of cars would be just as wrong.
Yes.


The thing is, if race is part of the description, then how can it be racial profiling to look for suspects of that race that match the description, regardless of what the race is? White, black, Asian, whatever, if someone matches the description, then they match the description.
Exactly. I would think that people of a certain minority would relish being treated the same, having the same laws applied to them that cover the rest of society. Surely having different rules for minorities is more of a racist comment than what you have described in your post.
 
Yea you are right. I do agree.

I just don't want to see skill at a certain job sacrificed just to please the PC brigade. You have to understand that right?

Of course and I agree. Unfortunately it's an odd give and take that needs to be played to keep some sembalance of a balance. I want an effective police force but to be the most effective it would have certian requirements that need to be met.

Personally I think the ways law enforcement officers are obtained is insane. Personality and judgement should be the highest importance for an effective officer, but they're barely screened psychologically. I mean you have a job tailor made for bullies or people of that mindset and the screening process is to see which psycho can shoot the best?
 
Racial profiling, the way I've seen most people argue against it, isn't actually a bad thing.

Here's an example:
A man robs a house. He's described as a black man, mid-20's, driving a certain make and model of car.

In the same area, the police see a black man, mid-20's, driving the same make and model of car. It's not the robber, but the cops can't ignore him because he actually does fit the description provided. But somehow this is racial profiling because they stopped a black man. As if the cops would have a reason to pull over a white, or asian, or hispanic man, or a woman, even though that wasn't the description given.

Funny thing is, had the description been a white man, mid-20's, driving a certain make and model of car, no argument of profiling would be made for pulling over an innocent white guy in the same model car. But if they're a minority, that's sometimes the first thing claimed.



Now, in the Muslims case, randomly searching all Muslims because the current terrorist threat is from Muslims, is wrong. It's not the same thing as looking for a Muslim man for a specific crime in an area like the example above. This is randomly searching a person only because they are Muslim. The police had no reason to suspect the person of anything than being of a certain religion/race.


it's very easy to go from your first case about the blacks to your second case about the muslims.

if you ask most blacks, they would say they were in the second and they were simply just stopped and searched under no real motivation rather than a hunch, not that it was based on aprehending a suspect on the loose matching their description.
 
I'd agree.....we can make sure that all have a fair shake, but we also need to find the best qualified person, whatever color or sex they may be....in some cases a black police officer has a tougher hill to climb due to internal racism and being seen as a "sellout" or an "Uncle Tom" by the communities he is trying to help....that aspect can discourage some

Yea I understand that as well. It's bang out of order. Hopefully strides will continue to be taken to eradicate that mentality.

Of course and I agree. Unfortunately it's an odd give and take that needs to be played to keep some sembalance of a balance. I want an effective police force but to be the most effective it would have certian requirements that need to be met.

Personally I think the ways law enforcement officers are obtained is insane. Personality and judgement should be the highest importance for an effective officer, but they're barely screened psychologically. I mean you have a job tailor made for bullies or people of that mindset and the screening process is to see which psycho can shoot the best?

Oh yea of course. I bet you'll find that some police were bullied at school or something like that, but now they are in a position of power they will take advantage of it and bully others. Even on a subconscious level that happens I would wager.
 
When the suspect is black, how is it stupid to actually look for black men who fits the description? Is it stupid to look for a white man who fits a given description? Or an Asian woman who fits a description?

And you notice that the description in the example wasn't a black man. It was a black man, driving a certain type of vehicle, in a certain location. Had the cops pulled over a black guy in a completely different type of car, then yeah, that would be crap. Because that's not who they're supposed to be looking for.

If the description was a white man driving a certain type of vehicle, then the cops better be pulling over any white guys in that area driving that type of car. And pulling over any white males in other types of cars would be just as wrong.

The thing is, if race is part of the description, then how can it be racial profiling to look for suspects of that race that match the description, regardless of what the race is? White, black, Asian, whatever, if someone matches the description, then they match the description.

I agree if you have identified a specific suspect then you look for someone that looks like them. But that's not profiling that's being a cop. Profiling is assuming people of one race have a propensity for some form of crime based on previous acts by other members of their race. Now here's the rub, you can't profile a religion. Muslims come in all shapes, sizes and nationalities. How is that not obvious to everyone? So you're not profiling muslims cause that could be anyone on the plane, you're racial discriminating against anyone that looks arabic.

I'd say the reason a lot of black people think their being pulled over just cause their black is because it wasn't that long ago that if a cop had a crime they'd just nail a random black guy and go about their day. The only way to destroy a history of mistrust is to establish a new history and that takes time and care.
 
I think we are getting off topic here.....Warrants, technicalities, and all that
 
freedom isn't free, it costs a buck o' five and every once and a while criminals get off. It sucks but it's worlds better than the alternative.
 
Yea let's get back to warrants...

Errr...I think i've said all i can say on the original posters question :hehe:
 
Well at least he doesn't do it nekkid.
 

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